You make a claim God dont exist, now prove it....

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by whatsupyall, Nov 27, 2002.

  1. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    This room is very quite...
     
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  3. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    I agree to disagree
     
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  5. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    But the fact that some can be so sure there is NO God, and some can be so sure there IS... Well, it tells me either can be wrong...
     
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  7. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    I have a feeling purple squid monkey and fuzzy pink elephant words will appear...
     
  8. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    Lol, I agree
     
  9. Nebula Occasionally Frequent Registered Senior Member

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    You don't understand; what atheists say isn't a claim in itself, it is a dependent claim!!!!!! It only has a derivative meaning!

    Without theists, there would be no such thing as atheists!

    Let's pretend that none of the population is theist. If that were so, no one would go around proclaiming to be an atheist, as no one would be claiming there was a god in the first place!

    Atheism is not a claim; is it the rejection of a claim.

    And no, theism is not a rejection of atheism.

    Theists need a reason for adding an element (GOD) to the explanation of our world.

    Atheists do not. Since an atheists belief (or lack thereof) is dependent, so is his argument! Atheism is a position that relies on theism, and so to does the atheist argument rely on the theists argument.

    For an atheist to argue against god, the only thing he can do is discredit the theists argument and say "you have no good reason to add this complicating element to our explanation."

    Answer me this one question, PLEASE: Do you understand what I'm talking about?
     
  10. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    Good point Nebula! Things are goin to get ugly soon, and that's when I leave, lol
     
  11. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    This is what I see and read..."blah blah blah blah, yada yada yada yada, listen to me ramble"...
    No, I dont understand what your saying..

    You make a claim "God dont exist", that claim needs evidence, therefore provide it, otherwise shut your hole...

    If you dont make a claim that God dont exist, then your not an atheist, but is agnostic, you just dont know whether there is god or there is no god..

    If you say "Im agnostic but is close to being an atheist", then that is another words for saying "I am not delusional but Im close to being delusional"...

    Fact: Atheist ask proof of God, answer=healing, billions of testimonies and eyewitness, proven miracles scientifically investigated, CURRENTLY speaking, healing of incurable cancers science cant explain, prophesy fulfilled which atheist calls "super coincidence!". Historical fact of the bible. Intelligent designer, rich and wealthy people willing to give up their possesion for God, proving its conviction, all REAL EVIDENCE, etc.

    Atheist reject proof bcuz they r stubborn, then they claim there is no God.You ask them proof of it & they have NONE, their choices &ignorance is their proof God is fake, so to b stupid & ignorant proves there’s no God

    Many evidence supports God, zero evidence for atheist.

    END....
     
  12. Nebula Occasionally Frequent Registered Senior Member

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    notme2000;

    I'm getting very frustrated...are these people INTENTIONALLY ignoring logic?

    I'm not leaving until they change their mind or they change my mind. Or until I wear a hole through my keyboard, which probably won't take very long at the rate I'm going..

    cheers.
     
  13. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    Whatsupyall, what general area of the world were you brought up in, just curious...

    Nebula, through my experience, we (athiest/agnostic) look like we're ignoring logic too... Theists and Athiests have different logic... No one would be so ignorant as to believe in something with no form of logic behind it. We just have different forms of logic than Whatsupyall... So to change their mind is next to impossible, because they can explain any "holes" in their logic with their own logic. This is called circular logic, but really, athiesm and science is circular logic too... Logic has to be circular to work.
     
  14. DCLXVI Bloody Bastard Registered Senior Member

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    Whatsupyall: There's an invisible being hovering in front of you, it has no substance so you hand swings through it if you try to feel for it, in fact there is no possible way for you to detect it. Now I'm telling you it is there, prove to me that it isn't.

    You can't can you? And you probably think that I'm an idiot for even suggesting that it's there in the first place. Yet, how is this different from your proclamations of a non-detectable invisible superbeing living in the clouds?
     
  15. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    If you make a claim of invisible being hovering around you, then you have the burden of proof of the invisible being claim. If you make a claim of toothfairy, then you have the burden of proof to prove your claim...If you make a claim God dont exist, then you have a burden of proof to your claim...If you make a claim God exist, then you have the burden of proof to your claim...THE BURDEN OF PROOF ARE TO THOSE WHO MAKE THE CLAIM...

