Should we take Ray Comfort Serious? If no, what not?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Jan Ardena, Feb 28, 2020.

  1. exchemist Valued Senior Member

    He could hang on to God quite easily if he would only dump the stupid and ahistorical creationism. Genesis was seen allegorically as early as 200AD, by Origen, one of the highly respected "Fathers of the Church" whose theology came to be mainstream Christianity.
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  3. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    Here are some definitions of God from various dictionaries. Dictionaries record how people use the word, remember. They are descriptive, not prescriptive. I post these for reference, since Jan seems to be quite hung up on them.

    1. God
    a. A being conceived as the perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe, the principal object of faith and worship in monotheistic religions.
    b. The force, effect, or a manifestation or aspect of this being.
    2. A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality.
    3. An image of a supernatural being; an idol.
    4. One that is worshiped, idealized, or followed:

    1. (Theology) theol the sole Supreme Being, eternal, spiritual, and transcendent, who is the Creator and ruler of all and is infinite in all attributes; the object of worship in monotheistic religions

    1. the creator and ruler of the universe; Supreme Being.
    2. (l.c.)
    a. one of several immortal powers, esp. one with male attributes, presiding over some portion of worldly affairs; deity.
    b. the image of such a deity; idol.
    3. (l.c.) any deified person or object.

    1.A being conceived of as possessing supernatural power, and to be propitiated by sacrifice, worship, etc.; a divinity; a deity; an object of worship; an idol.
    2.The Supreme Being; the eternal and infinite Spirit, the Creator, and the Sovereign of the universe; Jehovah.
    3.A person or thing deified and honored as the chief good; an object of supreme regard.
    4.Figuratively applied to one who wields great or despotic power.
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  5. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member


    1. The name God is given to the spirit or being who is worshipped as the creator and ruler of the world, especially by Jews, Christians, and Muslims.
    2. People sometimes use God in exclamations to emphasize something that they are saying, or to express surprise, fear, or excitement. This use could cause offence.
    3. In many religions, a god is one of the spirits or beings that are believed to have power over a particular part of the world or nature.
    4. Someone who is admired very much by a person or group of people, and who influences them a lot, can be referred to as a god.

    1. (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.
    2.(in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshipped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.

    1. One of the male spirits or beings with special powers that people in some religions believe in and worship.

    1. The definition of a god is an image, person or thing that is worshiped, honored or believed to be all-powerful or the creator and ruler of the universe.
    1. any of various beings conceived of as supernatural, immortal, and having special powers over the lives and affairs of people and the course of nature; deity, esp. a male deity: typically considered objects of worship
    2. an image that is worshiped; idol
    3. a person or thing deified or excessively honored and admired
    4. [G-] in monotheistic religions, the creator and ruler of the universe, regarded as eternal, infinite, all-powerful, and all-knowing; Supreme Being; the Almighty
    1. A deity.
      1. A supernatural, typically immortal being with superior powers.
      2. A male deity.
      3. A supreme being; God.
        The most frequently used name for the Islamic god is Allah.
    2. An idol.
      1. A representation of a deity, especially a statue or statuette.
      2. Something or someone particularly revered, worshipped, idealized, admired and/or followed.
    3. (metaphor) A person in a high position of authority; a powerful ruler or tyrant.
    4. An exceedingly handsome man.
      Lounging on the beach were several Greek gods.
    5. (Internet) The person who owns and runs a multi-user dungeon.
    1. a spirit or being believed to control some part of the universe or life and often worshipped for doing so, or something that represents this spirit or being
    2. (in some religions) the being who made the universe and is believed to have an effect on all things
    3. (esp. in Christian, Jewish, and Muslim belief) the being that created and rules the universe, the earth, and its people

    1. the one Supreme Being, the creator and ruler of the universe.
    2. the Supreme Being considered with reference to a particular attribute: the God of Islam.
    3. (lowercase) one of several deities, especially a male deity, presiding over some portion of worldly affairs.
    4. (often lowercase) a supreme being according to some particular conception

    1. God : the supreme or ultimate reality: such as
    a : the Being perfect in power, wisdom, and goodness who is worshipped (as in Judaism, Christianity, Islam, and Hinduism) as creator and ruler of the universe Throughout the patristic and medieval periods, Christian theologians taught that God created the universe …— Jame Schaefer … the Supreme Being or God, the personal form of the Ultimate Reality, is conceived by Hindus as having various aspects.— Sunita Pant Bansal
    b Christian Science : the incorporeal divine Principle ruling over all as eternal Spirit : infinite Mind
    2 or less commonly God : a being or object that is worshipped as having more than natural attributes and powers specifically : one controlling a particular aspect or part of reality Greek gods of love and war
    3 : a person or thing of supreme value had photos of baseball's gods pinned to his bedroom wall
    4 : a powerful ruler

    There appears to be a lot of consensus here as to how the word "God" is typically used.
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  7. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    Is Jan pulling that one on you, too? You must be getting to him.
  8. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    I must say that I was surprised when I first learned from Jan that he is a literal creationist. Before that, my impression was that he had seemed to me to be a reasonably literate person who I assumed had the benefit of a formal education. As things stand now, I suspect that if Jan has any formal education at tertiary level, it was most likely at one of those Mickey Mouse pretend universities in the United States, where the study of the One True Religion is pushed as least as hard as any secular studies.

    On the other hand, it could be the case that Jan has simply had minimal exposure to science and such pursuits. Possibly he studied religion to the exclusion of other intellectual studies, thereby ending up functionally bereft of any real understanding of any science-related topic beyond the most superficial understanding required to survive in the modern world.

