Is faith a reliable path to knowledge?

[billvon]

Your point is?

That even if faith is "quite natural" to us, that doesn't make it a good thing. Lots of things that are "quite natural" to us are bad.

 

[ThazzarBaal]

I thought it was fairly clear: Everything that comes naturally isn't necessarily good. Specifically, faith coming naturally doesn't mean faith is good. What do you not understand about that?

I'm curious why you apply that line of reasoning to me. I stated it's a natural part of everyday life. we can't help but exercise it. We can discern which type is beneficial to us, which is why I choose a fact based view, something I can verify either objectively or subjectively as it pertains to my personal benefit.

 

[Write4U]

I'm curious why you apply that line of reasoning to me. I stated it's a natural part of everyday life. we can't help but exercise it. We can discern which type is beneficial to us, which is why I choose a fact based view, something I can verify either objectively or subjectively as it pertains to my personal benefit.

But in nature that argument applies to all organisms, good or bad, such as virulent bacteria that kill us or symbiotic bacteria that keep us alive.

"Do unto others as you would have them do to you" is a double-edged sword, it applies indiscriminately to all forms of life.

 

[ThazzarBaal]

But in nature that argument applies to all organisms, good or bad, such as virulent bacteria that kill us or symbiotic bacteria that keep us alive.

"Do unto others as you would have them do to you" is a double-edged sword, it applies indiscriminately to all forms of life.

Ok, so how does the do unto others passage apply to the discussion of faith? To me faith is about having a desired result, then having that desire met after acting on it in an effort to achieve...like sitting in a chair. We do this daily. Finding cures for diseases is another type. Efforts are made with that hope, and although a slow process at times, they are often times substantiated by finding cures through the efforts.

My personal take on the passage you quoted is if I don't like it, I wouldn't apply it to someone else unless I know there's a real benefit. I wouldn't expect a sadist to treat me as if I enjoyed that sort of thing. Good things for me are not moral based, but rather based on evident benefit and how they effect me as a person. Evil things are those that I haven't found to be beneficial and that cause me distress or trauma.

 

[sideshowbob]

I stated it's a natural part of everyday life. we can't help but exercise it.

Sure we can. We overcome our natural instincts all the time. Social behavior is nothing BUT overcoming our natural instincts for the good of the species (the community).

Not to mention the fact that our natural instincts often conflict with each other - e.g. our instinct for individual survival often conflicts with our instinct for survival of the species (we feed our children AND ourselves).

 

[ThazzarBaal]

Sure we can. We overcome our natural instincts all the time. Social behavior is nothing BUT overcoming our natural instincts for the good of the species (the community).

Not to mention the fact that our natural instincts often conflict with each other - e.g. our instinct for individual survival often conflicts with our instinct for survival of the species (we feed our children AND ourselves).

Ok, so your faith in community efforts being more beneficial than individual efforts has you in a mindset that we don't exercise faith daily? Individualistic interdependence is essentially how communities function effectively. Faith is something we exercise daily, although unrecognized as faith by some. Overcoming ignorance would be beneficial but a loss of faith when evidenced with some substance.