Religion and women.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Xelasnave.1947, Jan 12, 2021.

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  1. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    It seems all you can do is make accusation.
    Explain why you think it is sexist.

    All the other stuff you wrote is really unnecessary, and a somewhat desparate attempt to get out of a discussion.
    Try and bring that negativity under control, and remember that these are simply discussion forums. IOW, calm down this is simply a discussion.
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  3. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    What do you think to this passage...
    That was also part of the Pauline Letters, which indicates there’s more to that whole correspondence than “sexism”. I suggest you familiarise yourself with it before you make a conclusion based on anger and hate.

    “In the end—and in the Lord

    —woman is not otherwise than man,
    and man is not otherwise than woman;
    and though woman came from man,
    so does everyman come from a woman
    —and everything comes from God.”(1 Corinthians 11:12)
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  5. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    I really don’t know what you mean.
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  7. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    Without even having to go back thru this thread for evidence of you avoiding answering questions let us look at your last reply here and note how you did not address my question...mmmm do you still wish to won' dont say Weggs is avoiding the matter when she has to all here satisfactorily given you an answer ...your attempt to belittle her in this way is wrong and you must appologise immediately....where is your backbone?

    There is an unending opportunity to do so ....but why do you fail to address the rape and murder and focus on the trivial.

    .is rape and murder a joke to you..why can you not realise that we are talking about terrible things..

    .take yourself there and think of the suffering of the victims, see their faces see the butchery see babies smashed on rocks.. and be mature enough to address the horror and stop being flipant.

    I am trying to have a discussion with you from which I would like to get an insite as to why you can be so casual about rape and murder.

    It is you who avoids discussion with introduction of trivial matters in an effort to avoid the big are a air thief.

    Pointing out the evils re Murder and rape is "negativity"? Yes let's discuss it...

    Discuss the passage is you that avoid discussion, it is you who are evasive it is you who treat serious matters as a are a air thief and a pork chop.

    That seems a common problem for religious folk..lets ignore the evil things about our cult and prance around all rightious and ignore that out cult has been responsible for more murders than any other group..humankind has not forgiven these murders even if god has.

    Forgive me if I decline any discussion on your passage given you have not made any effort to address the one I posted.

    I will say can not hold up something professing it's goodness if you fail to address it's badness.

    Say we have a great car, good gas mileage, well priced comfortable etc etc...but it has ineffective brakes from the factory such that fatal accidents you want to talk about the good gas mileage or the bad brakes?

    We have a teacher well qualified nice to kids well groomed but he belongs to the KKK group being investigated for the murder of some black folk...what will you focus upon? His nice suit?

    Now why in these examples will you say well let us focus on the bad points cause they will detract and make the car or the teacher a bad deal...why can you not see that these bad passages need to be addressed and certainly when I invite you to address them I expect you to be serious and not treat the matter as a joke.

    Of course you must say that but it is a meaningless are what you are...

    Why don't you think rape and murder are terrible things? Why do you not want to discuss these horrors..your mob committed them surely you can explain why.

  8. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

    Did I make any statement referring to how I "regard" you?

    Have you ever heard the phrase "wouldn't be able to figure out how to pour piss from a boot even if the instructions were printed on the sole." ?

    Defend Wegs from whom?
    Is there a man(?) in this Thread that would attack Wegs or any woman?
    Pray tell, Jan Ardena, are you the man(?) in this Thread that would attack Wegs or any woman?

    Is that how you want to be regarded?
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2021
  9. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    You’re talking nonsense.
    You need to show what you are talking about.
    Anyone can make accusations.
    You say “let’s look at your last reply here and...”.
    And what?
    Show me what you’re trying to express, otherwise it is just you blathering on.
    Then either stop making baseless accusations, or prove that your accusations are warranted.
    Such as?
    We’ll do it then!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    You have nothing to offer, but are too proud to admit it.
    More accusation, without even an explanation, what to speak of reason.
    You are running on empty.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    Is that supposed to make sense?
    I don’t get the correlation.
    If a great car has bad breaks, either you change it, or you fix the problem,
    How is relevant?
    Now you’ve upped the hatred.
    Why wouldn’t I think they are terrible things?
  10. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    I wasn’t sure, which is why I asked.
    Do you always belittle the “man” like that, or is just for this thread?
    What does it mean?
    She just seems very quiet at the moment, and you guys seem to be sticking up for her.
    Obviously not.
    I’m just wondering why are you so angry.
    You’re actually proving my point about emotional men being irrational.
  11. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

    I cannot remember being "angry" since...hmmm...not sure...maybe Junior High School..., you Log on to SciForums and make irrational Posts to prove that you are emotional...hmmm...
    So, is that...a...hobby...pastime...hope it is not OCD...

