Re: parmalee's warning for inciting violence

Discussion in 'Site Feedback' started by James R, Jan 7, 2021.

  1. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Oh, look, it's another disgruntled poster crawling out of the woodwork to jump on the parmalee bandwagon! How suprising and delightful!

    You shouldn't tell lies.

    Didn't your Mom teach you not to tell lies?

    Be aware that if you keep telling lies, there might be consequences.

    If you want to hurl accusations, you'd better be ready with the evidence to support them. You're not bringing it, so far. You'll need to do much much better if this isn't just a drive-by shooting, and you intend to pursue this line.

    Stop being a cry baby. You're supposed to be an adult. Grow up.

    Did you report the offending post? Who was this person? Why don't you link the offending post?

    Don't tell lies. Really, just stop.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2021
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  3. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    parmalee:

    At this point, I'm not entirely sure why I'm still bothering with you. Your complaint about my moderations has now been covered in more detail than should ever have been necessary, so I'm going to stop talking about that now. But you have made some other comments.

    I see that pjdude1219 - a formerly banned serial offender - has offered to hitch his wagon to yours. I'd be careful if I was you about taking him up on his offer. When you lay down with pigs, all you get is dirty, as they say.
    You're worried that I'm not sufficiently deferrent towards you and your concerns, given how deferrent you have been towards me and all? Boo hoo, parmalee.

    For starters, this should never have been an issue. But given that you decided to make it one, there are several different ways you could have approached it. You chose this way. You apparently don't know when to stop, either, a bit like pjdude.

    You are talking, I assume, about my attitude towards posters who have no respect for their readers, for science, or for the truth. Tell me why I should respect such people, once they have a proven track record of mendacity?

    Why are you sad about them?

    Do you generally have problems working people out - in your "real life", I mean? I ask only because there seems to be some kind of disconnect with you.

    We did have a reasonable discussion.

    I understood your perspective six months ago.

    Then stop. Why do you people find it so hard to just let things go? Why not act like an adult and take some responsibility for your own actions, rather than looking for somebody else to blame all the time?
     
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  5. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    For the same reason it is OK for a prosecutor or judge to repeat what a slanderer said, and for the same reason that a police officer is not normally charged with assault with a deadly weapon when they have to shoot a suspect.

    Because the process of an authority prosecuting an infraction is not subject to the same restrictions as actually committing the infraction.
     
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  7. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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  8. Bells Staff Member

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    Mod Note

    I have kept out of this, but this is now getting out of hand.. It seems everyone with an axe to grind is making an appearance. So I'd like to note a few things.. Not because I have an axe to grind, but because someone has to put a stop to whatever it is that is happening here.

    Firstly Parmalee..


    The full quote from your comment - unedited from the one linked above:

    A note to Americans:

    Viruses don't wait for elections.

    A couple of weeks back, Dr. Fauci, being cautiously optimistic and conservative which is appropriate, I guess?, suggested that we will likely be seeing 100,000 new cases a day sometime soon. Ha! We're at like 70 or 80 thousands new cases a day already. And half the country won't even wear a freakin' mask, and half of the states' governors (the Republican ones, that is) are doing very little (or nothing) to address this and other problems. And the federal government? We don't have one. Rather, we've got a bunch of psychopathic, fascist fuckwits who are doing everything in their power to fuck over their constituents, in order to line their coffers and preserve their obscene wealth.

    I'm fairly certain that the U.S. Constitution, somewhere in the Bill of Rights methinks, advises for such circumstances--something about altering and abolishing a government that becomes destructive of it's desired ends, i.e., the protection of the citizens' rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

    I ain't recommending anything, I'm just saying that I think it's well within yours, mine, anyone's rights to forcibly remove, 'take out' (again, Trump talks about 'taking out' U.S. citizens all the time, so...) or just plain put a bullet into the heads of Trump, de Santis, or any one of these mass murderous fucks. In fact, I think it might actually be our duty to do such, not sure on that part
    .​


    I understand you have said that you have not actually said what you have been accused of saying?

    I was not involved in the original discussion back in the middle of last year when you received a 20 point infraction for the post that is indented above and the moderated format can be found here:
    http://sciforums.com/threads/corona-virus-2019-ncov.162778/page-96#post-3642877

    So let's break down a few things about the post in question..

    You start it off as a note to Americans - presumably to other Americans posting on or reading this website.

