Survival of the human race

Theres something Id like to know:

How does molecules in space react to concentrated sunshine?
Suppose we direct a ray from the space station,
Will it transport molecules in the path of the ray in the direction of the ray?
Will new molecules replace the transported molecules?
That is: will the ray work somewhat like a vacuum cleaner?

Space contains mostly hydrogen, can it be "mined" this way?
Can we collect hydrogen in space and transport it to earth?
If rays transport molecules, how close to earth can they be transported?
Surely not all the way down?

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We must collect and compress it.
But hopefully this can be automated and done rather quickly.
Cheap hydrogen could possibly replace oil in Earths economy!

 

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Are you referring to Solar Wind? This is made up of charged particles, electrons mostly and even protons. Because of their high kinetic energy, they can influence massive objects- Such as a solar sail.

Molecules, are also swept away by them, such as solar wind stripping Mercury of any trace gasses it may have had, hydrogen and water from Venus, Hydrogen from Earth and even Mars has been nudified over time without protection.

What you mean by new molecules replacing transported ones; I'm not sure. Do you mean new ones popping into existence or from some source of supply?

Vacuum cleaner? No... how about a leaf blower?

 

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If we transport away molecules from somewhere then space will be emptier there and molecules will come and replace the lost molecules, wont they? (Theres a word I lack...reversed pressure?)

Yes I was confusing the solar wind with ordinary sunshine

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If you reflect ordinary sunshine with parabolic mirrors into a hot paralell ray will this ray transport ions and/or neutral molecules?

I ask because I suspect it might be cheaper and quicker to transport matter in space as a large stream of molecules than as bulk matter in ships.

So if rays work... Good its simplest!

Next method is transforming rays into electricity and accelerate ionised molecules by magnetic induction.

Space is seen as empty but there are a few atoms per inch and if you collect them they get replaced by their neighbours so actually you can pick as many as you want from the same spot! And stream them elsewhere!

Dont you see the similarity (and the pun) with a vacuum cleaner?

 

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Terraforming Venus by replacing its lost hydrogen...
Well I also thought about it then I realised Venus is a gigantic coalmine and thought:
Why not export the atmosphere elsewhere and process it there instead?

Why cant we just make a huge vacum cleaner powered by the sun and suck it away? (Metaphorically speaking.)

Perhaps it will take time for the stream to reach its destination but when it
arrives it is lots of co2 coming continuosly day after day ,year after year,decade after...etc etc

How much money is that worth?

 

Ill sum up: WE use sunshine, lots of sunshine concentrated in a ray with a
convenient diameter. It can be natural sunshine or transformed into a laser beam.

This ray must do TWO things:

Transport energy and accelerate away anything within the stream!

Normally friction prevents reaching high speed :doubling speed makes friction five times higher.

So our space cities travel and accelerate in such a ray, where friction is conveniently low.

Im neither physician nor mathematician so I cant calculate here

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May I suggest we travel in the direction away from our galactic center,

and visit the closest stars in succession mining sunshine automatically from every star...

(Why leave our beloved accelerating space city?))

And aim for the next galaxy!

(End of Prelude to Eternity.)

 

Try using a leaf blower... the stream tends to scatter what it hits, like billiards.
Your idea won't create a straight beam. It'll scatter molecules.

In addition to this, the amount moved and the time it takes is very prohibitive.

 

We are getting better at detecting other worlds. I think we may find something that will support our kind of life over the next couple of decades. Then we can build generation ships that can trek out for several hundred years, and what happens back home will no longer be your concern.

 

So streams of ionized molecules cant be transported through space?

But high speed trains on earth can be transported with magnetic induction...

What in space can be equivalent to the rails on earth?

Big magnetic rings keeping the molecules packed together.

Preventing them from escaping the ray.

How efficient need they be? And how close together?

If we have a continious flow then we can loose some molecules to scattering effects.

The first model to calculate is collecting and moving hydrogen in empty space.

Next is the transport of molecules away from an atmosphere: say oxygen and nitrogen from earth to the moon.

The basic idea is that even a very small continuous flow of molecules in space transports more mass/per time unit than a flotilla of spaceships,and at lower cost.

 

Would need containment.

Has containment (Tracks.)

A huge tube made out of diamond. Or a series of them with humongous funnels on the ends.

maybe.

Off hand guess?
No idea.
The dispersment will depend on the size and power of the beam, as well as a few complex mechanics. A good physicist in the field might be able to tell ya.

Without containment? You'd lose the vast majority.

 

Oil will not dry out suddenly. Hydrogen and nuclear power are good alternatives. Earth can have a many times larger population. We need not starve if we transform oil into food, if we genetically improve agricultural crops etc etc
To solve your worries its no use to steal the petty cash now given to the space program! Lets take it from tax on cosmetics and other female "necessities" instead.Theres were the CASH is!

