Three perspectives on why man is God’s master.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Greatest I am, Apr 25, 2017.

  1. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Three perspectives on why man is God’s master.

    Perspective 1.

    Has man forgotten his rightful place as God’s master?

    A theology makes you a slave to your God while the Jesus that Gnostic Christians follow has man take his rightful place as God’s master. After all, all the Gods are man-made. That is why Gnostic Christianity has always put man ahead of God. The Karaite Jews have that view as well as their oral tradition can overrule the written Torah and God himself, showing how old this tradition or ideology is.

    It seems that without the lie of a supernatural God, people are not willing to have a man be God the way the ancients used to do. Emperors used to name themselves God and their sons, sons of God.


    One of the Jesus' that the church did not silence, tells us that that is the right way to think when he said, instead of stoning people on the Sabbath, that the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath. I extrapolate from that, that Jesus would also say that religions and gods were made for man and not man for religions. Jesus answered them, is it not written in your law, I said, Yee are gods?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D

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    Perspective 2.

    Does the Bible show that our next God is a Man?

    The Bible states that when Jesus returns, his elect will make themselves known and elect him to rule over them. The Bible states that our new Jesus will not be recognizable and he will be elected by his Words.
    Remember that the story tellers, in one of the sequels, have named Jesus. --- The Word.

    The Abrahamic Karaite oral tradition is that Rabbis, men generally, can overrule the written Word of God. In real language, this means that the interpretation of words and terms is to always be governed by men of the Divine Council and their elected God.

    The voice of a man, to the Bible, --- is supreme and above God’s written words. That is as it should be as nature makes the ideal of all species to be one of their own. If a God cannot be or is not in our true image, then God is not worthy of us. This is the logic and reason why the rule of man over written tradition must be supreme. Anything else would be humankind giving up our natures for the nature of an alien form. God forbid.

    More directly to the question. The Bible states that we are to kill witches. This, at that time, meant that men were not to let themselves be fooled by magicians or alchemists and other tricksters who might deceive them. This meant that nothing magical or supernatural, no magician doing illusions, etc., should be put above the spoken word.

    The policy of the Divine Council was to rule by the tenet called the Golden Rule. The Rabbi class thus had the final say in all religious and political matters. The Divine Council would choose whom to anoint and follow as their Prophet/God/King.

    Does this ultimately show that God was a man to the Jews who wrote the Bible? Is that why they were so unafraid to change Gods name so often?

    Where Jews the first atheists? Closely followed by the Gnostic that had used Jewry as a springboard to their better Universalist creed? Is that why Rome hated Jews and Gnostic Christian?

    If the Jews interpreted the word God as a man, the way the old Roman emperors did, then was placing a supernatural God up in heaven a poor theological position for us today.

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    Perspective 3.

    Does as above so below mean that God must abide by man’s laws?

    Jesus said to give to Caesar what is Caesars. Caesar makes the laws we live by and no religion is true to the laws set out by their Gods. Thank God as those laws are quite barbaric. For example, both Yahweh and Allah, through the mouths of men, promote stoning for adultery and sundry other sins. This of course ignores that both Gods show justice as being close to an eye for an eye which is what secular laws try to gauge punishment by.

    There is a military term that says that the pace to be set by the troops is as fast as the slowest man. This is so that no man is left behind.

    Since we have collectively decided that secular law is superior to the laws of heaven and God, does that mean that when Jesus return, he will validate secular law and ask us to follow Caesar?

    Regards
    DL
     
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  3. Ted Grant II Registered Senior Member

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    He was called the WORD because Christian thinkers were desperate to find "prophecies" in the Old Testament that Jesus would come to save the world. They noticed that the WORD was mentioned a lot in the Old Testament, so they thought that must be Jesus. It seemed to fool some people, so I guess they did a good job.
     
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  5. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Indeed. Many have believed the lies that Christianity has propagated.

    There is a lot of money involved so it is not surprising that the better liars and con men will gravitate into religious scams.

    Regards
    DL
     
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  7. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Don't you belong to your religious organization which sells books to make money by selling its own opinion
     
  8. kx000 Valued Senior Member

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    God is your own wishes and dreams, and naturally the strongest thing ever.
     
