What is Love?

Discussion in 'General Philosophy' started by Cactus Jack, Apr 19, 2002.

  1. Tyler Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,888
    Hey nelson. If I raped your daughter would you still love me.

    You live in Canada now right? So I take it you know of Paul Bernardo and Carla, right? If you love them than you've officially entered the realm of so low an intelligence level I previously thought it only reserved for monkeys.

    Not chimps, either. Spider mokeys.
     
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  3. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    Tyler:
    Who? Sorry.

    Dosen't matter though. Usama bin Ladin, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Augusto Pinochet, Pol Pot, you love them, Nelson?

    Sushi!,
    Xev
     
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  5. TruthSeeker Fancy Virtual Reality Monkey Valued Senior Member

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    Tyler,

    I already said this in another thread and I say it again. No, I honestly don't think I would be able to Love such person unless for some miracle I could ever forgive such person.

    I don't know these people.

    Love,
    Nelson
     
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  7. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    Tyler ...

    Why bring up Paul and Carla?

    They were just a fun-loving Canadian couple, married at that, that
    got their kicks in a somewhat unconventional manner.

    Wasn't that big a thing Stateside ... Thanks to Canadian law, not
    enough blood and guts to make it to US PrimeTime! Hell, not even
    clips of the videotapes they made.

    Take care

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  8. Tyler Registered Senior Member

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    4,888
    Then like we've all said, you don't experience unconditional love. Unconditional means exactly that - without conditions. So if the condition of the person being a rapist or torturer makes you unable to love them.

    And I would pray that you never forgive karla and paul.


    Xev - god-damn americans and your lack of care for canada...

    Let me tell you a little story. Karla meets Paul. Karla falls in love with Paul. Karla is a regular woman. Paul is a successful, motivated business man and (as karla says) amazing in bed, one of the things Karla loved in him. They wed. It's a huge, amazing wedding that is picture-perfect. After the marriage, Karla finds out Paul was quite angry that she wasn't a virgin and so he couldn't take her virginity. In such, Paul convinces Karla that it's only logical he should be allowed to take the virginity of Karla's younger sister Tammy. So, Paul rapes Tammy while she's put under (karla worked at a vet's so she had access to the drugs) while Karla videotapes it; because taping something is a logical way to remember a special event. During the rape, Tammy started throwing up. Karla tried to hold her in a way that she would clear her throat, but Tammy choked on her own vomit and died.

    Paul had raped many women (11 I believe) and Karla encouraged this kind of act in him, thinking it quite normal and cool. Karla loved him dearly and wanted him to everything that made him happy. And she wanted to do everything that would make him happy (sound a bit like unconditional love there nelson?). Paul now was very angry at Karla, believing she was the reason for Tammy's death. And Tammy, of course, was something he desired greatly. Karla sought out a new way to get Paul excited and soon found Jane, a teenager who kind of looked like Tammy. She invited Jane over to their house, got her to pass out and invited Paul in to see his surprise gift. They each had sex with the girl (videotapping it) and then Paul had his usual brutal anal sex with her. Jane (15), had no idea what happened.

    Paul and Karla took a couple more teenage girls willingly for a while before the willingness ended. Eventually, they abducted a girl named Kristen French (16, I believe) and this is where the story gets disgusting. Kristen believed she would survive if she did everything paul demanded of her, so she did. As Karla videotaped, Paul became more and more sadistic in his acts as Kristen kept doing things. Things such as urinating and defecating on her, and eventually killing her (though the killing was not videotaped).

    They did this a couple times, though with worse acts involved. Things like pulling out fingernails. Cutting off body parts. Injuring sexual body parts... All while the victim was awake.

    That's Paul and Karla.
     
  9. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,199
    truthseeker,

    I thought you advocated unconditional love. Did I missunderstand you? How could you not love these people if you practice uncondtional love?

    Cris
     
  10. Tyler Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,888
    Paul and Karla I tend not to joke about. I don't know why, really, but I don't joke about them very much.

    Don't worry, I'm not angry at you for doing so. I believe you should be able to joke about everything.

    "Wasn't that big a thing Stateside ... Thanks to Canadian law, not
    enough blood and guts to make it to US PrimeTime! Hell, not even
    clips of the videotapes they made."

    Bah. Americans only consider something large if there's a race issue involved. Anyway, yes, Canadian Law sucked ass on this one. Hey Xev, guess how many years Karla got for her participation in all this? Two 12 year sentances with parole available for good behavior in 6 years.

    Know why?

    Because the great law system here needed her to testify against Paul to get him a huge sentance. So they let her off easy in return for her testimony. Pretty sweet deal, eh?

    And about the videotapes - they were considering burning the tapes. I think that's a horrible idea but it shows how little people want to deal with what these two did.
     
  11. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    10,943
    Tyler: Actually, I heard of the case but I didn't remember the names. Thanks.