What work do you want to see done done with a heap of cash bigger than what is invested into the space program?

Let me guess: Building nuclear reactors to meet coming energy demands?

 

[tired]

I know, but I would be happier, if countries wouldn't attack other ones for it.

I want a giant pyramid to be built in Nebraska. So there would be a reason to go there...

 

Agreed - but even drying up slowly will cause us problems.

Hydrogen isn't an alternative. We don't have any.

Been doing that for decades, but the oil is drying up (see above.)

Also been doing that for decades.

The line "tax everyone except me" doesn't work for long - because then a group of women get together and decide to tax professional football and beer.

 

I was trying to provoke Syzygis but she didnt take the bait

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Theres no hydrogen? Theres lots of water! But, ok , perhaps its bad economy to hydrolyze it.

But theres lots of hydrogen in "empty" space, there may be economical ways to collect and import it. Its not a short time solution though. Going nuclear seems the fastest solution to energy needs.

And, yes , we should be near starvation by now if not for the successful genetic modification of crops. But the resistance froom the green movement is troublesome. Again i tried to tempt S into silly arguing... She must be brighter than I thought.

But careful taxation is a way of getting necessary things done without bloodshed.

 

Yes! A stream (if streams can be generated) starting near the sun could use both Mercury and Venus to get to the Moon.

Why the Moon? Well something needs to collect the molecules!

So we start a Moon colony in the Moon interior.

Isnt it strange if the idea to transport matter in space in molecular form (somehow using solar power) hasnt been discussed somewhere?
Im not so apt at searching the net, can anyone help?

Neverfly thinks such a stream should disperse and not reach the target...Well I dislike guessing:
Why can we accelerate a piece of iron and hit a target, but not hit it by accelerating an equal mass of iron molecules?


Suppose we collect solar energy using paraboles near the sun. We focus an extremely hot ray on Mercury and then we accelerate Mercury Vapours containing interesting molecules towards the target. It will take time but eventually a stream of interesting molecules surely will be welcomed there.

Isnt this (if it works) cheaper than normal space transports!?

The energy output from the sun is unbelievable
and focused rays could vaporize Mercury.
So by this method (again: IF it works... Why find out?)
we could actually export the whole planet somewhere!

 

Because your proposal is more like Billiards than a rifle. Add to that the enormous distances and the time involved becomes unthinkable.

Neverfly says so.

Now- you can try to defend the notion or get back to the drawing board.

Speaking of which- you are talking about Future innovative technology to deliver payloads- Why not rail gun tech, low orbit, large and fast payload delivery? Fire into destination orbit with tractors to accelerate and retrieve.

Or instead of using Sunbeams and making billiards with atoms, build a fancy schmancy particle accelerator, like the LHC? You can fire large groupings in rapid succession with a magnetic coil accelerator ( to accelerate in the opposite direction) at the destination like a cosmic baseball glove.

 

I have respect for your opinions but I think the engineering details involved are out of our reach!
So its enough if an idea is scientific, the engineers can take over.
Also: Im not so fond of repeating what has been better said before...
Instead I TRY to enter unknown territory!

Presenting thoughts that might be new:
Lets use solar power to transport atmospheres and planets as a stream of molecules to a target.

If we should have irritating neighbours at Alpha Centauri, why not kill them this way and take over their sun . Etc etc...

 

Fine, bust my bubble then...

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Primary problems: Particles cannot be organized to strike in any manner except random, creating random results or - Spray gun effect. Funneling and "nozzlling" will not remove entropy (My suggestion seemed a lot faster and easier...) and the factor of the time it takes to reach it's target.

If that is what you had in mind, shooting electrons seems so umm... Ineffective. You may as well shine a flashlight at them. Shoulda taken my offer for a rail gun.


Wait.. Killing the guys over there? What is WRONG with you?

 

I should expand on that a bit: If you're using what amounts to solar wind, it won't reach the nearest star. And even if you get a beam to reach them, using the method you described, you'll only be hitting them with what they've been getting hit with for the last 4.5 billion years. Sunlight.

Make friends of your neighbors.

 

Lol!

Of course Im only discussing defence! Its the other guys im worried about.
I think that they may think what I hope they wouldnt think! (Picture panic stricken sigurdV screaming and running around in circles.)


Time and distance... Well thats why I use solar rays: The ray moves at the speed of light, and my question is: What happens to things in the path of the ray? Rays go on forever dont they? So adding to the stream might make it VERY hot and strong. So at target concentrated light heating things up is what arrives first...then comes Hydrogen and then THEY come

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What I suggest is concentrating the total solar output into a ray directed towards the nearest solar system, but siphoning off what is needed to go to earth and our factory production)

And the BIG question is:

Can we make spaceships able to survive and travel in this ... DEATH RAY!