  9. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    I think he is his own religion.

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  10. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Absolutely, but I do not know of any Gnostic Church that have aggrandized itself the way the mainstream religions have with their massive and almost always empty cathedrals, churches or mosques.

    I like to think Gnostic Christianity is a better buy for any seekers buck as we seek God and do not idol worship the homophobic and misogynous Gods that the mainstream have on offer. We measure our worth by our morals and not by some heavenly pie in the sky prize that the mainstream lie to their sheeple about.

    Regards
    DL
     
  11. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Exactly, and those you find if you go inside of yourself and find what Jung and Freud called our Father Complex.

    Our instincts hide somewhere within us and that is what Freud & Jung found in everyone.

    The dream you speak of is your inner Father's ideas of how to have you make yourself the fittest of our species.

    Inside is also where your right brain hemisphere is, and the sages say that that is what we access when we open our third or single eye.

    It is quite a trip.

    Regards
    DL
     
  12. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Exactly. That is what Jesus preached we all must do to gain enlightenment. That is what he was doing, and if he lived at all, that is why the Jews had him killed.

    Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

    John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

    Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

    Regards
    DL
     
  13. birch Valued Senior Member

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    3,778
    i'm not entirely convinced a god doesn't exist but it's not for the usual reasons. as neil degrassi simply said we are the universe. if a god is a consciousness and a greater power, i see human machinations as the same consciousness but on a micro scale and those who take power to represent best what that god is. this includes the most seediest or underhanded too as these are also tools and thoughts. i've witnessed how some people seem protected by some unseen force, not the more positive they are, but the more evil they are because darkness has power. this is why even if there was an organism/god/collective consciousness, it's not respectable as it doesn't care how, when or why whatsoever but just power.

    from what i've experienced and witnessed about life, history and the interplay between good vs evil here, i liken us being stuck inside a larger psychopath/sociopath and it will always favor the dark or it's the pets of the gods as they hold the real reigns/base power because of the law/lay of the land. if someone is going to be sacrificed and there is a choice, it's not going to be them. i know this because i've witnessed time and time again and not just in my life but a theme of innocence and light being exploited and not vice versa. then eventually you have this tainted, bastardized and obscured form between the mixture of dark/light and much of the garbage we worship or think is top quality. but whenever occasionally the true, unadulterated seed of good dare show it's face or pops up somewhere like it came from a proverbial heaven (poor thing), the hounds of hell are on it like white on rice to make sure it doesn't get out of hand or grow or to do it's original un-compromised true ethical mission, it will take over it and make sure it's not as good as it could have been. if it doesn't cooperate with their corruption, it will be bullied, tortured and even destroyed. why? because they hold the real power here. yeah, that's where we are. that jesus christ metaphor is a theme. the god of this universe is the devil.
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2017
  14. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    You must live a cursed life my friend. You seem to think there is a lot of evil out there, while in reality, we are doing quite well on all the evil fronts as all the major markers for evil are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed, per capita.

    Mind you, Trump might be the exception to the above. That aside but witt leadership in mind, have a quick peek at a couple of links you should see to help you see some of the positives going on in the world, as well as my musings that I might us as an O.P. if I think it worthy in the future. I will likely take the God references out and make it pure political but I am undecided. Perhaps if you are moved to opine, any suggestions would be well received.

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    Can Truth in guidance only be ours, if our future Political and Religious Gods are demographers?

    What is primary to good governance is the statistical information it works with. Only with this statistical and information base can the world know what is thought to be the real truth of all things.

    Presidents and Religious con men manipulate our focus; deflecting it away from our various demographic markers. This prevents us from living in more security, which is not the goal of our Masters. They want us to go to them for truth. They care only for their benefit and not that of the whole demography.

    The world needs a new President or God in the image of Hans Rosling. We create all of our Gods so this should not be a problem for humankind.

    I invite you to listen to a few minutes of this good man’s presentation and imagine what he, representing us, would do if he could manipulate, for the world’s benefit, the various bubbles he works with. Wow! Right?

    Of course, in a free world, the bubbles would have to voluntarily move.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbkSRLYSojo

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ezVk1ahRF78

    We are at the point in time where we can, (basically), rather easily control most important aspects of life; should we choose to do so. I think we should make it so as the world wants globalization.

