Any atheists here who were once believers?

(Q) said:
Indoctrination is a powerful tool, used to get folks to believe in things, like gods and religions. When one is "immersed" in religion their whole lives, their brains don't develop properly and they lack critical thinking skills, reason, rationale, etc., and instead use belief systems, which like indoctrination, don't require any thinking, just believing.
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Agreed

So, when things go awry, one simply uses their minds to reason and rationalize solutions to whatever problems arise.
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THAT is surprising answer

Because this is exactly what I do , I reason it out





Since the indoctrinated believer doesn't have these skills, they tend to pray to their gods to do the thinking for them.
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Exactly
 
wegs said:
It's funny, but there was a thread here whereby the topic was about if atheists are more intelligent than religious people? I can't remeber the title now, but that was the gist. I was very offended, as you can imagine. :D But, I can understand why some think this of religious people. The guy I'm dating is a brainiac...but, he tells me that he never thought that about religious types. He said rather he has always thought they don't take ownership of their own lives. He gets me to reason more now, than I used to. I came to him with a problem I'm dealing with at work, and he helped me 'reason' it through. Whereas honestly? Before him? I'd just pray about it and hope for the best. Not to say I don't reason things through at times, I do. But, my tendency when faced with conflict or difficulty, is to pray over it, and not come up with a solution. :eek:

I can't speak for all people who have followed God or religion, but, that is just my experience. That could be where my angst always came in. For many years, I'd pray, and never feel settled. That's because I wasn't taking action, I was 'relying' on God to handle the situation.

I can't explain how it feels to realize this...and be okay with it. I'm finally feeling ...settled. :)
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The question of whether atheists are more intelligent than religious people isn't one of perception, but statistical fact. Statistics show that professed atheists tend to have higher IQs than their believer counterparts. Does this necessarily mean they're more intelligent? I don't know.
 
Balerion said:
The question of whether atheists are more intelligent than religious people isn't one of perception, but statistical fact. Statistics show that professed atheists tend to have higher IQs than their believer counterparts. Does this necessarily mean they're more intelligent? I don't know.
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Hmmm...It'd be interesting to see if ''professed atheists'' mean have they been atheists their entire lives?
I think there's exceptions to the stats, certainly...but I just know that my reasoning skills need sharpening from years of not reasoning often enough, through conflicts and personal/professional dilemmas. I don't know what a life without prayer...will be like. To solely use logic, experience, reasoning? That would be different.
 
wegs said:
edit to add...and I agree about indoctrination. Another thing I used to be offended by, when said to me. lol But, yeah. I guess I was, to a degree...earlier in life. As an adult...over the years...I had educated myself on my faith, but that 'indoctrination' built the foundation, dare I say. The indoctrination I speak of...is fear.
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Very often, believers are offended when others tell them they've been indoctrinated, but that is what's required in order to believe in things without proof or without question.

You will often hear of atheists stating they have and hold no beliefs, which basically means they don't believe in things without questioning them first. Of course, once a person begins questioning, they will often reach an "understanding", which then precludes the need to believe.

You will probably often read my posts in which I make that distinction. For example, someone may say they believe in evolution, but I will interject to ask if they actually understand it. :)
 
Good luck on your journey Wegs wherever it may lead you.:)

I hope whatever you decide you will not be ostracized by your family or current friends. Personally I have experienced at best a cool response by now former friends and many family members. and at worst ostracizing by same. I hope this will not be your experience, but you should be prepared for this likelihood.

http://www.alternet.org/story/151241/10_scariest_states_to_be_an_atheist?page=0,1
 
(Q) said:
And, you understand communism from those events, how exactly? I lived in the Soviet Union for a year.
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Big deal you lived probably as an invited host , Part of my family are there ,I invited my cousin and he stayed with us for 6 months , He was a party member
now that we identified our back experience, lets get to the grain about the beautiful system that killed around 10 million people did not want join the koljos ,
the system who leveled down houses if there was a gathering to pry to Gog . Go on thy to convince me with your knowledge, I am ready.
 