    Present to me evidence of "invisible thingy", then I will believe on it, otherwise it is just a myth, fake...And your right, you must be an idiot to suggest that its there to begin with in the first place if u cannot provide proof of its existence..For instance, substancial evidence is good, if you make a claim that this invisible thingy comes at night and tickels you, have you experienced it? If so, how many other peeps have gone through the same experience?

    In summary, a claim can be proven FAKE by lack of evidence.....Period...




    Atheist will say "If God is not fake because u want proof he is, then prove to me tooth fairies/invisible thingy/unicorns don’t hover around earth every night".

    Smart Christian will say "A claim can b proven fake by lack of evidence. What evidence do u have of tooth fairy? How many eyewitnesses? Millions? If tooth fairies plucked out a teeth, is there any scientific investigation done to it? If so can u show it? How many testified? Show me healing, supernatural/miracles documented in the name of tooth fairy. How many died for tooth fairy to verify its value? Thousands? Is there a Historical location of it? If so, where? Give up? Well tooth fairy because of its lack of evidence is fake. Period...
     
  16. You Killed Jesus 14/88 Registered Senior Member

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    The universe is merely my brain in a vat, with an evil genius typing things into my brain, making up my experiences.

    Prove me wrong, I dare you.
     
  17. DCLXVI Bloody Bastard Registered Senior Member

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    Your line of reasoning astounds me. Yes, I did make a claim that an invisible creature was hovering around your head and I agree with you that the burden of proof should lie on my shoulders. Likewise the burden of proving your claim of god existing should lie on your shoulders.

    All I ask of you is to do the same for your claim.

    Unless you can come up with proof of the existence of god, I believe you just shot yourself in the leg.

    Oh, I could come up with a list of followers that would back me up in my claims, but in reality you'd just be taking their word for it instead of mine so unless I can come up with solid evidence to back my claims I have nothing to base them on.

    BLAM, it must be hard remaining in a standing position with holes in both legs. I suggest you sit down if you haven't already.

    No, an atheist would simply ask you to prove the existence of god. I doubt he would be interested in the toothfairy.

    Oxymoron?

    Lets just say for the sake of argument that such a thing as a smart christian does exist, then that person would ask those same questions about his god.

    Millions of parents world wide.

    The toothfairy leaves money under pillows, it does not perform miracles. But I could find plenty of documented cases of kids finding money under their pillows after leaving a tooth there the previous night. Now ask yourself, does that prove the toothfairys existence?

    The toothfairy does not need people to die to verify its value

    There have been documented cases of toothfairy activity all over the world.

    No evidence? What do you call the money left behind in the morning if it's not evidence?
     
  18. DCLXVI Bloody Bastard Registered Senior Member

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    Indeed. A crime, it seems, not only atheists are guilty of...

    Edit: That's strange, this was a reply to whatsupyall's post that has somehow ended up below this one. And I see that he has also taken the liberty to change it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2002
  19. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    THE TOP 10 OF THE ATHEISM'S ARGUMENT AGAINST GOD, ALL QUOTED FROM THE WRITINGS OF ATHEISTS HERE....Summary of atheists argument, the outcome from all the debates...

    1. Atheist says "To have faith means to believe in myths", so faith is illogic...(LOL, got brain?)

    2. Atheist says "Nature is super duper LUCK! In other words "Chance"!", (no evidence supports this claim of "possibility")..

    3. Atheists says "All christians are killers and perverts! Therefore there is no God!", (Are u ok?)...

    4. Atheists says "The word "Knowing" means establishing, controlling, and Doing! Therefore if humans have freewill, then God cant be all knowing!! Because knowing something means contolling something!!", (just plain stupid).....

    5. Atheists says "You have no proof of God!", (although tons of evidence are given)...

    6. Atheists says "Theory means FACT! And needs no faith! Because theory is another word for PURE EVIDENCE!!", (just plain delusional)...

    7. Atheists says "I am very smart!! And I know what Im talking about!!", (another false remark)....

    8. Atheists says "I dont make a claim, you do, so prove your claim, otherwise God is a myth"...(Wait a minute, u said u dont make claim, but then said "God is a myth", isnt that a claim? Now do u have a proof of yur claim?).

