what if God could be proven?

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by NMSquirrel, Nov 16, 2009.

  1. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    So do plane crashes and electrocution. But I'm not here to impress upon you the "evidence". Once in a while someone gets called on and their world is changed in a second. It's worth reading about before you go instantly dismissing it.
     
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  3. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    I figured it was the fantasy of people that wanted to feel as though they were special.
     
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  5. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Exactly: severe trauma causes the release of a natural drug into the brain (DMT): that drug has been shown to cause NDE-type experiences.

    There is no evidence.

    Like I said, drugs will do that to you.

    It's worth finding out how much I've actually read before you go instantly assuming I don't know anything.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    Or maybe you should read up before accepting the first explanation...
    We have threads here discussing the "reality" of NDEs that go back years.
     
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  7. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    Ok, fair enough. Let me ask you something. Simple yes or no. Do you believe in love?
     
  8. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    "Believe" in love?
    Why should I believe in it?
    Do I believe in anger?
    Do I believe in pain?
    It's there, it's real.
    It doesn't require belief any more than my left leg requires it.
    It exists.
    Your point?
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2010
  9. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    Do YOU personally believe in love? Yes or no would work.
     
  10. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Like I said: it doesn't need belief.
    I don't believe in house bricks, nor do I believe in love.
    I don't understand the question.
    Love exists.
     
  11. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    Again, please, yes or no. Do you personally believe in love?
     
  12. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Which bit of "I don't understand the question" do you not understand?
    What do you mean by "believe in love"?
    Do YOU believe in house bricks?

    Edit: if I say "yes" will you get to the point?
     
  13. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    The answer is yes. Thank you.

    Science can prove what the human body experiences when it feels love. Scientist themselves fall in love. We all understand the feeling of "love". But you can't take "love" and put it in a test tube. Love isn't something you can hold in your hand, but most of the world agrees it exist and experiences it. Yet never question it?

    As a Christian myself, I need no evidence of God. Just like a scientist needs no evidence of love.
     
  14. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Wrong: the answer isn't "yes".
    I said "If I say yes..." just so you'd get to the point.

    Neither is "pain", or "a cold" or "a thought".
    Fail.

    Also wrong: love is a chemical imbalance (lack of serotonin among other things).
    We have evidence of love.
    Hence my comment that love requires belief no more than does a house brick. It exists.
     
  15. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    You see my point? Science is always looking for "evidence". Right? Yet for all science knows about "love" which can't be held in your hand. When God enters a person's life science ignores it, yet science might try the same methods. If they believed. If you don't believe in something you won't pursue it's existence.

    What keeps me captivated is people who never believe in God, Heaven, or hell... Sometimes find themselves at the very door step of. Why? You will never get me to accept that something as complex as DNA, evolved.

    Nice chatting with you, but I have chores on my desk. Gotta run.
     
  16. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Nope.

    That's the job of science. Complaining about that is like complaining the cinema doesn't provide fast cars.

    And again: you can't hold "a mile", "a cold", "pain", "three", "a conversation" etc in your hand either - but we know what they do/ how they behave.

    Because there's no evidence of "god", nor of him "entering someone's life".

    Exactly: and what does exist provides its own evidence and doesn't require "belief".

    Not sure what you mean, but cultural influences among other things could account for it.

    Which says much about your critical abilities.
     
  17. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    Ok, let me put put to you this way. Science tends to lay burden of proof where? Because there is zero belief. If the same science was applied to God working in a person's life, that is applied to proving love... Follow me? Cultural influences do have part in NDE. But a person who never believed in a thing, is revived and has a story to tell of going up or going down, meeting their maker etc. Your average NDE doesn't come back talking about their trip Disney. Do you recall a story in the news about 2 years ago. A woman checks out, real permanent. Rigamortis sets in, she's room temperature and DEAD as dead as gets. Then hours later she sits up on the gurney with an appetite. All of this in the most modern of hospitals with the finest modern doctors. Miracle?
     
  18. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Science doesn't do "proof". But it requires evidence.

    I'm ahead of you: you're assuming that evidence of god is available, the same way there is evidence of love. There isn't.
    You're also assuming that science hasn't looked at what is claimed as evidence. You think in X thousand years of claims of god no-one has bothered to take a serious look at the claims?
    Science in its infancy had people looking for evidence of the soul and other, similar, supporting *cough* data.

    I didn't say "they believed" I said "cultural influences": even atheists grow up in a society saturated with religious references and undertones (in the West at least).

    Which just goes to show that we still have things to learn about the human body, its functioning and processes.
    I've never heard of the case, link please.
    And the way you tell it immediately causes suspicion: rigor mortis doesn't start until approximately 3 hours after death, how long was the entire experience? "Hours later". How many hours? If rigor mortis truly had set in her muscles would have locked up...
     
  19. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    According to the report, she was ice cold and stiff as a board. 12 hours sticks in my mind, but please don't quote me on that. Sounds pretty dead to me.

    I see the futility of this. Same problem every time I engage on this issue- I'll see it when I believe it.
     
  20. BlueRidge Registered Senior Member

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    141
    Ok got it- Val Thomas Story. Dead as a door nail, 17.5 hours.

    “They couldn’t believe that my heart was in the condition it was when I went to Cleveland Clinic after what had happened. They didn’t find anything wrong either,” Val said. “He said, ‘medicine could not have done this,’ or ‘doctors could not have done this.’ And I said, ‘yes, it was a miracle from God.’”

    “There are things that physicians and nurses, we can’t always explain; and I think this was one of those cases,” Dr. Eggleston said.

    I wonder how many in the science community instantly ruled out intervention from a higher order? Google away friend.
     
  21. earth Registered Senior Member

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    I don't see one single link to your story.
     
  22. earth Registered Senior Member

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    Have you been called?
     
  23. jpappl Valued Senior Member

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    Here is more of the story:

    So she was still getting air and they attempted to save her by the process above. Looks like there could been a viable explanation for it that we just haven't discovered yet.

    In which case, her case could help explain more about how the body works.

    Doesn't mean gods were involved just that we don't understand everything about the human body.
     

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