Why do people believe in god?

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by LuckAse, Feb 22, 2010.

  1. Forceman May the force be with you Registered Senior Member

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    The idea of God drives the race of humanity towards order and function to replace the chaos that would otherwise consume this world if there were not a set of laws and law codes to rule man. Therefore the Law of Moses was instituted. The belief in a god is not control (as Christians, we have free will), but one could have a much better ruled life, if the belief in God is in your records.
     
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  3. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    The only wrong way for a theist to take a statement like that would be to view it as somehow neutral, rather than what it is: an insult.
     
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  5. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    Oh I don't know about that.
    If anything, his two statements there are an insult to himself.

    First, logical points [whatever they may be...] don't lead to facts. Facts are empirical matters, not logical ones.


    Second [and perhaps more importantly], his second statement is triply inane:

    It doesn't follow remotely from the first.​

    He states that it is his opinion [and thus, neither a matter of fact, nor one of logic].​

    With respect to 'god', it can only be said that we are all ignorant.​



    It's thought-lacking verbiage like this that gives atheists a poor name...
     
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  7. LuckAse Registered Member

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    If we all didn't have an idea of god in are heads already and we all believed in the absence of a god. The idea of a god would sound crazy. But we live in a world filled with people who believe in god.

    Oh Yea?

    It is impossible for something (a.k.a. "god") to control the forces of nature. You can believe all you want but its simply impossible.

    Therefor If there is a god he is just a man. Which makes him not a god. Too me that would mean he is nothing.

    Why should I have do try to disprove when not a single person can even try to prove there is a god. Its impossible.

    You sir are smart. But i still have to argue, religion is still the number one way of mass control.

    We can insult each other all day. But ether way there is no proof of god.
     
  8. Doreen Valued Senior Member

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    So you know what things would be like if they were radically different.

    This argument has the following structure:

    A is impossible
    A is impossible

    This is like the argument....

    If it is not an orange it must be a bicycle.

    And the same logic is used again. Here we go from bicycles to nothing, as if this were logical.

    I don't think Glaucon has said you should try to disprove, so this is a strawman.

    State. You have stated this, you have not argued it.

    In the comparative religion forum I think your coining of the phrase

    'Ether way'

    is really quite wonderful.

    Could be a metaphor for some religious phenomenon - the soul rising to heaven, for example.

    Or it could be a metaphor for our universe from a poetic scientific viewpoint.
     
  9. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    24,690
    It's been suggested that the supernaturalist instinct may indeed have been an asset to humans in the late Paleolithic Era. The population had reached a level that there was competition between tribes for resources, and deadly violence was common. (One report I saw of a study of late Paleolithic bones using modern instruments indicated that more than half of adult human deaths were due to violence.)

    If the technology of language were developed around this time (and we have absolutely no idea when it was developed, except to say that it is at least 10,000 years old, which puts it precisely at the Paleolithic/Neolithic cusp), members of competing tribes might have been struck by the discovery that they believed in the same gods and legends. (Pre-Abrahamic religions were polytheistic and Jung tells us that they all had the same basic pantheon of 23 gods and goddesses, a very rich and stable collection of archetypes.) This could have inspired them to cooperate.

    The invention of the technologies of farming and animal husbandry--agriculture in combination--was right around the corner. Agriculture requires people to gather in somewhat larger groups than the extended families of a few dozen adults and children that comprised the average hunter-gatherer tribe. Tribes that could cast aside their suspicions and cooperate because of a shared mythology could have facilitated the Neolithic Revolution: the permanent settlements, division of labor, surplus productivity and social organization among people who had not known each other intimately since birth, which put us on the path to civilization.

    Unfortunately religion eventually reached its limit as a facilitator of civilization and now acts as a brake. Religions grew beyond their archetypes and their accretions became codified. As they grew apart, rather than reinforcing one population's similarity and kinship to its neighbor, they reinforced their differences, stalling humanity in a standoff of tribalism.
    * * * * NOTE FROM THE LINGUISTICS MODERATOR * * * *

    "Heathen" means "non-Abrahamist": anyone who is not Jewish, Christian or Muslim.
    This is something that might have seemed true ten thousand years ago when our tribes first learned to live together in peace and grow their own food. However today, as I noted above, religion has become a divisive force and is a motivator of strife and violence, i.e., an engine of chaos.

    Of course I am speaking specifically of the Abrahamic religions. Their built-in superiority complexes inspire entire sects to rise up in war against each other every few generations. Jung said, "The wars among the Christian nations have been the bloodiest in human history." He overlooked Genghis Khan, but with that one exception he was right. He also didn't live long enough to see the spectre of a three-way nuclear war among Christians, Jews and Muslims.