    This would entail the world’s countries giving more meaning to their U.N. membership. This would lead to a head demographer who, if as good a man as Hans Rosling is, would the speed up our collective passage to civilization and world peace.

    I suggest that the world would be well served if it would nominate demographer to lead us so that we can get this show on the road.
    Everyone wants a voice in their future. Without demographic control, you can never have that. For all of us to be heard, --- and thus be relevant to the whole, --- we must all be in the same socio economic demographic pyramid. I think people will all be in the same tribe in the future because of globalization of economics which will force us into participating in a one world socio economic demographic pyramid.

    Demographers, or those who rely heavily on them and their data, must rule in the future if we are to seek the truth of reality and be relevant to the world.

    Do you agree?

    Regards
    DL
     
  15. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    A miracle working God would be like a witch with us not being able to differentiate between magic and miracle.

    The bible advises that witches should not be suffered to live.

    That seems like good advice in terms of a God as man does not want to live under a tyranny and that is what the mainstream Gods pre3sently promise.

    What does man need with a God?
    We have already shown that in laws and rules to live life by, we have already written better than the mainstream homophobic and misogynous Gods.

    Regards
    DL
     
  16. birch Valued Senior Member

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    3,778
    yeah, keep believing that until world war 3 comes.

    and my point was more of how nature/universe operates. those same people who 'cursed' me have lived a well-off life enjoying the fruits of what you speak. victims can only be philosophical about it. the human 'invention' part is the undeserved good citizenry/moral facade people pat eachother on the back with when it's not like that or how they operate or what dirty deeds they did to get there. all these social mantras such as 'reap what you sow' etc are extremely insulting because it is blind to how nature is so manipulative. i didn't sow the bad in my life but i am the one who paid for it. that's like saying if i cut your face with a knife and scar you, you reaped what you sow. the universe doesn't work in this cookie cutter fashion. the LIES and the ignorance!!! i think that is probably the most insulting part to victims.

    people, depending on which side of the glass they are standing and peering through, will have a different perspective. no wonder there are those who really don't want to have to do much with society because of all their bullshit!
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2017
  17. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Thanks Birch.

    I would rather work at winning the competitions that evolution forces on me when my default of cooperation has failed to produce the better life that instincts tell us is enhanced, survival wise by cooperation.

    Don't get mad or philosophical. Get even.

    Regards
    DL
     
  18. birch Valued Senior Member

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    3,778
    the other thing i take notice of is how most of the theists i have known who believe in the one and only god according to them, stems from a rather primal instinct but they were immoral/unethical, conniving and hypocritical people. the oxymoron or contradiction or was it?

    but it isn't, it's sort of that old testament thing. it's not about the technicalities, if you read between the lines, it's about hate, fear, oppression, predation and power. it blends seamlessly and well integrated with the functions of nature. it was something to take note of, for sure. what makes them formidable is because they believe they are justified and are staunch about it. all that is in religion which they espouse is conveniently twisted to fit their narrative so forgiveness, revenge, judgement, anger, jealousy, hatred etc is just what they justify while demonizing the other as ungodly or wrong. they also are tribal and lesser wrongs committed by another will be more harshly judged than even worse ones by their own (kind). it seems to be more than just religion but a 'nature' and that nature/disposition seems to incline one to a type of religion and that is why many of them are similar. not because they are part of the same religion but because they are the same intrinsically. they have a very conservative (dinosaur) type personality and their kindness/consideration is reserved for mostly of their own ilk. there is something peculiarly very similar to them or primitive about their character, regardless of race/gender. i suspect it is indicative of nature's primordial roots. well, i know because birds of a feather flock together sort of thing.

    ding, ding...what i realized was it wasn't the 'religion' so much as the universe/nature/roots..where they originate..god/nature. it is primordial and it ain't ethical and it ain't nice. it is about self preservation, selfishness and power at base/root.

    i mean, we tend to be oblivious or forget in modern society just what a brutal start and design nature really is. claws and fangs are not just the stuff of nightmares, it is where we are at and that nature still exist in people, some more than others.

    the other truth is that, if you look underneath the facade of religion, all the motives are very darwinian so even atheists really shouldn't have a problem with it.

