What if JESUS had been born at a different time and place ?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Ted Grant II, Dec 8, 2016.

  1. Ted Grant II Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    142
    I suppose Jesus could have been born at a different time and a different place.
    Let's try to imagine that and what, if anything would be different.

    Let's say he was born in Ponders End, Enfield, London and is now 30.
    He decides to stop making book shelves and begin his ministry.

    What car would he own? A BMW or a VW perhaps?
    No, because of what the Nazis did to his people in the 1930s and 1940s.
    How about a Fiat or a Toyota ?
    No, because the Italians and the Japanese supported the Nazis.
    And lacking a little donkey, I think he would stick to Eco transport.

    He starts walking around London with a sandwich board that says:
    "THE END IN NIGH"
    He decides that's not working, so he finds a few local homeless guys and
    shows them some street magic and they become convinced he has
    real magic powers. They decide to follow him around, picking up food
    where they can from food banks and sleeping in parks and under arches.

    By the light of a silvery moon or a street lamp, he tells them stories.
    He tells them there will be floods, earthquakes and Brexit. They gasp.
    He says a Dragon will harden the hearts and force through a Hard Brexit.
    He says from Heaven, a Golden Trump will cue the End Times.

    Jesus tells them that he will be put in an ice coffin for 3 days and survive.
    They are amazed. They continue walking around, spreading the word.

    He says that if they have enough faith, they will be able to say to a building,
    MOVE and it will move. Most believe him, although one did have doubts.

    Someone tells them that the local supermarket has a food donation bin.
    Jesus says he is hungry and asks his followers to go and get some food.
    A little while later, they come back and tell him the shop is closed.
    Why? asks Jesus.
    It's Sunday early closing !
    He curses the shop and said..
    That shop's sales will drop and cheaper EU rivals will take the business.
    A few weeks later, they pass the same shop again and see a sign...
    "We have MOVED"
    Here endeth the lesson.
     
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  3. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Certainly a reasonable attempt at humour.
    What I find interesting is if many of the claims made re Jesus were made today they would be rejected, certainly any human claiming God status would be seen as entirely delusional and yet move the story back two thousand years with dubious methods of recording the story and many proclaim it most reasonable and happy to embrace absurdity... Such is irrational faith.
    I think if you try and move the story to another time and place it will just sound silly to those who otherwise believe the story... Then again maybe they would still believe that nothing was made up.
    Alex
     
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  5. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    I'm pretty sure he would have a man bun and wear a flannel shirt.
     
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  7. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    What about if He comes back within 30 years. What sign will be given that is He
    Soon after the tribulation of the same time the sun and the moon will lose their appearance, and stars will fall from heaven, and the forces of the heavens will move. (Isaiah 13: 10) (2 Peter 3: 10) (Revelation 6: 12-13) 30 And the sign of the Son of man in the heavens shall appear. And then shall all the families of the earth howl, and shall see the Son of man in the clouds of heaven, with great power and glory. (Revelation 19: 11-13) 31 And he will send his angels with bright trombones, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other . (1 Corinthians 15:52) (Revelation 8.1-2)
     
  8. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    I'm waiting for the bright trombones but how bright will they have to be before we can be sure it's the coming? I'd like baby Jesus to come back.
     
  9. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    2,919
    Hi Timojin,
    Thank you for your contributions and commenting upon my post.
    You ask what if Jesus (I presume) comes back in 30 years and all I can say is we can only wait and see if he does come back.
    If I am alive he is welcome to stay at my place just so long as he does not discuss religion.

    Whst does it mean "the sign of the son of man in the heavens shall appear"?
    Is this open to multiple interpretations?
    What is your opinion?

    I dont like relevations it is sad such nonsence is allowed to appear in the bible.

    Anyways any light you can throw on the meaning of the passages you present I for one would appreciate.
    Alex
     
  10. Ted Grant II Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    142
    Jesus can't come back. He died 2000 years ago (approximately). I've never really understood why he came in the first place. If he came to declare the end of the world (in the lifetime of some standing in front of him as he spoke), he didn't get that right, so his coming back claim doesn't hold much water.
     
  11. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    If He was predicting the end of the world, there would be little point to being eco-friendly.
     