    My analysis, and one that a couple of Jungians agree with, is that since religion, as a collection of instinctive archetypes, is a model of our own unconscious or "spirit," the polytheistic model is a rich multi-dimensional representation of our spirit, and helps us understand ourselves. Whereas monotheism is a one-dimensional model, which attempts to squeeze all of that richness onto a pathetic linear scale where everything falls somewhere on a line between "good" and "evil."

    Much of our nature simply can't logically fit onto the "good" end of that scale, so we submerge it into our unconscious and try to deny it, where it festers in what Jung calls the "shadow" until one day it erupts into truly "evil" behavior.

    Abrahamic culture has an uncanny way of synchronizing the submerging and festering of entire communities, so their evil behavior erupts in coordination, overwhelming the secular institutions that normally keep order by ostracizing, locking up or simply executing evildoers. Thus we have Holy Wars.

    Civilization is stalled right now, with the three sects of Abrahamism prepared to erupt into one of these periodic cycles of violence all at once, and this time with nuclear weapons.

    Religion is indeed an engine of chaos.
     
  10. LuckAse Registered Member

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    If its impossible then its not possible. Right? Or in the world of god is everything possible? :roflmao:
    And you haven't said one thing worth listening to.

    Just criticizing my every word.

    The definition read not jewish, christian or muslim. My main arguement is against christians. So i didn't think it was relevent.

    Thanks for clearing that up.

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  11. jmpet Valued Senior Member

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    God- not "my God" but God- is with me every moment of my life. He is like an invisible buddy next to me. Yeah- I know how nuts it sounds but God is also an invisible buddy for you too... He is not some abstract concept- He is right there next to me with me like a best buddy.

    As such, Karma plays a big role in my life- being nicer more than not.
     
  12. LuckAse Registered Member

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    Sounds more like your consisous that a god to me. I'm not here to degrade or judge you. It was my believe that most people believe in a all seeing all knowing god.
     
  13. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    As usual, Doreen is quite insightful.

    You however, continue to demonstrate your lack of insight.
    These statement are pretty indicative of how ignorant you are.


    Indeed.



    Nice reasoning.

    lol

    Not that you paid any attention to my critique, which is another example of your ignorance, here you introduce notions that weren't even mentioned by you before. Attributing alleged properties to the subject in question and thereby simply stating it's inability to exist is fallacious.

    As another poster noted, your problem [beyond your inability to reason..] isn't with 'god', or even the concept of god, but rather with the way in which believers make use of god.

    Slow down, and try thinking sometime.
     
  14. LuckAse Registered Member

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    and you continue to annoy me.

    Prove to me there is a god right now.
     
  15. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    And you continue to evade the topic.
    Surprisingly enough, a topic chosen by you.

    Do try an follow along a little better.
     
  16. LuckAse Registered Member

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    Your not even on topic, your topic is telling me I'm ignorant.

    Don't post if your not going to add to the topic.
     
  17. glaucon tending tangentially Registered Senior Member

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    Ah, I see. You need to be treated like a child.
    Here, I'll hold your hand and walk you through the discussion:

    True or false: do people believe in god?
     
  18. LuckAse Registered Member

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    I said don't post if your not going to add to the topic. Now go fuck off.
     
  19. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    .

    why do you try soo hard, to prove to who beleive in god, that there's no god???
    why do you have to do all that effort to proove that you're right,
    you don't beleive in god, i or he/she beleive in god,
    end of story,

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    see, it's soo simple,
    you don't need to prove that you're right and they're wrong, or they're right, and you're wrong,
    ever heard of free thoght??you should try it

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  20. LuckAse Registered Member

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    Because its a discussion.
     
  21. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    hmm, yeah, hehehehe
    well;, about my personeel answer,
    about why i beleive in god,
    simple, i cant prove it to you, what convince me, don't convince you, also, i cant convince atheist, i'm not too relegious, so, it's hard for me, to convince who don't beleive in god, to beleive in god,
     
  22. LuckAse Registered Member

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    I don't have a problem with people who believe in god first of all.

    Personally I don't believe, because i see no reason too, and i see no proof.
     
  23. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    i didnt said that you have a prob. with who beleive,

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    and after all, every one have hes logic, some people, their logic tell them not to beleive, some other, their logic, tell them to beleive,
    as for me, my logic tell me to beleive, and your logic tell you not to beleive

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