Who Will Be the Democratic VP Nominee?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by joepistole, Jul 14, 2016.

  1. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Within the next few weeks Hillary will need to nominate her vice presidential running mate. So who will it be? Who should it be? Pundits seem to think it will be it will be Tim Kaine. Kaine has been a governor and senator, but he is boring as hell. Hillary is boring enough, she doesn't need to up the boring factor. But if the pundits are right, he is the man.

    Hillary needs someone who can move audiences. That's what Hillary needs. That's what Democrats need. She needs someone who could do what Bernie Sanders did. She needs Elizabeth Warren. So who do you think she should select and why?
     
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  3. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    Jill Biden.

    Okay, I admit that just occurred to me, like, right now. Still, why not?

    There's now chatter that Sen. Warren's first-night speaking slot tends against her veep selection, but I don't really see the conventional wisdom. I'd say the Senate seat gamble is the bigger problem, but they can still do this less dangerously than putting the seat up for grabs before the election.

    And if not Warren, why not Jill Biden?
     
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  5. Ivan Seeking Registered Senior Member

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    I think Warren would be a terrible selection. With two women on the ticket and the VP a super lefty who looks like a librarian, a lot of moderates who are iffy would certainly be even more uncomfortable, and I'm one of them. Anyone but Trump but there is almost no other circumstance can imagine where I would support Hillary/Warren. She needs to pick someone who appeals to men and moderates.

    Electing the first woman President is enough for one election. The bigger the stretch, such as going with two women, the more it helps Trump.
     
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  7. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Well, I'm going to have to disagree. I think she would be a great selection. The American voter is disgusted with Washington and conditions are ripe for a change agent, a populist. Populism isn't Clinton's bag. It's definitely Warren's bag and I don't think anyone other than Bernie fits the bill. The difference between Bernie and Warren is Warren's smarter.

    Yes, I think Warren is a bit too far to the left, but she's not at the top of the ticket, and more importantly she has shown she has self control and the ability to learn. For those reasons Warren's liberal leanings do not bother me, and I don't elect people because of their looks, gender or race. All of that is totally irrelevant in my book. I am only concerned about their ability to do a good job.

    I'm a moderate, I'm an independent white male. I have voted for and donated to both parties, and I think a Clinton-Warren ticket would be dynamite. Hillary doesn't need to double down on boredom.
     
  8. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, why not Jill Biden if you could get her to run, but I don't think she is interested.
     
  9. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    In victory, the main consequence of nominating Warren for VP would be to take her out of her awkward power role in the Senate and warehouse her in the comparatively ineffectual role of VP - which is maybe part of the plan. The principle of having one's problems inside pissing out rather than outside pissing in is part of solid political triangulation, Clinton's strength. Also, good assassination or impeachment insurance.

    In a loss, the question would be whether Warren would have been weakened in the Senate and future runs by the campaign, which will have involved extended and repeated public compromise of her basic principles.

    And therein lies a problem. "Men" and "moderates" - meaning anyone who voted for W&Cheney twice, or McCain&Palin once, or Romney&Whocares half a time - are unreachable via reason, and cannot be appealed to by sound VP selection.
     
  10. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    All I can say is, you have a very active fantasy life.
     
  11. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Hillary, true to form, selected Mr. Boring i.e. Tim Kaine. I think it was a mistake. By this morning, Kaine was all giggly and could barely contain himself before the cameras while professing to know nothing of the selection. We will see how this works out. I don't think it helps her, and it may actually hurt her. One must wonder why she chose to release this announcement on a Friday evening when it would get little if any media coverage.

    I wanted a bolder Hillary. That's not what I'm going to get. I think we are getting a Hillary who remains afraid of her shadow. But even so, I much rather have a timid Hillary over a racist, autocratic, ignorant, feckless, nut case who panders to the basest emotions of his constituents i.e. Trump.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2016
  12. Bells Staff Member

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    She needed to pick someone safe and secure and he ticks all the boxes in that regard. She needed someone approachable and is safe and dependable. Frankly, I think she made the right choice.