    the only people who should have a major problem with religion is 1) obstruction of science 2) ethical concerns. for those where ethical concerns are considered not real or unimportant, then it would just be number one.

    the problem and where i disagree with both religionists and atheists (strict) is that 1) even if it were proven to be true that a god created this shithole, i still don't agree with the asshole so moot to me and i won't be bowing to it's ass 2) as for atheists, scientists, darwinists etc, i don't agree that it's survival of the fittest as it's 'presented' because there is two differing mechanisms at work, destruction (dark) vs production (light) and either can work as a means to an end. this means that one can lower standards and competition by destruction or one can meet or strive for higher standards. so it's hypocritical to assume that everyone who survives or makes it is 'fit'. the question would also be fit in what way? fit in cunning, dishonesty, lies, destruction? because that is also a reality of nature.

    this is why society and nature is the way it is, both scum and saints can rise to the top. some do it on their own effort, some do it by sacrificing or stomping on others.

    survival of the fittest is an eye roller but very understandable from the perspective of ego but does not always indicate honor or the deserving.

    This is just one snippet and one area of society/life. Just one, among MANY and it's not the only type of crime. It is true, the underbelly is where people hide and do their shit. where do you/people think we are? why would i give a rat's ass or flying fuck about a GOD who would create either such disgusting lifeforms or such a predatious/parasitic/nasty design??? i hope there is no god because if there is, that's fukin terrible if it's intentional.

    i think the only salvation is if people do turn to biotechnology and become more robotic and less human because at least that way, they can't hurt eachother as much. Nature can produce such disgusting, corrupt and filthy lifeforms.

     
    Last edited: May 16, 2017
  19. birch Valued Senior Member

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    3,778
    On a positive note, i liken the good here is to try and make this place tolerable and eliminate much of the misery it can. it will never be perfect or right but there is also good here and if it wasn't for that, it would be utter and total hell. unfortunately, some abuse it and undeserving of it but the rain falls on the just and unjust like.

    but when it comes to the laws of nature, i wouldn't create such a sick and sadistic system even for my worst enemy. where life is forced to feed on life is bad enough and makes you guilty just by default and then there are those who don't care at all and greedily to gratuitious levels is even worse. it's interesting that our consciousness can develop to be aware to the point to evaluate and judge the proverbial maker. this is all esoteric but i don't think that there is just one god. i think god is who you happen to worship or emulate. if evil is your god, then that is what you emulate or approve of, if it's the opposite, then so be it etc. it is a choice and i think wherever good originally derived from, even if it's a candle in a dark room, even if it dosesn't have the most power is not the issue because power alone does not equate to quality or good. i think is important to hold the faith and not give into what we know is not right.

    i think this universe is inherently dualistic and has irreconcilable differences. its not complementary but is rather one of those forced situations. the struggle, misery and pain will end when this universe does.
     
  20. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    What you say of religions applies to all of us to a certain extent.

    If they want to allow their minds to disfuntionally believe in the supernatural.

    I disagree here. As you stated above, it is all Darwinian and thus we should not foul up our natural evolution with robotics.

    Being all Darwinian, I think we serve ourselves better by recognizing that and work to control our instincts. Our technology has perhaps even hurt our evolution already as our weaker do not just die off and the whole must now have a larger, graph line, with more people at the negative end of the human excellence curve. Natural eugenics is still going on but we have thrown a wrench in the gears and it is costing us as a species.

    Meet my favorite sociologist and not that we have gone from a tribal species to more of a hive species and that we must and will settle into that over time. You will understand what he says without a problem as you hint of knowing about such issues.



    Regards
    DL
     
  21. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, and that is why I inserted the links for you in that post to critique.

    You might not have bothered with those two link, that is not a complaint, but if you would have viewed them, you would have note how well we are doing.

    All life is built on past life that has died. From where I sit, I cannot complain about evolution.

    Regards
    DL
     
  22. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Uh, could you elaborate without the bible quotes?
     
  23. Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

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    No. I can adlib though.

    Jesus, once enlightened, said that the Sabbath was created for man and not man for the Sabbath. I extrapolate from that that he would also say that religions and Gods are made for man and not man for them.

    Regards
    DL
     

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