    And most Americans don't follow American news, let alone Canadian.

    Fuck, I would not forgive either. If I was close to any of thier victims, I would hunt that bitch down the second she got out of prision.

    But I don't have unconditional love.
     
  12. Tyler Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,888
    There is not a doubt in my mind that if you left me in a room for 30 seconds with either of them I would find a way to kill them. Not because it's the morally right thing to do, but because they are such horrible human beings. In fact, it's morally a wrong thing for me to do (not to mention legally). Wouldn't stop me from doing it. The world would be a slightly better place if they had never existed.

    Xev, heard the latest case in great ol' T.O.???


    By the way

    What is love (love, love, love)......
    Baby don't hurt me........
    don't hurt me........
     
  13. Xev Registered Senior Member

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    Tyler:
    I think it would be morally right under certain circumstances.

    If Karla's victims had justice denied them because of a point of law, it is okay for me, as a citizen, to avenge thier death.

    Of course, I'm not a Canadian citizen.

    Nope. Whenever I turn on the news, it is always somthing about the Middle East.

    Great, now I am thinking of that routine on SNL.

    Baby don't hurt me
    No more
    What is love
    What is love

    Sushi!,
    Xev
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2002
  14. Tyler Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,888
    Let me give you a brief break down.

    Two art students catch a cat.
    Hang it by a power cord.
    Slit open it's stomach.
    Start skinning the belly.
    Stab the cat to a wall.
    The tacking to the wall isn't great, so he takes the knife out and does it again.
    At this point in the video (they are videotaping this) you hear one person say 'Beautiful, man.'
    Another guy; "Doesn't bleed much, does it."
    They decide to find the heart.
    They stab it in the heart, it falls to the floor.
    They start kicking it.
    One guy slits the cat right through the chest cavity, sticks his face inside and inhales deeply.
    Cat dies.

    All in the name of art.
     
  15. Xev Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,943
    Ugh. I hope that they get thier asses nailed to the wall for that one. Disgusting.
     
  16. bbcboy Recovering christian Registered Senior Member

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    1,104
    Now that's a scenario where the punishment should mirror the crime. I'm one of those sad brits who just can't abide pet cruelty.

    The canadian couple remind me of the wests over here. They killed many young people and buried them out back of their house.

    They both went to jail for life and if freds case it was true. He was found hung in his cell some time later. Suicide? maybe not.

    I don't know, sick killers... Ya gotta love 'em ?

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  17. Tyler Registered Senior Member

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    4,888
    Ten months in prison during the trial.

    One guy gets 'time served' so goes scott-free (though I never understood this expression. Who exactly is scott? And why does he get off so easily?). Other guy gets 90 days in prison, on weekends, and house arrest.

    There will be an appeal. Everyone was extremely confused when we heard the sentance. Every single person in Toronto went; 'What?? Are you kidding?' as we all expected the max jail sentance of 2 and a half years for animal cruelty to be given.

    They are also now likely going to up that max to 5 years for future cases.
     
  18. Chagur .Seeker. Registered Senior Member

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    2,235
    Hey, Tyler ...

    Sometimes the only way to deal with the horror of being 'human'
    is to make light of the madness of this 'intelligent' species.

    Something the Jews have known for centuries.

    Take care

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    Last edited: Apr 22, 2002
  19. TruthSeeker Fancy Virtual Reality Monkey Valued Senior Member

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    15,162
    Tyler and Cris,

    Posted by Tyler:
    Posted by Cris:
    Since I've never experienced such thing I Love Unconditionally. If I did experience such thing I don't know if I could keep up though. Many sad things already happened with me but as soon as my Love starts to fade my life becomes worse. When I concentrate in my Love again, forgive people, and most important, forgive myself, than, I'm able to fully Love again.

    I said once and I say it again. To Love Unconditionally is not easy, but rewardful. I'm not perfect. Sometimes I slip on a banana...

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    Unconditional Love is the Perfection, the goal.

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    Love,
    Nelson
     
  20. jandt remlik Registered Senior Member

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    LOVE is the opposite of FEAR


    This needs to become the most important concept of the 21st century if our species is to survive.


    peace, jandt
     
  21. TruthSeeker Fancy Virtual Reality Monkey Valued Senior Member

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    15,162
    This is a good concept...

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    I still don't believe that LOVE has an actual opposite.
    But two things that come really close are FEAR and INDIFFERENCE.

    Fear is probably the ignorance of Love. As Love drives out Fear...

    Indifference is probably the desvalorization of Love.

    Somewhat...

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    Love,
    Nelson
     
  22. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    ts,

    You are unbelievable. You cannot be serious.
     
  23. TruthSeeker Fancy Virtual Reality Monkey Valued Senior Member

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    15,162
    It's hard to believe that someone like you exists...
     

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