    Sure, she could have gone with someone like Booker or Warren and die hard lefties like me would have cheered, but that could have alienated many who are looking at a safe and steady option - even boring if you will - to counter Trump's insanity.

    Kaine, from my understanding, fought for civil rights after law school, fought for the rights of the poor and homeless, he's gotten 100% rating with organisations like Planned Parenthood in that he is personally pro-life, but fights for women's rights to choose, he's pro-gun control, he's a good human rights candidate. He speaks Spanish and is popular with Hispanics and the poor. He's a safe choice and after the debacle of the Republican convention, safe is good at the moment. It's a good counter to the lunacy on the right. It provides voters with a form of stability they will be looking for and aren't finding on the right.

    She needed to play it safe and show that she is playing it safe, when the right are so wildly swinging in the wind at the moment that it's terrifying everyone.

    This is not the election to take a risk and go with a Warren or Booker pick, as much as that would have been amazing, the only choice Clinton had was to go with someone that was safe, reliable and dependable.

    Kaine has every appearance of being the complete opposite of what Trump is offering with Pence. She's played it safe, but I also think she has been very clever about it.

    But, but, but Kaine is so boring! Surely he won’t bring the energy the ticket needs to win, right? If you think so, here’s something to consider: Tim Kaine has won every single election he’s ever run in. He’s won everything from Mayor of the majority African-American city of Richmond, to governor of a conservative Southern state. In fact, Kaine was a big part of turning Virginia into the state we see today which went twice for Obama and currently has a Democrat in every single statewide office. Bernie Sanders has himself said that we’ve got to do everything we can to defeat Donald Trump. Tim Kaine could be a real asset in that regard. Obviously, he’s from an important swing state but the way Kaine won in Virginia is important too. He precisely targeted and outperformed in the kind of suburban and exurban counties where Republican leaning voters may be feeling the most uncomfortable with the charlatan who has won the Republican presidential nomination.

    Look, anyone who has served as long and in as many ways as Tim Kaine is going to have taken positions you don’t agree with. I’m not saying the guy is perfect. But having watched a long time and gotten to see the man up close, I can tell you he is courageous, principled, and value driven. I can also tell you that this progressive who begged HRC not to run and drove 12 hours to be able to vote for Bernie would be delighted to see him on the Dem ticket. He won over skeptical Virginians when it was supposedly impossible. I’d love to see what he can do to help Secretary Clinton win over America.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2016
  13. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    I was hoping for Booker in part on the grounds that Clinton needed to appeal to the broader liberal spectrum, and I think we all know putting two women on the ticket runs a volatile risk of scaring the hell out of American men in sectors Hillary needs strong support from.

    That's a good vice president I'm looking at, but it's true I was hoping for a nod to the strong liberal groundswell. I suppose, in the end, this is the manner of calculation I tell others to trust.

    (Oh, right ... hey, the ham sandwich lady? She was going off about Kaine's teeth, Clinton and Warren having an affair, and, as you're already aware of her bizarrely neurotic sexual obsessions, you won't be surprised to learn she wants Clinton stripped down and [cough!] invasively searched. I wonder if we'll get a food version of this one.)
     
  14. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Clinton won't pick up those votes regardless of who she puts on the ticket with her, and I don't think "most men" are that fearful of women.
     
  15. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    Given the fear of a woman's hat I just saw from what counts as the left side of the American political discourse, I see a significant, even glaring, risk.
     
  16. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Ironically, the "safe" choice is the riskiest choice in this case. Trump does have a media presence and some charisma, Clinton doesn't. And neither does Mr Boring i.e. Kaine. That's Hillary's weakness this cycle and she didn't help herself with this selection.

    Kaine is a nice guy, but that’s not going to help the ticket. Here is something to consider, the demographics in Kaine’s home state have changed. Virginia isn’t the Southern state it once was. It’s now a blue state. So his political victories in Virginia aren’t that impressive. Hillary has made her choice and I’m disappointed. That said, Hillary is still the best choice for American voters. So we have no other choice than to hope for the best. Let’s hope I’m wrong. Let’s hope Kaine can find a groove and some passion. Passion and inspiration are the things Clinton has lacked. Let’s hope the Democratic ticket can find some and find it soon.
     

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