Whites killed by Indians

Discussion in 'History' started by Dinosaur, Jan 9, 2013.

  1. Dinosaur Rational Skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    Decades ago, somebody told me that less than 1000 whites were killed by Indians in the 19th century & then changed the subject.

    It was a person whose credibility on such an issue was unknown to me. He was my boss in a computer company.

    In thinking about his claim, it seemed likely be be valid. Custer lost less than 300 men & I do not know of other major massacres. Perhaps wagon train losses added up to enough to exceed 1000 deathes. Western movies probably give an exaggerated notion about the number of such attacks.

    My Web searches did not answer the question for me. Does anyone have some data and/or thoughts relating to the above?

    BTW: In the French & Indians Wars of the 18th century, both the British & the French had mercenary Indians in their armies. I strongly suspect that that indians killed more than 1000 whites in those wars.
     
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  3. origin Heading towards oblivion Valued Senior Member

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    From the Wiki article:

    So these figures don't include the war of 1812 which has a lot of native american / settlers clashing on the frontier of Ohio, Indiana, and Michigan. It does not include the Seminole wars either. Nor the many other earlier clashes in the west before 1850, so the figure the guy gave you was not good at all.

    The fact remains that europeans carried out a near genocide on the native americans in the USA, which I might add was totally unnecessary, costly in lives and actual monetary terms. The proof that it was unnecessary can be seen by the lack of clashes in Canada due to their more intelligent treatment of the native americans.
     
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  5. arauca Banned Banned

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    I don't know if it was intelligence . Perhaps rapid population expansion in the USA have something to do
     
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  7. kwhilborn Banned Banned

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    What about whites saved by Indians.

    There was a great love story about a beautiful Indian girls father that told aprospective Groom he did not have enough horses. That man set out and came back a week later with a long train of horses. It was young love. Years passed, and with each birth of a child ceremonies and love was in the air. With a beautiful wife and three happy children he was a happy man.

    His name was Goyaałé (one who yawns frequently)!

    The Mexican government had put a pricetag on Indian lives however and this "industry" made many scalp hunters hunt Indians. The pricetag $100 for braves; $50 for squaws; $25 for children under fourteen was a lot of money back then.

    So Goyaałé returned home one day to find his wife and three children murdered for someones profit of $125.

    He became vengeful and merciless towards the mexicans after this. He led attacks not fearing death and killing many. As the Mexicans screamed for help from "Saint Jerome" repeatedly in his grasp he found his new name. Geronimo! (A true life Charles Bronson Movie).

    Geronimo is perhaps known as one of the most deadliest of all the Indians, and his life story is both tragedy and horror filled.

    HOWEVER!

    In his earlier days of vengeance Geronimo targeted mainly the Spanish/Mexican troops that were part of the scalping industry, and likely killed those responsible for his families death although that could never be known for sure.

    Eventually Geronimo had to attack Americans who joined into the Scalping industry in his territory.

    My point is this....

    This thread is entitled "Whites killed by Indians".

    How many Mexicans/Spanish did Geronimo and his allies kill that would have later posed a threat to America. I have read descriptions of his first onslaught being one against 200 Mexican troops.

    By skirmishing with Mexican troops did Geronimo save the lives of whites?

    P.S. Dang! Hard to believe scalping was a Sanctioned industry not so long ago. Imagine offering money for the scalps of women/children. Imagine knowing that killing the child in front of you will help feed your own family in a time of no unemployment insurance or welfare. It is insane.

    The scalp monies offered on women and children were allegedly meant for living scalps by some, but monies were paid for dead children as well. It is an easily forgotten past.
     
  8. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    Yet the reds in Canada suffered the same proportional population crash (starting from a lower base, as the climate of most of Canada was too harsh for populations like those along the Ohio and Mississippi, or in Georgia etc) and in the southern regions suited for agriculture the same loss of land and resources.

    Here is a list of wars fought by whites against reds in NA, including several in Canada. Note that in Canada as in the US the red nations fought each other at least as frequently as any of them fought the white nations.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wars_of_the_indigenous_peoples_of_North_America

    In addition, some of the Indian Wars usually described as being fought in the US were fought in Canada as well - the national boundaries we have today did not exist then, and theaters of war stretched into both countries frequently.

    After 1500 or thereabouts disease was of course the main killer of reds in NA, everywhere.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013

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