    I think also that it is very likely that Jan has been actively discouraged from pursuing certain lines of inquiry, taught by his religious masters that these are incompatible with and threatening to his faith. He has been taught to deny and avoid.

    Perhaps Jan really believes that he accepts "evolution", as he claims he does, because his understanding of that term is so hopelessly mangled by his religion that he doesn't realise that the term itself encompasses ideas that go far beyond his indoctrinated belief system. I actually doubt this, because I think Jan is willing to tell lies to try to keep his faith intact. After all his time here, he can no longer really pull off a convincing act that he still doesn't know what evolution is. And yet, he keeps trying to do just that.

    Maybe Jan has some kind of vested interest in his religion beyond the personal. Maybe he has some monetary stake in promoting lies. Who knows?
  9. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    Trust you to see it like that.

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    ”, was a paragraph.
  10. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    Your lack of belief in God renders you an atheist. Not that you stop being an atheist because you don’t like the term.
    You chose to not accept God, so naturally, you lack a belief.
  11. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    The words of an atheist.
    You can’t run from it. It is like your shadow.
    I feel a brilliant analogy coming on...

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  12. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    No I can’t.
    You’re making the mistake of thinking that if one does not accept darwinism, one rejects the whole of science.
    That’s is religious fundamental talk.
    The problem is, you can’t see it, because you’re wrapped up in it.
    I like Ray Comfort. He seems very genuine.
    It wouldn’t surprise if all those claims were from explicit atheists (Darwinists).
    Subtle put-down.
    That’s very naughty Alex.
    But then again, you’re a Darwinist.
  13. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    No it doesn't.

    I will not be defined by some word tied to theist... It's a made up silly word .. you are atheist you just need a gap between the a" and the "t" to be a silly is that..there is no scientific model so it's all a non event.

    It's simple I am neither atheist or a theist.

    It's like gender just because you are not male doesn't mean you are's new times religion has no say anymore as it has no scientific model which basically leaves it non existent.
    Your statement does not fit any scientific model so it's meaningless.
    I could call you a communist but that does not mean you are a communist...don't label me with silly made up words.
    No it's not nothing like it ..what were you thinking.
    What's an analogy and how could it be brilliant.

    You are just making stuff up ...that's what theists do.. Ana Logy , A nal ogy..just made up silly words.

  14. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Jan talks like Jimmy Stewart with the seven foot rabbit standing beside him that no one can see, claiming that although he can see it, everyone else must be rejecting the existence of the rabbit for some strange reason, therefore lacking the belief. Jan has yet to figure out that atheists lack the belief in the first place, therefore are not accepting the claim of the rabbit's existence as opposed to the alleged rabbit itself.
  15. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    What’s up?
    Can’t bring yourself to talk about “God”?
    Why you have use “giant invisible rabbit”?
    You’re most probably not aware how much that says about your position.
    Clearly your non-acceptance of “God”, is more than your prepared to reveal, but unwittingly reveal anywayz.
    That seems to be the theme through all the explicits in this thread.
  16. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Thanks Jan, it didn't take you very long to make my point, but you did with the greatest of ease.
  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    You do I witnessed same.
    I not making a mistake at all.
    You do avoid science. You said you can't avoid science, I said yet you do..
    It is frequently put on a plate in front of you and you avoid it.
    You don't get to avoid part as you do...I did not say you rejects the whole of science..go over your words and what they mean. ..
    What is?
    That's nonsense..I see the blanket I am wrapped in...anyways what am I wrapped in and why is it a problem for you.
    I think so also but that can be said about every con man that ever ripped off a mark. He has the "gift of the gab" again another quality found in a con man.
    I am not saying he is a con man but after I watched the video Paddo put up he comes over as extremely clever and manipulative ... He seems to tell some fibs.
    I could never trust him.
    I don't like to speculate and if I can't say something good about someone I try not to say anything.
    Not at all. I am not clever enough to be subtle nor cruel enough to put anyone down.
    Actually I was being somewhat complimentary..I have been in sales getting your name out there takes hard work..he does that..just look at his banana video...he became the banana man..that's a marketing genius right there.
    You are mistaken.
    A compliment and insult in one word..that's clever..that's the sort of tactic you notice Ray gets up to .I think that is why I am not sure he is on the level.

  18. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    Another cop out.
  19. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Poor Jan, continuously struggles with definitions.

    A cop out is a poor excuse for not doing something, like if your boyfriend asked you out and you said you had to wash your hair. If you look closely at your previous response to my post, that would be more in line with a a cop out. Or, literally every post you make towards questions regarding science.
  20. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    I bet you can’t provide any examples.

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    I cannot avoid any part of science, because science deals with reality. I can avoid ideas, or beliefs, but not science, any more than I can avoid truth.
    You wrapped up in religious fundamentalists mindset. You can’t see that darwinism is a philosophy, or a scientific idea. It Proponents have piggy-backed it on a known scientific fact (which everyone is aware of).
    Now you deem those who do not accept your philosophy, are avoiding science.
    But it’s not a problem for me.
    I just find it intriguing.
    “Con man” is an accusation you attach. There has been no official investigation to give you a reason to make it.
    Furthermore you male it because of what he stands for. You are being unreasonable.
    Then stop making false allegations. I kind of expect better from you.
    He didn’t come up with the term. It was explicits.
    But why not capitalise on that?
    It is neither a compliment or an insult.
    It is what it is.
  21. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Words Jan struggles to understand the meaning.
  22. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

    Right. A poor excuse for a response.
    You’re all washed up, but proud.
  23. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    You don't need to keep reminding us how terrible your responses are to our posts, Jan, we have many examples.

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