Was Cho Seung-hui decision rational or irrational?

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by draqon, Apr 19, 2007.

?

Was Cho Seung-hui's decision rational or irrational?

  1. rational

    42.4%
  2. irrational

    57.6%
  1. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    Intresting theory. I had wondered how Columbine fit into a person with irrational thinking...was he absorbed by it...did he find it horrid...or did he think it was an escape....

    Was it a form of indiscriminate justice he'd been looking for?
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326
    He was diagnosed with autism in 1992. The social awkwardness and inability coupled with social prejudice and mistreatment most likely pushed him over the edge. His autism was not so severe to be totally alienated from society but enough to be misunderstood.

    I bet he was mistreated for a long period of time even before college. Even in college, even if others extend a social invitation, he would not be accepted in the long run if he could not interact well and that was probably a recurring theme in his life. This sense of prejudice would breed pain and
    anger. It's just tragic for everyone including Cho with his disability.
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. Enterprise-D I'm back! Warp 8 Mr. Worf! Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,898
    How is repeated insanity rational at all?
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. Saquist Banned Banned

    Messages:
    3,256
    I've never heard of a violent autistic case.
     
  8. Muslim Immortal Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,523
    You know what I can see why this guy did it. He was pissed off.

    But he should not have killed any woman.
     
  9. Sputnik Banned Banned

    Messages:
    888
    You can see some of the same symptoms , introvert, isolation ,weird behaviour in autism , schizoid personality disorder , schizotypal disorder and schizophrenia ............
    You are also introvert , isolating in social anxiety disorder ....but not weird ....

    My best guess is, that he was schizotypic (= schizotypal disorder )..............
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2007
  10. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326
    Just as I suspected. That's very hurtful to experience on a regular basis.

     
  11. domesticated om Cartoon character Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,239
    From the looks of it, it was indiscriminate justice
    http://video.msn.com/v/us/fv/msnbc/...&rf=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18184075/&fg=

    Do you mean - in context to the number of people who decide to become suicide bombers/gunmen/pilots? It's a solution to the problem. I don't personally agree with it ethically (or even think it's effective).
     
  12. fadingCaptain are you a robot? Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,762
    A nutbag gets pissed at "society" and decides to kill a bunch of random people. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that is some irrational shit.
     
  13. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326
    True, but if an individual perceives those in the society does not value him/her, it is rational to hate or not value them in return. Remember, he did not value himself either or else he would have lived for self-preservation. His sense of self was too damaged to care. This is a little incident.

    That is why we are at war with iraq, really. That is why history is filled with war.

    He is dead. It will happen again and society will continue to lay all the blame on the individual when it was society that contributed to their development positive or negative.

    Lol, maybe people should be nicer to others or it will come back to bite you in the you know where. If not, don't whine when these things happen because it's cause and effect.
     
  14. Baron Max Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,053
    Surely you can view that from a different perspective than just the one, can't you? There are numerous, different perspectives ...why choose only one? Why choose that one?

    I'm not saying that he wasn't a nut-case, but ...at least I can see his acts from other viewpoints, not just one. Most of the reason we have conflicts in the world is because others can't see or understand someone esle's point of view about things.

    Baron Max
     
  15. MetaKron Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,502
    Way too many people here take a sneering tone towards people who have been bullied. So does the reporter who wrote this article.

    Frustration might boil over when a person realizes how the press and the authorities treat victims of bullying. The authorities consider them to be meat and to be wrong and evil if they step outside of the role of prey.

    Peta9, what about the bullying? Why is continued violence, ostracism, and isolation of a person not something that might push someone over the edge, and why is his social awkwardness likely to be the problem? NO ONE takes the conditions that he lived under well. People who are physically capable of it do violence a lot earlier, but they can simply punch someone around. This guy was what, five foot nothing? He could barely beat his own meat.