    You address the handling of the virus by the Trump administration and simply how much they have failed, resulting in hundreds of thousands of lives lost.

    Your next paragraph makes a comment about the US Constitution and how you believe the Bill of Rights has an amendment for how to handle such a circumstance as what the US faced in the last 12 months.. The desire to end the sitting Government, but you seemed unsure.

    Then came the problematic part of your post.

    You start off by saying that you do not recommend anything, but you then posit that it is within the rights of yourself, others and anyone's rights (presumably the Americans you made the note to?), to use force to remove said Government.. You then say that you think it's your duty to kill them, but you just aren't too sure on that part.

    That is how it read. Literally.

    You say you aren't recommending it, but perhaps it's simply your (collective American) duty to murder the President and others within his administration and Government involved in how COVID is being handled..

    Let me put it to you this way.

    If Trump had gotten up on that podium during that rally and said he did not recommend it, but perhaps it is "our duty" to march on the Capitol and they marched on the Capitol, would he have incited the crowd to march on the Capitol and riot?

    If anyone says that it's "our duty" to act, it's in invitation, a reminder of what is expected of others, to act.

    That is inciting violence.

    Your intention (which you say was not to incite) do not actually match the words you typed out back in July of last year.

    Especially when that "duty" comment comes after telling readers that it's within your collective rights to "take out" or forcibly remove, and then a not so subtle reminder of how Trump talks about taking out US citizens all the time.. "or just plain put a bullet into the heads of Trump, de Santis, or any one of these mass murderous fucks."

    Perhaps you don't realise how you came across. But that is how you came across.

    You are on a public forum, where everyone can read your words, members and non-members alike. Your post would show up in a Google search if people searched for certain key words. Legally, we are responsible for for what appears here and what is allowed to remain on this website.

    You are correct when you said you are not a public figure. But that isn't the point. Your notoriety, fame, etc, does not matter. You directed a comment to your fellow Americans that posited whether it was your collective duty to act against the sitting Government by putting a bullet in their heads.. That is how that comment reads. And you did it on a public forum that anyone and everyone can read and have access to. It only takes one person..

    James gave you 20 points. Had I seen your comment first, you'd have gotten more and I would have deleted the entire post. Your comment was not just inciting violence. It was a call, a reminder, of what you feel the duty of Americans should be doing and then followed it up with that bullets into the heads comment and named names.

    You are one of my favourite posters on this site Parmalee. I always enjoy reading your posts. But you are wrong in what you said back then and while you say it was never your intention, your words that you post is all we can see.. We cannot read your mind.

    To give you an answer, yes, you do have the ability to remove the Government or to take them out. It's called an election. It is not, in any way, shape or form, the ability, permission or "duty" to murder them, regardless of what they have done or are doing. Congress and others have other means, such as Article 25 or impeachment. You, as a citizen, have the option of an election.



    Tell that to Parler, who just saw their entire platform banned and rejected because of what "private citizens" were saying on their website and because the administrators and moderators of Parler allowed it to remain on their website. When Amazon, etc, contacted the owners of Parler about the content they allowed unmoderated, they weren't posting images of what the famous people, the President, etc were saying. It was the commentary of the "private citizens" that was the issue. Stuff like this:

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    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/johnpaczkowski/amazon-parler-aws

    The reason they are now going offline and no one will touch them or allow them to use their web services, is because they allowed this kind of thing to remain on their website from "private citizens".. In other words, you don't get special privilege or protection to post stuff of this nature because you are a private citizen.
     
    Xelasnave.1947 likes this.
  9. Bells Staff Member

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    Tiassa
    This ^^^

    Is really not helpful.


    Neither is this.

    It happened what? 6 months ago?

    A 20 point infraction was issued at the time (back in July last year) and if you or I had handed out that infraction, we'd probably be trying to figure out what was going on as well in a similar fashion.

    To wit, this comment out of the blue, in a completely different thread on a completely different topic and subject matter:



    Was somehow connected....?

    Not going to lie, with fresh eyes of mine, when I went back and tried to backtrack what the hell was going on, saw me going 'huh?' when I read that comment.

    And we both know that if that was aimed at us, our response would probably have been along the same lines as James' was.


    Quantum Quack:
    This is not helpful and instead was aimed at flaming the issue.

    pjdude:
    This is not helpful and instead was aimed at flaming the issue.

