"Taliswoman"...

Discussion in 'Linguistics' started by Sarkus, May 1, 2022.

  1. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    You sort of miss the point that their "need" is to get in to a house. That is the same as everyone else. The means by which that is achieved is a matter of practicality. They don't need a ramp, they need to get into the building. The ramp just happens to be a practical and economic means of achieving that. Much like stairs are for able-bodied.
    The need is the basic requirement, not the means by which it is achieved.
     
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  3. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    As I stated, everyone needs to get into their house. It is a SPECIAL NEED to need a ramp. The special need IS the ramp.

    What do you think "special need" refers to, the person?

    The special need is the ramp.
     
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  5. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Couple that Throw some money at some houses (which I hope is build some affordable houses for people without) and match house with person, problem does go away for THOSE people

    IF the CONDITIONS which lead to homelessness persists however.....

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  7. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Never said or implied that it did

    The less is the person is less a house

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  8. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    No. That fallacy is based on the archaic assumption that the majority are "normal" and anyone that deviates from that is "special". A man in a wheelchair doesn't pay special taxes or get a special vote at the polls or have special needs.

    I need to get into my house. The government is there to ensure I can get into my house - regardless of how complex it might be or how much it might cost. It is simply my right as a citizen.

    A man with a wheelchair needs to get into his house. The government is there to ensure he can get into his house - regardless of how complex it might be or how much it might cost. It is simply his right as a citizen.

    Generally, each of us needs to get into our house. The government is there to ensure we can get into our house - regardless of how complex it might be or how much it might cost. It is simply our right as citizens.

    There is nothing special about it.
     
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  9. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    How can you possibly know what they need simply from the label "homeless".

    How can you possibly know whether that person needs anything other than 4 walls and a roof unless you put their needs as an individual person over the label that says they're simply shy of 4 walls and a roof.

    If what you are saying were true, then the problem would literally go away by building hundreds of walls with roofs and walking away.

    But that does not, did not, and will not make the problem go away.

    The reason it won't go away is because every one of these people have unique histories that led them to where they are.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2022
  10. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    Again, the "special" is in reference to the ramp, not the person. Houses aren't generally built with ramps, because that is a "special option" like a special option on a car, such as heated mirrors. Cars don't generally come with heated mirrors as part of standard options, that is a special option. Some cars require special orders, because of the engine/tranny package, that generally doesn't come as a standard option. That is a SPECIAL order! It has nothing to do with the person.

    You are out of your mind if you think it's the government's responsibility to make sure you can get into your house. Are you suggesting it's the government's job to make sure everyone has a house to get in to?? How about a pool, is that something the government should provide for every citizen to ensure they stay cool in the summer?? (rolls eyes)

    You are out of your mind if you think it's the responsibility of the government to ensure you get into your house. Where can I find that right in the Bill of Rights?

    You are seriously out there if you think the government is responsible for making sure you can get into your house. What are you smoking?

    The "special" part is that most people don't need a ramp to get into their house. "Special" is an above and beyond requirement of most people's general needs. VERY VERY low percentage of home owners require a ramp, hence the specialty of needing a ramp.

    If you had to order a house like you do a car, a ramp would be a special order!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 2, 2022
  11. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    So you're equating a ramp access for wheelchairs to a heated mirror on a car???
     
  12. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    5,425
    They are both "special" options that generally don't come as standard. The point is not about the specific of the items mentioned, it is an example to show that it is about the option, not about the person.

    If you are gonna say heated mirrors are common now, save the BS! I'm not playing word games I'm explaining the concept that it's not about the person, it's about the ramp.
     
  13. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Terrible analogy.
    Every citizen has the right to access their home.
    No citizen has the right to heated mirrors.


    It is their responsibility to put accessibility laws in place, so that citizens' rights asre met.

    "Most" is not how rights work.
    Every citizen has right to accessibility.


    Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA)*

    "...people with disabilities have the same opportunities as everyone else to participate in the mainstream of American life -- to enjoy employment opportunities, to purchase goods and services, and to participate in State and local government programs and services..."
    https://www.ada.gov/ada_intro.htm

    *Notice it is not called the Disabled Americans Act (DAA).

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    "Enforceable standards ... for new construction, alterations, program accessibility, and barrier removal."
    etc.
     
  14. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    17,300
    We got that.

    It's wrong.

    Many normal, everyday, voting, taxpaying Americans need stairs to get to their homes.
    Many normal, everyday, voting, taxpaying Americans need ramps or elevators to get to their homes.
    There is no "special".
     
  15. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    Every citizen has a right to access their home, ON THEIR OWN DIME!

    It is not the government's responsibility to ensure you can access your home.

    Every citizen has a right to a heated mirror, ON THEIR OWN DIME! If I go into a car dealer and say I want to order a car with a heated mirror, I have that right.

    Same goes for a person in a wheelchair. They have a right to call a carpenter and build a ramp for them, ON THEIR OWN DIME!
     
  16. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    17,300
    FFS, I keep forgetting that you 'muricans live in the 19th century. My bad.

    Ok, let's limit this discussion to the other 99% of the world that lives in the 21st century with a high standard living and a government whose purpose is to promote that standard of living for all its citizens.
     
  17. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    5,425
    Again, what is special is the ramp, that is a special order item.
     
  18. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Do they pay "special" taxes, get "special" votes?
    No. They are full citizens, like every other citizen.

    But yeah - sure. In America, screw your neighbour - it's dog eat dog.

    I'd be a cripple on America. I have astigmatism. Glasses are a "special need".
    I'd be dead in America. I have asthma. Life-saving Inhalers are a "special need".
     
  19. Motor Daddy Valued Senior Member

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    5,425
    Do ramps pay taxes, you mean? No, but if you buy a ramp YOU pay the tax!

    Are ramps citizens? Absolutely not! (...and they don't get a vote. )

    I think you are confusing ramps with people.
     
  20. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    17,300
    Here in the rest of the world, we recognize that homelessness is a symptom, not an identity.

    Simply providing houses has not made the homelessness go away, because there are myriad co-determinants in health and well-being of every citizen - mental health, physical health, debt, income, economy, discrimination - and a host of other factors that are in-play.

    If the root problem was, in fact, simple lack of housing, then a bunch of houses would make homelessness vanish. It doesn't. People who are homeless very often do not have the facilities to get or keep that roof over their head, for the above reasons, and many more.

    And you cannot address the root problem by addressing just one symptom. You must look at the their larger circumstances, and the set of those will be as unique as the people are. Which is why it's not a very easy solution. Nobody wants to look at the individual circumstances of a person who can't pay them anything.

    Nonetheless, being homeless does not remove their dignity as people. They need to be seen as people first, with unique needs - not as a one-size-fits-all label.
     
  21. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    7,369
    i suspect you have miss spelled it

    twa tionary is how you have spelt it
    but i believe the consonant is needed to finish the word
    twat tionary

    "twat" is english UK vernacular for idiot

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  22. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    fast people
    slow people
    rich people
    poor people
    homeless people
    black people
    white people
    racist people
    woke people

    these people are . . . sexy ?
    these are not people these are homeless . . . ?
    homeless is people too . . . ?

    "The Homeless" . . . are they people ?
     
  23. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    8,668
    That may fall under healthcare and long term disability though, which can be part of a government healthcare program.

    I find that for many, unless something afflicts them personally, they don’t see it as “their problem.”
     

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