Zbigniew Brzezinski

Discussion in 'World Events' started by outlandish, Jan 26, 2009.

  1. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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  3. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    I've been meaning to get around to his book. The Grand Chessboard
     
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  5. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    no doubt a good read, will have to get take a gander at it myself.

    but this guy is potentially more dangerous than bush/neo cons. (see my comments here):
    http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=90093
     
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  7. spidergoat Liddle' Dick Tater Valued Senior Member

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    No one was more dangerous than the neo-cons.
     
  8. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    he's more dangerous for you, thats for sure. He doesn't see the point of/care for your precious israel. he wants bigger fish.
     
  9. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    Zbigniew Kazimierz Brzezinski

    Major foreign policy events during his term of office included the normalization of relations with the People's Republic of China (and the severing of ties with the Republic of China), the signing of the second Strategic Arms Limitation Treaty (SALT II), the brokering of the Camp David Accords, the transition of Iran to an anti-Western Islamic state, encouraging reform in Eastern Europe and emphasizing human rights in U.S. foreign policy in order to question the legitimacy of Soviet power,[2] the arming of the mujaheddin in Afghanistan[3] to fight against the Soviet-friendly Afghan government, increase the probability of Soviet invasion and later entanglement in a Vietnam-style war,[4] and later to counter the Soviet invasion, and the signing of the Torrijos-Carter Treaties relinquishing U.S. control of the Panama Canal after 1999.

    He is currently professor of American foreign policy at Johns Hopkins University's School of Advanced International Studies, a scholar at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, and a member of various boards and councils. He appears frequently as an expert on the PBS program The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zbigniew_Brzezinski
     
  10. spidergoat Liddle' Dick Tater Valued Senior Member

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    He brokered the Camp David Accords, a step forward in Israel/ Egyptian relations.
     
  11. outlandish smoki'n....... Registered Senior Member

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    not out of any affinity towards israel.
     
  12. spidergoat Liddle' Dick Tater Valued Senior Member

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    Well, anyone who encourages peace between Israel and it's neighbors can't be all that bad.
     
  13. countezero Registered Senior Member

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    I'm tired of the oft repeated mantra that he started the Afghan program and lured the Soviets into that country. It's crap and more crap. The Soviets were always going to invade, and the assistance under Carter was never enough to be the tipping point, despite what others say.
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Well clearly, you know more than him. I mean, he was only the guy who orchestrated it, what does he know? Duh.
     
  15. countezero Registered Senior Member

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    He made one statement, years later, that this was his plan all along.

    Yeah.

    Right.

    Problem is, the US gave next to nothing to Afghans when he was in office, and even if they did, the US did not and could not create the disintegrating political situation that caused the Russians to invade. That was the fault of the foundering communist govt. in Kabul and the nitwit in charge.

    Ask yourself, if Carter and ZB were so on point funding the Afghans, then why did Charlie Wilson have to come along and actually throw real money at it? Initially, the budget was just $5 million (see the book or the movie, in which the Pakistanis tell Wilson the amount was a "joke"). Why did Casey have to get the Saudis to match the US dollar for dollar? Oh, right. Because Carter and ZB had this huge diabolical scheme to get the Red Army nervous about a bunch of peasants with WW1-era rifles.
     
  16. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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  17. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    That was later (Wilson's War) - read the dates in your link. Zbig might have had grand plans, but if so others carried them out after he was elsewhere.
     
  18. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    So you think that CIA "helping" the mujahideen six months before the Soviet invasion played no part in the invasion?
     
  19. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    His daughter is pretty hot!
     
  20. John99 Banned Banned

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    why the quotes around the word helping?
     
  21. Ganymede Valued Senior Member

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    Indeed, Mika is hot! It wouldn't surprise me if we learned that Scarborough has been hitting that all along.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  22. countezero Registered Senior Member

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    As I've already stated, the "help" amounted to little or nothing, so no it did not play a role in the Soviet's decision. Again, it was the deteriorating govt. in Kabul, coupled with events in Iran, that compelled them to act.

    If you recall, Carter was also furious when the Soviets invaded the country, yet you posit his cabinet was working at a cross-purpose? Right. . .

    To put the "help" in perspective, you should consider that the CIA at the time you are talking about was spending more money printing books for dissident Poles than it was on guns for the Afghans. You should also learn how to do research, because as Ice pointed out, your link actually argues my point -- not yours.
     
  23. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    How much of help would you consider sufficient to be considered incendiary in the Russian invasion? According to ZB, he sent a memo to Carter that if they sent money and arms to the mujahideen the Russians would be sure to invade. And he was right. Is there any way that you can prove that the Russians knew how much help the Afghans were receiving or that, if they had not seen American involvement in funding militant groups in their allied country next door they would have invaded anyway?
     

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