The Trump Presidency

Discussion in 'Politics' started by joepistole, Jan 17, 2017.

  1. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    26,558
    Of course. That would be incompetent, a recipe for disaster - that's how wars start, even (and this one never ended).
     
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  3. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    A milder mannered, more forgiving, less pointedly ungentle approach to my take on the role of cowardice in the rise of the modern Republican Party:
    http://crookedtimber.org/2018/06/13...e-extraordinary-populist-delusions-of-crowds/
    Which is my basic explanation for the canonization of Reagan, the re-election of W, and the state of the entire Republican Party since Iran-Contra broke into the news. A bunch of adult white men can't face the nature or the magnitude of what they have done, and in particular the realization that they were warned - that there are a whole bunch of people they publicly despised and publicly mocked, out there, and these people were in fact right. Repeatedly. About them.
     
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  5. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    Do the people of NK know that Stalin is dead? ~poetic license #156/4576

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    I think that the Western world chronically underestimates the significant "poverty of world view" that the NK people and government has.
    I believe Trump would have been surprised by the degree and intensity of the echo chamber that Kim is living within. Surrounded by old guard Korean war trauma victims telling him what to do and how to look at their long term enemy the USA
    The replacement of key persons in the Kim administration just before the summit with younger persons, I believe, indicates that Kim is preparing to move into the 21st century.

    I don't think the USA summit team was fully prepared for the significance of this "culture shock" and Trump just did what he had to do when realizing in his meetings with Kim the sheer scale of the problem, when having to deal with such traumatized and isolated people.
     
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  7. Bells Staff Member

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    Oh I'm sorry.

    You expected me to take your blatant trolling and flaming seriously?

    I'll be blunt. You got the response that you deserved.

    What? You cannot explain why you are trying to change the subject?

    I don't think you quite understand what taking something out of context means. For example, I say this:

    I have provided a few highlights, since you still refuse to read what has actually been written and when this is pointed out to you in a bid to stop your trolling, you whine about being abused.

    You then responded to that with this:

    That gem, came a few posts after you posted this gem:

    Now, read what you wrote and then scroll back up and read the bits that I bolded and then tell me why I should take you seriously?

    Do you not see how you keep contradicting yourself?

    And you have the temerity to whine about being taken out of context?

    You find pointing out the abject and very real harm he is causing to 25 million people on a daily basis abusive?

    That says a lot about you. Then again, you have not exactly deviated from course, so it should really be a case of more of the same..

    Not the kind he wanted. He wanted legitimacy.

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    And he got it.

    In spades.

    He also got a reduction of military preparedness from the US and South Korea, as well as security guarantees and a promise to lift sanctions against his country. What did Trump get? A vague promise from a policy Kim Jong Un had released in April that demanded all countries disarm before they disarm and praising the fact that they were now a nuclear nation..

    That sigh is in response to inane trolling.

    Can you please explain why you keep ignoring the fact that you have repeatedly declared that this summit and so called agreement is similar to what the Americans apparently got from Japan to get them to surrender, while blatantly ignoring the fact that the US had dropped nuclear bombs on Japan to force them to surrender? Can you please explain how and why you choose to completely change history to suit your ridiculous invented narrative about North Korea?

    Can you also please explain why you deliberately choose to ignore the suffering of 25 million people and why you claimed they are his crimes of the past, when that ill treatment, torture, starvation, imprisonment in gulags and indoctrination camps, outright murder of citizens by the State, systematic rapes of women and children, forced abortion, continues to this day?

    You have made some obscene statements in this discussion, QQ. Asking you to answer for them is not abusive. So stop trying to change the subject and stop dodging.

    Ah, "with good reason". Something you completely lack.

    This is yet another example of you carrying water for murderous dictators. Poor Kim, so misunderstood when he ordered his own family members killed, from his uncle, aunt, brother and god knows how many others, when he randomly purges his ministers and military members for not showing enough reverence and to consolidate his power, when he had people massacred for not crying enough at his father's funeral and to show how he was a strong leader...

    Ya, that's the guy that wants democracy..

    How about you stop trolling?

    I mean, it's dishonest enough that you post, and then edit it completely and entirely after I had already responded to the original post. Can't say I am surprised really...
     