    Okay, well then...
    You take care
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2021
  12. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    You are wearing out your shovel but keep digging ...damn deep hole you have got there.

    Dig dig dig

    The ones you avoid.

    Ok let's discuss the crusades, how they started by killing Christians on the way there..and how they killed everyone when they captured the city of women children and worst of all babies ...and all the murders in you go...what aspect shall we discuss...the killing of christians at the start or the horror upon capturing the city...we could discuss later history where Richard the Lionheart killed 3000 prisoners of war because they were too much trouble to look after...even his side found that disgusting but hey you dont call out a murderer of his calibur as the man is clearly dangerous a murderer and a religious nutter.

    I offer you the truth and clearly you reject it just as you have always done. You are just an air thief and a pork chop..just try and deny that.

    No you are mistaken I have much much more on the evil morality of religion that contributes greatly to male humans treating women badly...

    But let's discuss the murders and rapes that you are in favour of...I mean god called for them and you are in favour of what he calls for...and I am talking about Billvons know the one where they killed everyone except the virgins who they kept to rape.

    Yes... that is unless you are a pork chop ..yes.
    Does it not make sense to you?

    What you do with a car is a great what do we do about a book preaching murder and rape as somehow honourable...
    Change it or fix it?

    If you were not a pork chop you would know.

    That is an evasive answer...clearly you are ok with the rapes and murders in Billvons story given your previous comments and your refusal to provide a clear answer now when a direct question is put to you suggests you do not think they are terrible things..why can you just not form the words and say..they are terrible things? Because the truth is you think if god gave it the rubber stamp its ok..thats what you implied earlier.

    The terrible thing is you treat all of this as just one big joke ... god will get you and you will exist forever in torment and suffering in Hell probably being continually raped by Satan himself.

    Fix your wickedness and reject the ancient directions to treat woman badly.

  13. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    You are a evil person Alex.
  14. dumbest man on earth Real Eyes Realize Real Lies Valued Senior Member

    Last edited: Jan 22, 2021
  15. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    I just am trying every trick in the book to get you to say the rapes and murders in Billvons story were very wrong, and you just can't say it, and given your defense offered when that matter was being discussed earlier all you could do was in some way or another come over as incapable of saying it was wrong.

    And it is now clear that you will not. you claim that I am evil you could have added the words..of course I regard the rapes and murders evil ..but you can not and you won't.
    I don't have to say anything as the audience are free to think about your avoidance.

    Anyways as matey posted after you that I should take a break I can only agree with him as your making all of this a joke I can not and will not indulge any more and not waste my time on you or this site.

    I have little time left so wasting on deaf ears is not productive and I suspect folk here will only see me as a very old man who is crazy rather than someone who cares, has always cared, is kind and respectful and points to the evils and hypocracy that makes one happy to leave this planet.

    Thanks for wasting precious seconds of my life and may the non-existent god have mercy on your non existent soul...
  16. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    Did God command Moses “rape” the virgins?
    Or was that bilvons spin?

    We understand rape to mean “a type of sexual assault usually involving sexual intercourse or other forms of sexual penetration carried out against a person without that person's consent”.
    I’ll assume you agree.
    Can you point out anywhere where Moses is commanded to “rape” virgins?
    There is however references to the fundamental basis of rape, and that is “adultery”, which is an abomination to God.
    If you marry, and follow the rules , like the passages I showed from a while back, then there is no chance of the kind of rape we understand today, occurring.
    You can’t have your cake, and eat it.

    Is capitol punishment murder?
    Some may argue that it is, and some will say it isn’t.
    One argument for why it could at least be murder, is that they may kill the wrong person, or an innocent person. Fair enough. But if the government killed a person who is actually a murderer. What then?

    God cannot be wrong.
    God knows everything.
    You may not believe in God, but those are His attributes. If you don’t take them into account when you read the Bible, that is your problem.

