Discussion in 'Religion' started by Greatest I am, Apr 5, 2015.
You cannot carry on a discussion. Are you Jan in disguise?
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i don't know who jan is, but sounds like a nice person
you are holding this discussion with me, are you sure you havent released your grip?
An interesting observation, about Satan is; there is no mention of Satan being thrown from heaven until in Revelations. Revelations was written, by John, while in prison, decades after Christ had died. This implies Satan was in Heaven during the entire life of Christ, and therefore during all of the Old Testament.
Satan was the left hand man of God and had influence with God and his creation. Satan was given control over the earth and humans like a middle level manager, with freedom to make decisions. This topic is about Satan having equal rights in heaven. Since Satan was in heaven in the Old Testament, old testament evil, was directed by Satan, while in heaven; expressing his rights of choice and will.
There is a new testament quote (paraphrase), our struggle is against powers of darkness in heavenly places. Satan was still considered in heaven at that time of Christ based on the timeline of this quote. Satan tempts Jesus in the desert, because Satan was Lord of the Earth, and had control over all secular things; power, wealth and immortality. When Jesus refuses his secular offer, Jesus rebels against the hierarchy of heaven, at least at the middleman level of Satan. Jesus, by ignoring the authority of the middleman level of heaven, forms a more direct connection to God. The holy spirit, promised by Jesus, comes from and is God; trinity, by-passing the Satan middleman.
Satan does not get the final boot from heaven, until Prophesies of Revelations begin. After Satan gets the boot and Satan reaches the earth, he knows he has only a short time and goes out with great wrath. Since many people believe Prophesies are still in the future, since no anti-christ has yet appeared, that means Satan is still in Heaven, with humans having only the holy spirit by-pass to help them differentiate signals from heaven.
What is being interpreted, by atheism, as being due to God in heaven, may be due to Satan still in heaven, which could explain the atrocities of history; human faith in the wrong heavenly things. Many of he religious leaders use the Satan middleman, and did not trust any direct holy spirit connection.
One implication that is misunderstood, is since the Jewish religion is defined by the Old Testament, it is based on the Satan Middleman. In other words, the Jews do well in the secular world, which was the domaine of Satan in the old Testament. Their expected Messiah was supposed to have great power and wealth and will dispose of all their enemies via war.
If Jesus had taken the offer in the desert, from Satan, so he would own all the kingdoms of the world, have immortality, and total power. He would have been what was expected of the Jewish Messiah. Jesus, a Jew, knew this, but avoided the middleman of Satan, and went to the big guy; directly.
This last part is not personal against Jews, but follows the time line of Satan. It is useful so both Jew, Gentile and atheists can see there is a difference, since Satan may still be in heaven.
Bear in mind that atheism doesn't interpret anything: people interpret.
And why would an atheist, who doesn't hold the belief that God exists, care from their atheist viewpoint (as opposed to their academic, intellectual, interest point of view) whether Satan, God, the tooth-fairy, the Celestial teapot, or anything else they don't profess to believe in, are are not in a place they also don't believe in?
It also doesn't absolve God whatsoever for the problem of evil. God created all of it, He's omnipotent, he could change it at will. I would no sooner worship a schizophrenic God than an evil one.
god did not create evil, man did, evil is the falseness of the world. god is truth, those who lack god we call evil. evil came about because we did not use our free will wisely. God did not create evil, evil is created willingly by those who perpetuate it, those who make excuse for their sins, those who cannot forgive others.
"Evil does not exist sir, or at least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe the absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is not like faith, or love that exist just as does light and heat. Evil is the result of what happens when man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's like the cold that comes when there is no heat or the darkness that comes when there is no light."
One forgives those who repent. Christianity does not as they continue their immoral practices.
Does love not require presence and reality of the one loved?
You are calling masturbation making love.
Love, like faith, needs to be expressed with works and deeds and your God is not showing any love yet demands it. What an ass hole your God is.
Which is what A & E did and your immoral God threw a fit against them.
What an ass hole your God is.
do you believe god is really "invisible"? perhaps he is invisible to those that do not want to see him
what about those christians who do repent, dont dare tell me there are none
I never said I did.
I begin to think you are an atheist trying to discredit Christians or just a troll looking to create trafic.
They do not need your help and are quite good at discrediting themselves.
Then they would leave Christianity for as moral religion.
no, a true christian would stay and try to help those who are lost
no, i believe there is only one God, i am not an atheist
What makes you think atheists don't want to see god? Also, seeing things is no guarantee they are real. In fact the more you want to see something, the less your perceptions can be trusted.
God is quite visible to Gnostic Christians but you do not see God as we do.
You look without while God is both within and when found shows himself without.
Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you.
If they say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.
Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.
[Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father.
But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."
If you can't see God in all, you can't see God at all.
perhaps atheists do believe they want to see god, but what is their motive
there is god in all, i quite agree with this
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