    If you have an issue with how an issue was handled by moderation, please PM a moderator with links, etc and have it reviewed.
     
  10. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    don't really give a shit about helping the issue. james shouldn't be lying about what he is and is not ok with when he damn well knows he is lying his ass off.

    and i did all that and nothing was done probably because the person responsible for reviewing was james. because james felt my life is ok to be threatened. im sorry you don't like him being called out on his petty bullshit but his differing standards and rules for different people is not ok.
     
  11. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    16,367
    • Do not flame other members. Accusations of lying should, at the very least, be supported by relevant evidence.
    im not


    didn't yours


    showing your true colors i see


    thats your response to anyone who dares criticize you personal attacks


    yes, and i specifically asked why nothing was done about to tiassa afterwords?
    someone who is no longer here.

    im not. you just don't like the fact your being called on your lies. its from years ago but if you are that desperate for everyone to know you are a liar i can try and find it.




    this is what was said

    in response to this a mere comment of how the second amendment doesn't actually provide for an individual right to gun ownership. you've banned people for far less direct threats. i know it wasn't a big deal to you but i spent the rest of the day going over my internet history to make sure nothing i posted on here could let someone find me
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2021
  12. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Moderator note: pjdude1219 has been warned for flaming another member.

    Members are reminded that if they are going to accuse another member of telling lies, such accusations should be supported by appropriate evidence, at a minimum.
     
  13. Bells Staff Member

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    24,030
    Personally, I have no idea what you are talking about.
    I can't speak for my colleagues, but I for one do not know who you are talking about.

    Who threatened you? Being vague about it is not helpful and this is completely off topic. You say it's from years ago.. And we are somehow supposed to know or remember?

    Please do.
     
  14. Bells Staff Member

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    24,030
    Ah.

    I went back and searched and that was the only one I found that you accused someone of threatening to kill you. But you had claimed that the person in question no longer posts here.

    Sculptor does post here.

    So perhaps you might understand our confusion.

    So, let's go back to what you said was a threat on your life? From 2014...

    You responded to iceaura:
    sculptor responds to you:
    Your response to sculptor:
    sculptor then responds to you:
    You respond and say that this was a threat:
    Sculptor responds to your comment that this was deemed a threat:
    Your response:
    Sculptor responds:
    You respond:
    He then decides to ignore you by the looks of it..

    Some 15 days and several posts later, you again try to get him to respond after he persistently ignores you:
    Not going to lie, but I do not see the threat to your life in that series of posts.

    I read before and days and maaaany pages after you say you were threatened, and I do not see it.
     
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  15. pjdude1219 The biscuit has risen Valued Senior Member

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    fuck maybe i got more neurological issues than i thought i could have sworn it was a different person
     
  16. Bells Staff Member

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    That's okay.

    We all get things wrong sometimes.

    So we should all just bring things down a bit.
     
  17. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Are you going to apologise to me now, pjdude?
     
  18. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    Bells
    Thanks for the above.
    Curiously, the thing that stood out for me was
    "your" is a possessive pronoun
    For the record:
    To the best of my knowledge, I do not actually have a "fucking psycho"
    Nor do I want one.
     
  19. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    20,238
    There's an important difference there.

    I moderate another forum (a skydiving forum.) And we make it very clear that it's OK to attack politicians, political parties, ideas, people outside the forum etc. But you can't personally attack anyone posting on the forum. So:

    "Trump sucks" - that's fine to post
    "Republicans suck" - also fine
    "Democrats support murder and pedophilia" - also fine
    "Exchemist sucks" - not OK

    Of course people try to get clever.

    Exchemist: "I like rabbits"
    Troll: "Anyone who likes rabbits and posts here sucks" - also not OK.

    (Sorry to use you as an example Exchemist)
     
  20. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    10,817
    But I do like rabbits - in a stew with bacon, Dijon mustard and tarragon

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    .
     
  21. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Anyone who skydives sucks.
     
  22. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    I went sky diving once
    It took a lot of time and effort to get a minute of free fall
    I only suck when i set my regulator low for scuba diving---I found that if i set the regulator high so i didn't have to suck, it was a lot more fun and relaxing, but the air didn't last as long.
     
  23. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    16,065
    I was just pokin' fun at billvon.

    I once had to end a drift dive in the Niagara river (above the falls) because my buddy ran out of air while I still had 2/3rds of a tank left.

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