Originally Posted by (Q)
And, you understand communism from those events, how exactly? I lived in the Soviet Union for a year.
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arauca said:
Big deal you lived probably as an invited host , Part of my family are there ,I invited my cousin and he stayed with us for 6 months , He was a party member
now that we identified our back experience, lets get to the grain about the beautiful system that killed around 10 million people did not want join the koljos ,
the system who leveled down houses if there was a gathering to pry to Gog . Go on thy to convince me with your knowledge, I am ready.
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This is going to get heavy
 
(Q) said:
Indoctrination is a powerful tool, used to get folks to believe in things, like gods and religions. When one is "immersed" in religion their whole lives, their brains don't develop properly and they lack critical thinking skills, reason, rationale, etc., and instead use belief systems, which like indoctrination, don't require any thinking, just believing.

So, when things go awry, one simply uses their minds to reason and rationalize solutions to whatever problems arise. Since the indoctrinated believer doesn't have these skills, they tend to pray to their gods to do the thinking for them.
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Now I start to understand you. You probably went to the USSR to be molded as a party member . And so the Bolsheviks removed the learned people from the pre communist era, and started from scratch , they removed al past history of Russia as it never existed . So what did they produce tell me . The good Russian spirit did not die and the idiots of your mentality collapsed and appropriated of National assets . Now could Russia produce so many billioners in such a short time. Can you explain
 
(Q) said:
You will often hear of atheists stating they have and hold no beliefs, which basically means they don't believe in things without questioning them first. Of course, once a person begins questioning, they will often reach an "understanding", which then precludes the need to believe.

You will probably often read my posts in which I make that distinction. For example, someone may say they believe in evolution, but I will interject to ask if they actually understand it. :)
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I asked you to explain evolution sense pretend to know it , but you don't answer , perhaps you are just a charlatan.
 
Balerion said:
The question of whether atheists are more intelligent than religious people isn't one of perception, but statistical fact. Statistics show that professed atheists tend to have higher IQs than their believer counterparts. Does this necessarily mean they're more intelligent? I don't know.
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But does higher IQ translate into greater happiness? If this is the only life we have to live, then why do we have to worship intellectualism?
 
arauca said:
Big deal you lived probably as an invited host , Part of my family are there ,I invited my cousin and he stayed with us for 6 months , He was a party member
now that we identified our back experience, lets get to the grain about the beautiful system that killed around 10 million people did not want join the koljos ,
the system who leveled down houses if there was a gathering to pry to Gog . Go on thy to convince me with your knowledge, I am ready.
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In other words, you really have no clue what was going on there.
 
arauca said:
Now I start to understand you. You probably went to the USSR to be molded as a party member . And so the Bolsheviks removed the learned people from the pre communist era, and started from scratch , they removed al past history of Russia as it never existed . So what did they produce tell me . The good Russian spirit did not die and the idiots of your mentality collapsed and appropriated of National assets . Now could Russia produce so many billioners in such a short time. Can you explain
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Sorry, I am unable to understand gibberish, could you translate that into English, please? Thanks muchly. :)
 
Mazulu said:
But does higher IQ translate into greater happiness? If this is the only life we have to live, then why do we have to worship intellectualism?
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Perhaps, but the term "ignorance is bliss" does have merit.
 
Mazulu said:
But does higher IQ translate into greater happiness? If this is the only life we have to live, then why do we have to worship intellectualism?
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Because of vanity, I believe a true intellectual will not tray to impress , because he knows its limitation
 
(Q) said:
Perhaps, but the term "ignorance is bliss" does have merit.
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What if the "Jerry Springer Show" really represented what happy people look like? OMG! Oh, wait! I bet the people who frequent Psychic Fairs are happy. A psychic reader tells them what they want to hear, and they're happy. And then they make whatever choice is best for them. What about people who get :m:high:m:? Are they happy? What about people who are into reading fiction? Romance novels? Science fiction? Are they happy?

What about religious people who worship God faithfully? Who have religious/spiritual experiences? Are they happy? What about people who are into the occult and pagan rituals? Are they happy?

What about people who dedicate their lives to accumulating useless knowledge about "reality", which is mostly a bunch of things that can't be done. Are they happy? They don't sound happy. They sound really pissed off.
 
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