    A rational person who actually watches what goes on and actually sees what people do comes to the conclusion that people are cruel and will destroy you for no apparent reason. Even their having a reason makes it more bearable because then the world has some kind of logic. So his writings sound like ravings, and I haven't gotten to read them yet, but if you can't make sense of the world and people have dedicated way too much effort to making sure that you don't make sense of the world, you aren't likely to be able to write all that well either.

    Want these killings to stop happening? Stop being shitheads, people. Most of you would kill for a lot less than what some of you put people through as a reflex.
     
  16. MetaKron Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,502
  17. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326
    I don't get a chance to say this too often. Metakron, you are a good man.
     
  18. maxzuk Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    132
    I believe that some of his problems were his lack of social skills, but I still think that he blamed his parents for his problems in general. If you look at the paragraph that I quoted in post # 16:

    "You had everything you wanted. Your Mercedes wasn’t enough, you brats. Your golden necklaces weren’t enough, you snobs. Your trust fund wasn’t enough. Your vodka and Cognac weren’t enough. All your debaucheries weren’t enough. Those weren’t enough to fulfill your hedonistic needs. You had everything."


    “Your Mercedes wasn’t enough” – College students don’t as a rule dive a Mercedes, used or otherwise, they’re considered an older peoples car – maybe a BMW or Porsche if they or their family has money, but not a Mercedes.

    The references to “golden necklaces” and “trust fund” I’m not sure of except that the later is singular.

    “Your vodka and Cognac weren’t enough” – We’re talking USA folks – beer is the choice of those going to college here. I can see vodka being popular but cognac is ridiculous. I’ve been ¾ around the world (from Naples, around South America, to Hong Kong) and I’ve never heard anyone order
    cognac at the bar. Most bars in the USA (college or otherwise) don’t even have cognac to serve.

    I believe that the shooter (won’t mention his name) was sending a coded message to his parents. Only they would understand that he held them responsible for his problems and actions. I’d love to know what they drive and what their favorite drinks are.

    Here’s another bit of his to ponder:

    “I die like Jesus Christ to inspire generations of the Weak and Defenseless — my brothers, sisters and children — that you f***.”

    If that doesn’t sound like child abuse, I don’t know what does.
     
  19. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    72,824
    What fantasies!

    Doesn't anyone read anymore?
    http://www.theage.com.au/news/world/killers-life-of-poverty/2007/04/18/1176696891121.html
    http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9642190
     
  20. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326

    He still could have been abused. There are many parents who put on an act of the good parent. She was probably upset at his disability and didn't know how to keep him in line. Asian parents are notorious for worrying about their children's success mainly for their own image and the hope their child can take care of them as they age. As well, many are quite cold. His parents never visited him not even once the whole year he was in college, his roommates said. He also alone on holidays on campus when his family lived in the same state. Something doesn't sound right about that.

    I know because I have parents who were unbelievably twisted and brilliant at hiding dirty secrets.

    He was probably molested by a male schoolteacher.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2007
  21. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,296
    Speaking of shallow, you sure registered your lack of real perspective on this one!!! It wasn't shallow at all - it clearly proved that he was NOT talking about his parents. He was ranting at fellow students AND teachers - the latter being the most affluent and with Mercedes, and the students being the ones with trust funds.
     
  22. peta9 Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,326
    That does not mean he wasn't abused or neglected by them. Many children who are abused or failed by their parents internalize it and don't blame them because of their devotion. Even if what a parent does or does no do is not intentional, it can have devastating effects. He was bullied repeatedly and his parents probably did not take it seriously or realize the extent of the emotional and mental damage it was inflicting on his vulnerable person. They are his parents but may not have been there for him.
     
  23. Read-Only Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,296
    For the record: I never once said that his parents might or might not have abused or neglected him. I was simply commenting on your serious lack of perception as to who he was railing at - it certainly was NOT his parents, as you tried so hard to claim and then chastized Sam for pointing out your blunder.
     

Share This Page