    Rape and murder is rampant today, because people are in darkness, due to anger (a negative emotion) because they don’t believe in God.
    If they believed in God, they would follow His commandments.
    You want to talk about rape and murder. Look at the despicable acts of the last century, carried out by communist atheists. Stalin alone has killed more that all casualties of religious wars combined.
    Shall I label you as a Stalinist, because he didn’t believe in God either.
  17. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    We all of us, have only a little time left. Your is no different, so stop with the self-pity.

    You say you don’t believe in God, or the spirit-soul, yet you talk about death as in “leaving this planet”. If you truly didn’t believe in the spirit-soul you would not have said that.

    Maybe you are kind and respectful, but you haven’t been, here.

    You cherry pick parts of the Bible, to try and justify your ignorance, and when a light is thrown on to your darkness, you explain it away.

    It is written as a rule in that same chapter, and I showed it to you, that a man must love his wife more than his own body.
    So there must be a reason why women aren’t allowed to be heads of churches. Why not look for that reason before you condemn.
    Men who abuse women, because they are women, are weak. No intelligent person disputes that.

    If you have to make a law “thou shall not kill”, or thou shall not commit adultery”, it is because the the people of that land have forgotten why that is wrong.
    To just blame it on the Bible, Religion, and disregard the fact that people are corrupt, and as such have no standard but their own insanity, or to give up their intelligence, is totally inconsiderate, and corrupt in and of itself.

    The people who God is referring to, aren’t just your run of the mill people. These are people favoured by God, who turned away from God.
    It is between them and God.

    Man and woman coming together, in that people, is about creating progeny. Not about dating, buying a house together, putting the kids through college, feminism, or wearing matching sweaters.
    It’s a completely different culture.
    There is so much you haven’t taken into account, that it renders your diatribe(s) meaningless.
  18. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

    The Bible isn’t silent on rape. It was responded to and dealt with ...sometimes avenged. In the OT, God can be seen as taking up the cause of victims, and those who are vulnerable in society. Deuteronomy 22:25-27 highlights some of this, for example.

    I tend to view the Bible as pointing to Jesus’ arrival - his life, death and resurrection. The stories that get the reader to that point, can seem contradictory and suggests that Christianity is defined through the misdeeds/crimes of different civilizations and societies. But, my take is that God allows suffering but that isn’t the sum total of the story. We as people allow suffering. God isn’t a puppeteer and we’re puppets; as “his creation” we are responsible too for how we take care of one another, the planet, etc.

    It’s tough to really convey all of my thoughts about God, using this format. A blog section would be fun for members here and then discussions could stem from that. Often, these threads end up with atheists vs. theists and it just limits the dialogue.

    There’s sometimes this immediate thought (among non-believers) that all theists when speaking about God are on a mission to convert non-believers. lol Nah, it would be cool to just have a reasonable exchange without thinking of each other as “opponents.”

    Anyway, just my $.02.
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2021
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  19. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member


    But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die:

    26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so isthis matter:
  20. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    That’s what I’m talking about.
    You have to think about what is being said in the scripture, not just take a passage that you think justifies our current state of mind.
    The more you go into it, the more you realise stuff
    But that’s the challenge. At least atheists will do all they can to show the opposite of what you believe. Meaning you have to give it thought.
    The problem with Christian sites is that they are wet. Their level of conversation is tends to sound as if they have been programmed. They are intolerant of any theistic expression outside of their own.
    I agree. They want theists to prove or show evidence of God, rather find out for themselves. Then after a little bit of time you realise that they have no intention finding God, and the onus is not on the theist.
    So for me, the emphasis is directed at atheism.
  21. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Now THAT is the best case I've ever seen of the pot calling the kettle black right there.
  22. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

    Yea, I’ve found Christian websites/forums to be a mixed bag of believers who are either super dogmatic (legalistic) or lukewarm. New converts can easily get lost if they’re looking for solid answers to their questions. I rarely join in threads on those sites, anymore. I read an article the other day that in the US - more people are either strongly opposed to faith or strongly embrace it. Thought that was interesting.

    I’m busy today, but I’ll reply to your other points at another time.
  23. pluto2 Banned Valued Senior Member

    I think it's always been a dog-eat-dog world.

    We live in a cruel and dystopian world and that's a fact. No wonder there are so many suicidal teenagers, it's because they realize already from such a young age that this world is shit.

    And lets face it:

    Organised religion is the worst thing to happen to the world. A bunch of self serving liars claiming to know the truth just in order to exploit money and power.

    I have no problem with a personal faith or belief you can believe in what you want to believe in. Just don't come knocking on my door trying to tell me what I should believe.
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