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  8. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    sorry but abusive posters deserve no response...
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2018
  9. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    18,237
  10. Dr_Toad It's green! Valued Senior Member

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    Wow. You said that with no thought of the irony...

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  11. Bells Staff Member

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    But murderous dictators do deserve a response, praise and pats on the back...
     
  12. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    5,131
    Of course they do, that's why we support Saudi Arabia.
     
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  13. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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  14. Bells Staff Member

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    Don't even get me started on Saudi Arabia...
     
  15. Bells Staff Member

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    Or perhaps you can actually answer the questions posed to you.. You know, in a thread about Trump and his actions in legitimising Kim Jong Un and recognising his dictatorship as he did and praising him to kingdom come over the last 2 days...

    Unless you want me to question you about your latest revision of history in that thread as well?

    Because I could go to town on this...

    And it is "reunification", not unification. The unification of Germany happened in 1871. You know, for future reference. At the very least open a history book when dealing with subjects like this. Makes the rest of our lives much easier.
     
  16. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    I am not going to respond to an abusive poster.
     
  17. Bells Staff Member

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    It wasn't abusive QQ.

    Because you have made some factual claims in this thread that is provably false and you should answer for them.

    So I will post the questions again:

    Can you please explain why you keep ignoring the fact that you have repeatedly declared that this summit and so called agreement is similar to what the Americans apparently got from Japan to get them to surrender, while blatantly ignoring the fact that the US had dropped nuclear bombs on Japan to force them to surrender? Can you please explain how and why you choose to completely change history to suit your ridiculous invented narrative about North Korea?

    Can you also please explain why you deliberately choose to ignore the suffering of 25 million people and why you claimed they are his crimes of the past, when that ill treatment, torture, starvation, imprisonment in gulags and indoctrination camps, outright murder of citizens by the State, systematic rapes of women and children, forced abortion, continues to this day?​

    Seattle had to correct you in the other thread as well for the same claims you made about the Japanese surrender, which you completely ignored and posted yet further revision of reality and history.
     
  18. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    18,237
    I do not wish to respond to a person with a history of abusive posting.. thank you for your understanding...
     
  19. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    Click to be, like the rest of us, ruined.

    Gaslighting? (Why call someone out like that [#2807↑] in the first place?)

    Gaslighting? (Insupportable.)

    Gaslighting? (The entire post at #2807 is more about attempting to provoke a fight than anything else.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (Your tinfoil thesis is itself extraordinary compared to history.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (Your tinfoil thesis is purely speculative.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (Your out here is that you're not really trying.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (Your out here is that you're not really trying.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (Your out here is that you're not really trying.)

    Gaslighting? (Okay, it's not really an out; you're just not trying.)

    Gaslighting?

    Gaslighting? (If you keep asking, sure, someone will eventually step up and help you out that way.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (The problem here might well be any pretense on your part of expecting to be taken seriously when pushing speculative tinfoil; the alternative, of course, is that you really do expect to be taken seriously.)

    Gaslighting? (Maybe you should have something to say about the issue that isn't speculative tinfoil with no better purpose than conducting yourself in a willfully abusive manner.)

    Gaslighting? (Cynicism in lieu of anything more useful just isn't helpful, but if it's all you've got, then, sure, I can see why you'd try it. Still, though, insofar as you think you have a point, your abusive focus on Bells doesn't mean you haven't already skipped out on this point↑. Don't worry, Quantum Quack, I get it: I'm not the woman you're out to abuse, y'sly ol' gaslight, you.)

    Gaslighting? (You and your abuse fantasies.)

    Gaslighting? (Why go out of your way to pick fights like that?)

    Which is problematic, of course.

    Oh, right: Gaslighting? (More fool me for thinking you stuck a serious answer in the middle of your self-gratifying bacchanal of abuse.)

    Gaslighting or quackery? (He knows, but he's not going to tell anyone!)

    Gaslighting? (Which might explain why you're so lazy about justifying your abusive behavior.)

    Gaslighting? (What happened to make you such a gaslight, Quantum Quack? I am sure there are many here at Sciforums that would like to know why you hate Koreans so much as to go out of your way to seek a woman to abuse in order to make whatever point gets your gaslit quackery off.)

