Reality is mathematics / Mathematics is reality ?

Discussion in 'General Philosophy' started by Write4U, Nov 27, 2018.

  1. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    ...
    So they're not part of how the universe operates. They part of our model of how the universe operates.
     
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  3. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Lol, I'm just an old bookkeeper, hardly a mathematician or cosmologist. But I do like mathamatics, it appears that mathematics can pretty well "account" for every physical or dynamical phenomenon in the universe.

    I can visualize a universe with colors (wavelengths) as being a form of fundamental values. After all colors (wavelengths) are/have values. However I would think that colors alone would have limited application (function) in a more intricate and varied physical universe. It seems difficult to account for all patterns with colors (wavelengths) only.

    But I do like Bohm's Universal Pilot Wave model, as well as Bohmian Mechanics. His model of pure potential (dynamic) fields with emergent Implicates offers a real mathematical deterministic perspective, without the dubious mathematical particle/wave duality proposed in the Copehagen Interpretation.

    But I am just expressing my considered opinion and defending it as best I can. Wouldn't be much of an opinion if I could not defend it at all.
     
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  5. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    And how does the universe operate according to the human model? IMO, we cannot use human invented numbers, they are arbitrary symbolic values which are sufficient for human purpose but the universe is not written in human language.

    But will it be impossible to understand the universe ever? Will we never be able to model a TOE?

    All values and functions exist abstractly as an intrinsic part of the spacetime fabric (pattern), and provide the guiding equations for all physical interaction, IMO.

    They did not shape the universe, the universal physical potentials shaped the self-referential mathematical values and functions which we can represent as equations.

    This accounts for the self-referential character of universal (and human) mathematics, IMO.
    Bohm called this fundamental universal aspect "insight intelligence", not as a form of consciousness, but more as a form of abstract mathematics. Determinism.

    p.s. and solves a lot of the more spiritually oriented models, which are one-way models.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
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  7. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 69 years old Valued Senior Member

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    We do OK

    After all we know about you but you don't know about us

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    Maybe one day we will visit with some of our green (in your system about 6 years old) children, on a school outing to study primative life forms and systems

    In exchange for our noseyness we will give you permission to photograph us (we will holograph you)

    Just don't let MR have any of the photos

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    No wait take one out of focus and give him that one

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  8. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Your species are in the infra-red range of colors? We'll need special glasses. I did notice you are wearing special goggles. Are they adjustable for different focal lengths?

    No wonder we have never seen Martians. They're invisible in our wave-length and focal range.
    Who would've thought.

    Hmmm....a commercial idea for when we meet our infra-red neighbors from Mars.......

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    Is that north or south of earth?
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
  9. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 69 years old Valued Senior Member

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    My profile photo (your primative system does not allow hologram) is my pet

    No longer with us sad to say. Died about Purple (or 5,000 your primative system years ago). So young at Peach

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  10. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Never bring any of your pets to earth. Humans will mistake it for a popular fruit and eat it by mistake. We are a primitive species after all.

    Corrective lenses for a pet? Wow, what an advanced and caring species you are. We can use some of that wisdom.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
  11. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 69 years old Valued Senior Member

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    Trust me I am being kind when I say primitive

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  12. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    That's because all we use is rose colored glasses and we cannot see any other colors which may warn us of impending doom. Out of sight out of mind.
     
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  13. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 69 years old Valued Senior Member

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    We are in the process of changing our measurement system

    As you are the our only Earthly contact I thought I would give you a chance to skip over the colour system up from your number system

    You can wow those who pass for Scientists. The closest stuff I can find on your planet which matches with our new system is your carrot

    We have a close match here so I have gotten our new system provisionally named The Write Carrot System

    Under our new system your planet is about 3½ Carrots away

    Don't expect tomatoes in our system as you know they are a fruit

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  14. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Colors are not wavelengths. Different wavelengths can stimulate the same color perception, the same wavelength can be seen as different colors, and the relationships between wavelengths have no correlation with the relationships between colors.

    Outside of human perception, colors have no fundamental values. They have no relative values. They are ad hoc creations of human perceptual apparatus, means of human seeing.

    You posted the evidence for this yourself, in descriptions of color wheel combinations and an illustration of the electromagnetic spectrum - which included how humans assign its values and perceive certain intervals of it.
     
  15. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    You're right of course, but.....
    Take the conversation in context. This was lighthearted banter. Hence the mention of extra terrestials wearing sunglasses etc.
    I'm sure Michael will agree.....

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    Last edited: May 15, 2019
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  16. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 69 years old Valued Senior Member

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  17. river

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    Interesting ; but

    How so ?

    How does Indigo become a wavelength of Crimson ?
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
  18. river

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    So light wavelengths , such as UV , is a creation of Human perception .
     
  19. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    1.What colour is the left heart? What colour is the right heart?

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    2. What colour is A? What colour is B?

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    3. What colour is the left face? What colour is the right face?

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    4. What colour is A? What colour is B?

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    5. What colour is this dress?

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    Last edited: May 20, 2019
  20. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I went to all that trouble for you river ...
     
  21. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    I'll give it a shot.
    #1 Both are the same red
    #2 A and B are same color
    #3 Left is red, Right is orange? Nah...same color?
    #4 A and B are same color
    #5 Light metallic blue and light multicolored brown?

    The ones I got correct is not because I could see the proper colors, but from previous optical illusions of a similar kind, i.e. an educated guess.
    It seems that any shadow correction is a hardwired function, from millions of years of optical perceptions.

    My brain sees the different colors, it cannot do anything else. All it can do is make a best guess.....Anil Seth. This presentation by Anil Seth is very interesting and sheds light on how the brain makes guesses.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
  22. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    You say this:
    And then you say this:
    Methinks you are not being totally honest in your answers.
     
  23. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I see a white dress in blue light. So do thousands of others.
    And thousands of yet others see a blue dress.
     

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