The tie that saved Rome. Do Western nations need a State Religion? The Western nations of today, like Rome in the days of Constantine, are being fractured by the plethora of religious and racial factions the emigration is causing. The Western nations are again being inundated by various religious militias and no go zones set up by religious and racial factions. All countries and large coalitions of countries need something to unite the populations and have it all move in the same direction when required. Religion is a good tool for uniting a country. Constantine was looking for stability and peace for Rome and decided that a State Religion was the way to unify Rome and its allies. He chose the least barbaric and belligerent religion in his day, Christianity, to be the tie that would bind the empire and other countries together. I see the Western religious forces of today doing the same as in Constantine’s day, fracturing the country and being an enemy to unity and peace. A house divided cannot stand, --- and history is repeating itself. To insure the survival of the Western ideology, in these times of religious strife and division, should the present Western political powers follow Constantine’s example and choose a State Religion? I am not suggesting that we send out this new religion to convert by the sword the way Christianity did. I think that we are intelligent enough today to debate the morality of the various religions to determine which is the most moral and the best for nations and the individuals within them. Constantine chose strength by numbers and not by ideology and I think we are mature enough today to choose by worthy morality and ideology. Is creating a State Religion the way to peace? Regards DL
Among other problems: It just may be that a state mandated religion(not shared by the bulk of the legions) was (at least partially) causal to the downfall of the western roman empire.
I believe your reading of history is incorrect. Constantine did not make Christianity the state religion. It is not clear that he ever converted, although he was much influenced by Christianity.
In my opinion, any religion can call itself the state religion if they want to, but they should be totally self supporting with no goverment support or funding. Religious people of any faith can do what they like within the law. In the UK parliament, the house of lords allows 26 bishops to vote. Now other religions are asking perhaps they should have representatives there also. So, just having more unelected (religious) people in the lords just makes the lords a lot more undemocratic. https://humanism.org.uk/campaigns/secularism/constitutional-reform/bishops-in-the-lords/ Further down that page... My bold.
It took what, 150 years to fall after Rome made Christianity it's state religion and by then, thanks to the laws against pagens that included death, the legions would have all been Christian. Regards DL
Seriously? Look at that history for the first time in terms of the laws and the Roman state religion. Constantine’s laws against free thought and why Christianity became the Western religion. Here is some history. It's a list of Roman laws starting around Constantine’s time and extending forward from there. I'll bold and underline the killers for those with limited time. Quote: http://www.fourthcentury.com/index.php/imperial-laws-364/ 313CE Oct 31 Certain catholic clerics are being harassed by heretics so that compulsory public services are too much for them to bear. They should be relieved of their civic duties, and replacements found, and in the future, clerics should not be forced to fulfill compulsory public services. 318CE June 23 Constantine gives Christians the right to take their cases before an ecclesiastical court rather than a secular court. The ruling of those bishops will carry the same authority as a secular court. 325CE Constantine exhorts the Alexandrians to follow the Nicene faith, which he praises, and to disavow Arius, whom he condemns. The council is to be regarded as the will of God. 326CE Sept 1 Exemption from compulsory public services shall only be granted to clergy of the Catholic Church, and not to heretics or schismatics. 327CE Constantine invites Arius to his court, where he may end his exile by confessing the Nicene faith before Constantine. Arius is allowed to use public transportation. 333 or 327CE Constantine orders that Arians now be referred to as Porphyrians, that all works of Arius or Arians be burned, and that anyone hiding a work of Arius suffer capital punishment. Constantine sends a long, belittling letter to Arius and his followers. At the end, he threatens to heavily fine the Arians and force them to accept compulsory public services unless they immediately return to the catholic faith. If Arius returns, he promises to be lenient. 341CE Pagan superstition and sacrifices are completely forbidden, in accord with the law set forth by Constantine. 346CE Dec 1 Pagan temples are to be closed; access to them is denied, and violators face capital punishment. The property of a violator will be given to the state treasury. Governors who fail to carry out this punishment will be punished. 347CE The Donatists were ordered to be reconciled with the Catholic Church in North Africa. Those who refused were to be exiled or killed. 352 July 3 Persons who join Judaism from Christianity, if the accusation can be proven, shall have their property confiscated and given to the state treasury. 353 Nov 23 Night-time pagan sacrifices, which had briefly been allowed under the usurper Magnentius, are again forbidden. 356 Feb 20 Those guilty of idolatry or pagan sacrifices must suffer capital punishment. 362 Julian castigates the pagan Alexandrians, who had murdered Athanasius’ rival archbishop George when he ruined the temple of the local god Serapis. They should not have broken the law, but should have taken out their grievances legally. No Christians are allowed to teach the pagan classics (essentially debarring them from being teachers). Any student may study them, however. 370CE Feb 17 Laws formerly enacted against Christians under Julian shall have no validity, and policies of the late Constantius are to be upheld. 372CE Mar 2 Manichaeans and similar groups may not assemble. Their teachers will be punished, their followers segregated, and their places of gathering confiscated. 377CE Oct 17 Any who teaches a second baptism is to desist and be restored to the Catholic Church. The uncorrupted faith of the Evangelists and Apostles must be preserved. Furthermore, properties where re-baptizers or other expelled persons gather are to be confiscated. 379 Aug 3 All heresies are forbidden. One may hold to heretical teachings in his own mind but is forbidden to teach them to others, especially the teaching of re-baptism. Assemblies of those who hold to re-baptism are forbidden, and none may teach this doctrine. 380CE Feb 28 This edict is sometimes referred to as “Cunctos Populos.” Everyone in the empire shall be part of the religion that believes in God as a single Deity of Father, Son and Holy Spirit – the Holy Trinity, as taught by St. Peter to the Romans, and now taught by Damasus of Rome and Peter of Alexandria. Only those following this rule shall be called “Catholic Christians.” Meeting places of those who follow another religion (including heretics of a Christian variety) shall not be given the status of churches, and such people may be subject to both divine and earthly retribution. 381 Jan 10 Heretics shall have no place of meeting. Heretics are defined as those who do not observe the Nicene faith. The Phontinians, Arians, Eunomians and others are specified, but not exclusively. Their teachings are forbidden. A definition of the Trinity and the term ousia is established. Catholic churches throughout the empire are to be returned to orthodox bishops. Heretics are to be driven out of the churches and the cities. The property rights of Manichaeans are revoked, and property inherited from a Manichaean which should have been confiscated by the state is now to be confiscated. Manichaeans are forbidden to gather. 381 May Christians who have converted to paganism shall not be allowed to make a will, and any will made by such a person is invalidated. Manichaeans may not inherit property or leave it to others through wills, and any property inherited from a Manichaean is to be confiscated. The only exception is the child of a Manichaean who converts to the Catholic faith. Also, Manichaean assemblies and sacraments are prohibited. 381 July It is forbidden for Arians, Eunomians, or followers of Aetius to build churches. If any such churches are built, they will be confiscated. 391CE Persons with inherited rank or status who abandon Christianity shall lose their position and be branded with infamy. Heretics are to be driven from cities, villages, and communities. They are not able to hold public meetings or secret gatherings. so on and so forth... the jackboot is in. Regards DL
I think the British system sucks. Britain touts itself as a democratic nation with all citizens being equal under the law, yet it's state religion does not practice equality and has discriminated against women till just recently. Mind you, the church still limits women from the highest church offices. So much for the queen helping her own gender gain equality in her church. If unelected clergy had a vote in our system, there would be a revolt to that revolting practice. I hope. Regards DL
