Where is most "gravity", inside or out?

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by nebel, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Effectively the spaghettification effect is caused by the enormous difference in gravity between your head and your feet, presuming you fall in vertically.
     
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  3. nebel

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    Of course just as a reminder the topic is: force or "total amount" of g/G inside an entity or above the surface.
    The spaghettification ( an excellent contributing somment w4y bsw) happens above the surface of the BH. there is no gravity at the "center" of a black hole, it is the ultimate example of all the gravity bing an outside the surface phenomenon.

    Were you to fall into a nascent, developing BH, with an presumed interior cavity, you would resume your normal rotund shape again. anti-spaghettification? obese-sification?
    It would be pressure, not gravity that keeps you small, just like inside the earth.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  5. nebel

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    P: the deep question is though, what does "cancel" amount to here.
    Are there 2 "gravtons" streaming in opposite directions, but clinging to each other, or blocking each other's way, neutralizing the effect, or are there no gravitons left after cancellation, and

    in the case of EC's gravity well, are there still 2 extreme slopes at the center, or only the shown resulting level center area?
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  7. nebel

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    let me re-state that please:
    with the gravitational field of all the matter "chunks" in the interior always in existence, but overlapping in the center and therefore cancelled, undetectable, should/could exchemist's gravity well not be amended to show these opposings slopes rather then a flat bottom?
     
  8. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    An interesting factoid;

    This Is Why Earth, Surprisingly, Is The Densest Object In Our Solar System
    We’re not made out of the densest elements, but we’re the densest planet nonetheless. Here’s why.


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    https://medium.com/starts-with-a-ba...sest-object-in-our-solar-system-59f416fdf74e#

    IMO, this excellent resource belongs in everyone's library on the solar system.
     
  9. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Whatever the situation at the core of a BH, facts are that whatever has had the misfortune to reach there, has already been broken down into its most fundamental particles, and more then likely in an unknown state of existence. Of course the singularity as defined by infinite spacetime curvature and density is generally now dismissed by most cosmologists, while the singularity as defined by where GR and the laws of physics are not applicable, is still valid.
    As yet we do not have any verifiable QGT.
     
  10. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Not really surprisingly. All the terrestrial planets are similar, Mercury 5.4gms/cm3, Venus 5.2gms/cm3, and Earth 5.5 gms/cm3. Mars is less dense, coming in at 3.9gms/cm3

    Saturn is the least dense of all the planets, and if we could get an Ocean big enough and deep enough, and drop Saturn in, it would float.
     
  11. nebel

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    paddoboy I slept this over this afternoon, and awoke with the answer, perhaps hidden in that lecture.
    How do we know there is gravity at the center of the earth? because 2 chunks of matter at opposing sides in the interior attract each other across the center, Surely the attraction between them is not zero at the midpoint between them?
    If gravity acts across a void, it must be there, even if we cant detect it. S0me what like the light wave/ particle, that is invisible normal to the direction of the beam.
     
  12. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    OK, I can live with that. In fact that is what the Professor indicates in the video getting down to the nitty gritty.
    Truthfully, I havn't followed your threads much particularly on this harmony thingy, but at this stage, without knowing the ins and outs, its simply the way it is. In fact the whole universe is the way it is because if it wasn't, we probably wouldn't be here.
    Unlike river, who claims absolute nonsense, and at the same time, automatically dismisses anything mainstream, at least your ideas appear somewhat plausible....if, if we had the sufficient evidence.

    ps: If you are unaware, I am not a professional, just an old retired maintainance Fitter/machinist/welder, with a great interest in the cosmologies and science in general.
     
  13. nebel

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    You come across much more authoritative than I, but we share the background, I am retired cabinetmaker, this month 90 years old, with a totally disrupted wartime education. and convinced it is our privilege to be alive and discover the phantastic place we live in but there are some hints outside specialized sciences that are intriguing.
     
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  14. nebel

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    Usually my interest is perked by a scientific tidbit, or value, that is the result of mainstream worker's efforts. The correlation of orbital and rotational velocities for example. Or the measurable strength and extend of the gravitational field in this thread.

    For this reason I believe they are mis-categorized as total pseudo science, but rightly belong in the Alternative Theories forum. imho.
    Just because the idea proposed in the OP garners some questionable replies, does not mean that the data have been organized and interpreted in a totally unrealistic way.
     
  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Congrats on the soon to be 90th birthday!!
    I've just turned 76 and have a reunion 61st, coming up...Over the last 12 months two of us have kicked the bucket, and another just got out of hospital after a colonoscopy...leaves 9 of us left.
    I'm thankful for my reasonable good health and hope I make it to your age without too much trouble! Congrats again!!
     
  16. nebel

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    sorry to hear of your losses. I daily practise my down to earth orbital science by pretending to insert into carving curves around a manhole cover,-- on my skate board. --If this site had a means to do it, like personal messaging,*** I could send you a link to a national television piece that was done this week on my "in harmony with the laws of the universe" daily skate board routine.

    *** I dont want to be banned for rule offences like I seem to be from the "science" section.

    In this thread, as the others, I express a lot of feelings that I experienced in my life relating to how we are attached to the laws that we experience, and make our lives possible.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2020
  17. nebel

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    Gravitomagnetism: here is a new one explaining the high orbital velocities "outside" of entities:

    Springer. "Factoring in gravitomagnetism could do away with dark matter: Models of galactic rotation curves built of a general relativistic framework could use gravitomagnetism to explain the effects of dark matter." ScienceDaily. ScienceDaily, 4 March 2021. <www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2021/03/210304145458.htm>

    and yes I understand now, just because you are in weightlessness, it does not mean there is no gravity, it is just that it balances out, from other masses or velocity. but in the above article it seems to imply, that the velocity is caused not by higher gravity, but added push. or?
     
  18. TonyYuan Gravitational Fields and Gravitational Waves Registered Senior Member

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    https://www.researchgate.net/publication/350617258_Gravitational_Fields_and_Gravitational_Waves

    The discovery of gravitational waves provides a new way for us to understand the universe, however, the speed of gravitational waves does not represent the speed of gravitational fields. The speed of action of gravitational fields is much greater than the speed of gravitational waves. As stated by Newton: Gravity is an action-at-a-distance force. Gravitational waves caused by the revolution of the sun affect the orbits of planets and provide some planetary precession data. The chasing effect of gravitational waves also causes the planetary orbital mechanical energy to continue to increase slowly until the planet escapes from the solar system. Gravitational waves exist; the gravitational model under the influence of gravitational waves that we constructed was a physical model. Through the calculation of planetary orbital precession, the correctness of the gravitational equation under the influence of gravitational waves is verified.
     
  19. Ssssssss Registered Senior Member

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    So Tony have you got comments back from the second reviewer of the paper you linked yet? The first one said something like "this paper shouldn't be published and can't even use units right" as I recall.
     
  20. nebel

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    BBC science: "What you see is a central dark region where the hole resides, circled by the light coming from super-heated gas accelerated by immense gravitational forces." bold added.

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    because, at a black hole, all the gravity, it's effects are on the outside. even if the hole itself is a deep gravity well. with great gravity potential.
     
  21. river

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    I would like to see the new deep space telescope , the James Webb deep space telescope peer into this dark hole , for at least a day . Longer the better .

    Why three clumps of energy , in an almost triangular shape ?
     
  22. river

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    So now the gravitional fields . What is the speed of gravitational fields ? And what is this field ?
     
  23. river

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    As well I see no evidence of any energy flow towards this dark center .
     

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