    9. Atheists says "Evolution contradicts God"...(When it doesnt, only 2 those who take the bible literally)...


    And let the drums roll, for the best and the last comment atheists will say concerning God.........((((((((((drums rolling)))))))))))..

    Well here it is...

    10. Atheist says "Prove to me Giant purple squid monkeys, fuzzy pink elephant dont exist", (TENG DENG! This is the best of the best of atheism's argument against God, a IGNORANT and illogic pointless comment, is their best argument)...


    HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING LOGIC ABOVE? HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING THAT IS "TRUTHFULL"? HAVE YOU SEEN ANYTHING "SCIENTIFIC" ABOVE? LOL, ASK ATHEIST AND THEY WILL SAY "YES, ALL THOSE MAKE SENSE"....LOL...
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2002
  20. notme2000 The Art Of Fact Registered Senior Member

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    :bugeye:
     
  21. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    HAS THIS BEEN DOCUMENTED? PLENTY OF DOCUMENTED CASES ABOUT REALITY OF TOTHFAIRIES? YOUR A COMPULSIVE LIAR...

    HAVE ANYONE TESTIFIED TO THIS TRUTH? HOW MANY? MILLIONS? PROVIDE THIS "BASIC" EVIDENCE, OTHERWISE I HAVE NO REASON TO BELIEVE IT...AND DONT LIE TO MAKE A POINT....

    I AM NOT ASKING YOU THAT ONLY, BUT SHOW ME SOME CONVICTION..HOW MANY PEOPLE GAVE UP THEIR WEALTH IN SERVICE TO TOOTHFAIRY, PROVING THAT ITS GENUINITY. MARTYRDOM ISNT THE ONLY WAY, YOU CAN ALSO DO SOME SACRIFICE SUCH AS, CLEANING YUR PILLOW EVERYDAY BECAUSE THE TOOTHFAIRY WILL COME TO VISIT THAT NIGHT..
    IF YOU CLAIM THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO PRACTICE IT, THEN PROVE IT..DO THEY NUMBER AS MUCH AS CHRISTIANS?


    YOU MAKE THE CLAIM THAT THERE IS NOW PROVE IT...OTHERWISE SHUT YOUR HOLE..YOU LIAR...YOU WANT ME TO PROVIDE PROOF OF DOCUMENTED MIRACLES OF GOD? THEN JUST ASK LITTLE IGNORANT CHILD...

    WHO TESTIFIED THIS? YOU? I DONT BELIEVE 1 WITNESS, I WOULD BELIEVE IF MILLIONS TESTIFIED THE SAME THING, BECAUSE THE ODDS OF THEM ALL LYING AND ARE "SCHIZPHRENIC" IS VERY UNLIKELY, PRESIDENTS, WORLD LEADERS, DOCTORS, AND SCIENTISTS CHRISTIANS CANNOT BE ALL "SCHIZOPHRENIC"... I BELIEVE IN HIGH PROBABILITIES, THAN LOW PROBABILITY...
     
  22. whatsupyall Banned Banned

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    You made the claim, the burden of proof lies on you..If you provide no evidence, then that claim is fake...
     
  23. DCLXVI Bloody Bastard Registered Senior Member

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    Ah... You're one of those...

    I don't believe you understood the point I was trying to make.

    Also I did not say I had plenty of documented cases about the reality of toothfairys, but of toothfairy activity such as money turning up in exchange for teeth. That, my friend, is not the same thing.

    I told no lies in my previous posts, I presented scenarios for you to think about without taking into account your inability to actually think. That again, my friend, is not the same thing.

    There are plenty of children that believe in the toothfairy and santa claus, and they "practice" those belief in ways tought to them by their parents. That however doesn't make them real.


    Yes, by all means do.

    Let me put it this way, no more than 7 or 800 years ago almost the entire poplulation of earth believe that the stars were holes in the sky or dots of light stuck on a solid surface. They also believed that the Earth was flat and that it was the middle of the universe. Now, since so many people believed it and were willing to "testify" that this was true, did that make them right?
     

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