  12. gmilam Valued Senior Member

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    2,663
    Jesus would've used public transportation.
     
  13. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    One thing, He come to save man from himself. He come to bring the Torath in person , were He said I am the way to the Father , meaning His teachings are the help for mankind to bring himself to God.
    He come to change polytheism, to monotheism.
     
  14. spidergoat Valued Senior Member

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    51,461
    OK, then we might be worshiping a different Judean rebel, some Roman god, a pagan pantheon, or Buddha. I don't think he was particularly special, more like a catalyst for ideas circulating around at the time.
     
  15. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    The main factor is Constantine converting Rome which was for political not religious reasons.
    The OP could well have been "What if Rome became Jewish rather than Christian?".

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  16. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    He hardly got anything right. He definitely did not fulfill the Jews Messiah prophecy & seemed quite disinterested in it. He was angry, rude, disrespectful & hateful. He was probably quite mad.

    <>.
     
  17. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    What were the fulfilment necessary for Yahshua to be Messiah ?
    "He was angry, rude, disrespectful" Is it because He did not go along with the system ? Rude and angry because He chased the people that made a market in the place of worship ?
    By the way Akiba at some point recognised Ben Kokhba as messiah, because he liberated Israel for a few years but later withdrew his belief because he killed to many people. Then after liberating , the Roman come destroyed al Israel and removed all Jews from the land and even changed the name of the land to Palestine, since then Israel disappeared as name and to the present we have Palestine
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2017
  18. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    1 = The Messiah was to be a man, not a god or son of a god or 3 gods in 1, sent by God to lead the Jews in overthrowing their oppressors. There was nothing about saving souls, saving the world or dying on a cross as a sacrifice so that God could finally forgive humans for being what it created them to be if only they have the "correct" belief when they die.

    2 = Have you read the New Testament?
    <>
     
  19. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Yes I have read the New testament.

    By your argument the brother Maccabee freed Israel from the Greeks for a short period , were they the Messiah ?
    The system during Yahshua was a corrupt system if you did not follow their order they eliminated you .
    If you want to talk about rebellion of the time . there were other movement , but Yahshua was peaceful movement to correct the soul of man.
     
  20. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    2,200
    Jesus came here to save us from the wrath of (himself) God so God could sacrifice Jesus (himself) to himself. Is that clear enough?
     
    Michael 345 and origin like this.
  21. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    Not quite. He is immortal & lives forever in paradise except for 30something years. He lived here for a very short time for the purpose of "dying" then went back to eternal paradise.
    WHAT the heck is the big sacrifice???
    If I knew I could save people from eternal torture by dying, I would do it in a second & I don't have any knowledge or belief that I would live in eternal paradise after.

    <>
     
  22. birch Valued Senior Member

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    Snippet example. Someone named jesus may have said this but i doubt it. who would tell someone to basically predate or be parasitic on them?

    This is the problem of this whole jesus christ meme is that it's rather pornographic and parasitic. it's a bit over the top. many religionists (not all) are creepy.

    this whole theme is very similar to what psychic vampires do and that is feeding off other people's energies and draining them instead of generating their own through soul-searching and inner work. i don't think it's a coincidence that my religious abusers were heavily parasitic but it's not the religion that made them this way as they were this way anyways but that is also why they were attracted to this religion. the whole passive, victim, feed off of me, i will forgive all and you will have eternal life is very attractive to users, the narcissistic and sinners. a willing victim is like the jackpot.

    good people exercise their integrity, don't really need jesus christ do they? they would be disgusted by that or at least know that is not right. no one should have to pay for another's sins. that is just unfair. think about it. you should do right and if you deserve/earn it, then so be it and if you don't, then that's what you deserve. why would someone be upset if they don't get to enter heaven if they don't deserve it? if you knowingly keep doing wrong and sinning as well as aren't even sorry for what you've done to someone else except for punishment, why would you have done that if you wanted to enter the proverbial heaven when it's the antithesis of it's rules? you are just using the religion and degrading/abusing it. does that even make honest sense?
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2017
  23. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Why don't you stop complaining , Jesus did not harm to you, and we who believe in his teachings are less creepy then you. If I pray to him it is non of your business. Why don't you bitch on somebody else, like yourself.
     

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