    †​

    Note: Whether you're trying to make a point about Trumpism, tinfoil, or whatever else—or, hey, even genuinely venting your gaslight—I tend to think these occasions require a bit more effort than you bothered to put in. It's one thing to suggest, for instance, that I find your take on the Kim and Trump regimes somewhat odd, because, well, I do; even still, though, I can hold myself answered, after your fartflame exposition, that it wasn't a genuine take in the first place. In that aspect, I would at least remind that maybe the boys are supposed to chuckle at your performance according to some obscure context, but I long ago promised myself I had ceased to be amazed at the sorts of things we're supposed to chuckle at according to some exclusive context, like grabbing them by the pussy, or pissing on them as they lay dying on a sidewalk.
     
  20. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

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    18,237
    Do you have any specific questions about any of my opinions expressed?
     
  21. Quantum Quack Life's a tease... Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,237
    Meanwhile:
    A Trump quote c/o abc.net

    "We're not going to be doing the war games as long as we're negotiating in good faith," Mr Trump told Fox News Channel in an interview in Singapore after the summit.

    Is this reasonable?
     
  22. Bells Staff Member

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    22,669
    You have yet to actually explain any of your opinions and you are yet to explain why you completely revised history as you did..

    Despite repeated requests for you to do so.

    Requests you deem to constitute 'abuse', despite those requests not being abusive.

    The irony, of course, is that you refuse to answer questions posed about your revising history because you think daring to question your reasoning is abusive, but you are openly defending one of the right for one of the worst murderous dictators of our time to be recognised, listened to and praised for the sake of supposedly saving billions of lives, while repeatedly and openly ignoring the plight of 25 million people he leads through fear, murder, gulags, rapes and indoctrination camps.

    So I dare ask, why ask if anyone has questions, when you have repeatedly refused to answer any questions when it comes to your expressed opinions.

    Here are some questions about the opinions you expressed:

    Can you please explain why you keep ignoring the fact that you have repeatedly declared that this summit and so called agreement is similar to what the Americans apparently got from Japan to get them to surrender, while blatantly ignoring the fact that the US had dropped nuclear bombs on Japan to force them to surrender? Can you please explain how and why you choose to completely change history to suit your ridiculous invented narrative about North Korea?

    Can you also please explain why you deliberately choose to ignore the suffering of 25 million people and why you claimed they are his crimes of the past, when that ill treatment, torture, starvation, imprisonment in gulags and indoctrination camps, outright murder of citizens by the State, systematic rapes of women and children, forced abortion, continues to this day?​

    Why are you refusing to answer them?

    Can you please explain why you have decided to invent a narrative about North Korea and Kim Jong Un, that is blatantly false?

    Can you please explain why you have refused to answer any questions (from myself and others) about your revision of history in this and the Korea thread?
     
  23. Bells Staff Member

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    22,669
    Trump later said in his press conference that he was going to halt regional war games because they were unnecessarily provocative (for which he received nothing in return), surprising the South Koreans and the Pentagon. It is still unclear how and why that announcement happened, but last January The Wall Street Journal reported this, which offers a clue:

    Mr. Trump had an idea about how to counter the nuclear threat posed by North Korea, which he got after speaking to Russian President Vladimir Putin: If the U.S. stopped joint military exercises with the South Koreans, it could help moderate Kim Jong Un’s behavior.
    It's nice of Putin to offer Trump such advice, but any other U.S. president might have been just a little bit skeptical of his motives. It serves the Russian president's interests to drive a wedge between the U.S. and its allies and hasten an American withdrawal from the region. One imagines that Chinese President Xi Jinping was equally pleased to see Trump take that advice and seek nothing in return. Everyone's happy but America's allies.

    North Korean state media reported that Trump offered the concession personally during the two leaders' 45-minute unrecorded meeting, which raises the question why it wasn't included in the written agreement
    .
    How reasonable do you think it is?

    North Korea have also stated that Trump also offered to lift sanctions in their one on one meeting (there were no recorders or advisers in the room). So which liar do you believe?
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2018

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