The irrelevance of God

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Magical Realist, Oct 8, 2013.

  1. Mazulu Banned Banned

    In Baleron's defense, I think he's led a sheltered life. Everything that he experiences is filtered through this machine-like logic of his. Baleron has never really experienced life.
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  3. rr6 Banned Banned

    Irrlevance of Ultra Macro Scale To Us Earhtians

    I.e.the irrelevance of macro-scale to us Earthians.

    Humans are the only biologicals we know of that ponder macro-micro existence and its cosmic or Earthian relevance.


    Ultra macro-OUT<> OUT

    Round and round and round we go,
    where thoughts stop,
    knowbody knows.

    Some ponder on high,
    and others on low,
    seeking the relevance,
    and existence,
    of a cosmic mojo.

    Popping in and out,
    relevant or not,
    concepts, ideas,
    a cosmic plot?

    Some think not,
    others think knot,
    some think of jello,
    or a beautiful halo.

    Poems and verse,
    perhaps anger or terse,
    love is the attraction,
    our muscles contraction.

    Typing the keys,
    notes in our heads,
    spewing out words,
    before long we are dead.

    Cosmic scenario,
    of what have we need,
    Universe of Gods,
    our ending indeed.

    Back to our roots,
    Gods cosmic whole,
    dispersed as bacteria,
    or Godforsaken black hole.

    Time is evolving,
    changes our way,
    relevant the family,
    we all have our say.
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  5. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    High up on your horse, eh?
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  7. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    But this is not all what the conversation in question was about.

    If you say "I saw an angel" and someone replies "No, you didn't" this is different from replying "I don't believe you."

    The first reply is making a claim about you (and angels), the second one about the speaker.

    People (theists and atheists) often conflate the two, but the two kinds of replies say different things.

    One can readily make valid claims about oneself, about one's own mental, emotional, perceptional states. But barely ever (if at all) about other people's.
  8. cole grey Hi Valued Senior Member

    But if someone is saying, "I don't believe angels can possibly be real, therefore you saw something else, or hallucinated", they are really saying something about phenomena. Not to say balerion can't be totally wrong about angels or angels of death or mystical beings or whatever. Just that it is fair for someone to say, "this phenomenon is not actually what it appears, according to x y or z evidence". This is quite distinct from telling someone that the dream they had where god spoke to them wasn't god, or that some special coincidence was not something that has a spiritual relevance, and is just chance, i.e. trying to force an interpretation. Once we move out of the realm of interpretation into the realm of actual events of a magical nature, one would have to be careful not to expect an understanding response.
  9. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Obviously, you weren't awake and were still dreaming.
  10. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    All those Christians who deny the importance of Zeus, Thor, Allah, etc. are not being honest. See how that works?
  11. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Can we not assume that the reality we all share is the true and valid one, a reality that has never shown such entities to exist?
  12. Mazulu Banned Banned

    Physical reality is agreed upon. But men cannot live by physical reality alone. Spiritual reality will not go away no matter how much education is brought to bare. Spiritual reality is a permanent part of human consciousness; it cannot be suppressed without creating mental illness. The best you can do is teach meditation and mindfulness to alleviate stress. You must allow people to express there spirituality.
  13. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    No. The sentence still contains "I don't believe" and this contextualizes everything else in it. Unless you consider the very speaker of said sentence to be another one of the phenomena.

    Sure, if phrased that way.

    The way I see it, the basic problem with assertiveness, and proper formulation/contextualization, is that it renders one more humble than one might like to appear.
  14. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

    Not by you, it isn't.

    They can and they do.

    Yes, your delusions and fantasies appear to be completely repulsed by education.

    It would appear your delusions and fantasies are indeed the result of mental illness.

    Seek professional help, immediately. That would be the best you could do.
  15. Yazata Valued Senior Member

    "I saw an angel" is ambiguous. It might mean 'I saw some existing entity out there in the objective world, and that entity was an angel'. Or it might mean, 'I had a subjective experience that I interpret as seeing an angel'. The latter version might still be true even if angels don't exist in reality.

    If the other person is claiming to have observed some kind of being or phenomenon out in the wider world whose existence is questionable, then it's not unreasonable to question it. Doubt isn't out of place. (I'm very doubtful about whether Mazulu saw anything that had any objective existence apart from his subjective experience.)

    But if somebody is merely saying that they had the experience of seeing an angel, regardless of whether a real angel was there to be seen or not, then there's less grounds to question the claim. People obviously have all kinds of subjective experiences, some of them veridicial and some not.
  16. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    When someone claims to have seen an angel, people (at least here) don't typically reply by requiring more information about what the person means by this claim. Instead, they go straight to a Yes / No reply, without clarifying the terms.

    And my point has been all along that it makes a significant difference in how one expresses one's doubts.

    So am I. But you don't see me saying "No, you didn't see an angel, you just hallucinated, you should get your head examined."
  17. Mazulu Banned Banned

    Seeing an angel is probably an indication that everything in your head is working exactly as it should (either because nature intends for us to see angels or because the angels themselves want to reach out to us). I think there is some wrong with atheists who denigrate the supernatural experiences of others; these kinds of atheists are dark, evil, negative and oppressive to other human beings. They are blind to the beauty and inspiring effects of seeing angels. For this reason, atheism should be classified as a mental disorder.
  18. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    My my, high up on your horse, looking down on us little humanses ...
  19. Balerion Banned Banned

    But you want peace, right?

  20. Mazulu Banned Banned

    You are a beautiful person.

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  21. Balerion Banned Banned

    Even wynn sees through your bullshit. You're officially fooling no one.
  22. Mazulu Banned Banned

    Your whole world view is one dimensional. To you, the whole experience of life is about how smart you are and how dumb other people are. One dimensional thinking.
  23. wynn ˙ Valued Senior Member

    1220. Soiled by contempt (for others), destroyed by conceit, people fall into hell. Persons destroyed by conceit grieve for a long time upon being reborn in hell.

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