Supernatural?

Discussion in 'Comparative Religion' started by mathman, Dec 2, 2019.

  1. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    That's like saying we need to define what's black and white at the same time.
     
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  3. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Well, what makes the natural, supernatural?
     
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  5. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I think the crux of it is that the supernatural defies even the principle of analyzing it.

    Dark matter is very hard to analyze, but there's no principle that means we will never be able to measure it, analyze it, model it and even reproduce it in a lab.
    Can the same thing be said about God?
     
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  7. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Yes and No. God can Know Himself yet not Know Himself. Imagination is every child's playground of self-discovery, but there is a limitation, or so I believe.
     
  8. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    One is that which can be detected and measured while the other cannot. It's often considered the actual existence of things and the non-existence of things claimed to exist.
     
  9. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Dependent on your perceptions of the natural?

    So, that thing behind your perceptions, non-existent or existent? Can you turn your perceptions backward and measure your true nature? Are you natural or supernatural?
     
  10. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Well, that's not really what I asked.
    Can we humans analyze it, model it and know how it works by applying scientific methods?
     
  11. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    I don't believe we can from the limitations of natural perception, but maybe from supernatural perception, we can.
     
  12. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Right. So that is the definition of supernatural (even if it's simply circular).

    But it answers your question: what makes something supernatural? We can't observe, study or model it with natural perception; it requires supernatural perceptive ability (whatever that is).
     
  13. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Kinda like supernatural consciousness?
     
  14. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Whatever that is, sure.

    If there are creatures that are invisible to sight, and can only be seen with Wowzavision, then, to see them, you'll need to have Wowzavision.

    Note that the above statement does not mean Wowza creatures or Wowza goggles exist.

    It is a self-contained logic, but self-contained logic doesn't say anything about whether the subject is actually real.
     
  15. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Agreement of two or more individual conscious beings would be helpful, wouldn't it?
     
  16. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    No, dependent on whether something can be detected and measured. Perceptions can come in the form of instruments and machines that are capable of detecting and measuring to great degrees of accuracy.

    I would answer those question if I knew what you were talking about, but I have no idea what you're asking.

    I am detectable and measurable, just like you and everyone else, hence we are natural and therefore we exist.
     
  17. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Which are extensions of your perception.



    It doesn't matter, because it is you, the one who perceives, and you can't see it.



    If I were experiencing a dream and picked up a ruler in that dream to measure my finger, would that make the measurement of my dream finger real?
     
  18. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    And? What is your point?

    Can't see what? I still have no idea what you're asking.

    No, it wouldn't make your finger real, but it would make the dream of measuring your finger real.
     
  19. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    You cannot "see" it either. By definition super-natural is "invisible". You can "imagine it", but that's not proof.
     
  20. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Nope. By definition, the supernatural cannot be detected by any natural method (measurement, sight, temperature etc.)
     
  21. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I must disagree.
    Traditional ghosts are supernatural and they can ostensibly be seen and heard.

    I'd say the the supernatural describes things that can't be explained by natural means (i.e. known science).
     
  22. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 70 years old Valued Senior Member

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    If you are seeing ànd hearing it is NOT supernatural and not ghost

    Possible not explainable, but that's another story in the - where is the evidence for the cause of vision and noise - tray

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  23. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Anil Seth makes some compelling observarions in that regard. The process is actually much deeper than most can imagine. You have to believe it before you can experience it.
    That gets very complicated.
     

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