Non-agnostic atheism is a sign of narcissism

J

Joseph Barron

Registered Member
A narcissist does not want to change because the agnostic view is a place of uncertainty which they would not like. A narcissist goes
with what makes them feel powerful I suspect.
 
Possibly. On the other hand, it's also possible that the world view of an atheist is simply not reconcilable with the concept of a god.
 
In my understanding, there are basically two kinds of atheists: those who can't reconcile religion with their knowledge of everything else, and those who reject religion for emotional reasons, as if rebeling against whatever ghosts they keep in their closets. I guess the former would be what you call agnostic and the latter narcissistic, but I think the dichotomy is false. Ultimately we are all trying to make sense of our lives, and having very limited success at that.

In reality any philosophy that is small enough to be contained in a man's head is not big enough to contain the whole universe, and that is why philosophies don't matter - they ignore much more than they can possibly explain.
 
Agreed. A philosophy is only useful to help explain ourselves and the world around us. I don't think any philosophy actually represents "truth."
 
Philosophy, like science, can be "true" to the extent that it is practical. I find I cannot even decide whether I should have eggs or cereal for breakfast if I don't have a philosophy. Heck, without a philosophy I cannot even decide between getting up or staying in bed.

I think this is the main point people miss when presented with the claim that "religion X is true". You find "truth" when you find satisfying answers about what time to get out of bed, what to have for breakfast, or what to do with your life. As such, it's only natural that different people find "truth" in different places.
 
Joseph Barron said:
A narcissist does not want to change because the agnostic view is a place of uncertainty which they would not like. A narcissist goes
with what makes them feel powerful I suspect.
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so then the same thing is true for anyone who believes in god? a theist is a narcissist because the agnostic view is a place of uncertainty which they would not like?
 
agnosticism is a question of epistemology...

atheism is a question of deities...

i generally agree with the OP. I think that a human's natural and most condusive state to general welfare is agnosticism, and that a lack thereof is simply obfuscation of one's natural curiousity and potential skepticism. generally such obfuscation is incurred through social conditioning or sociopathic tendencies... something like that. I should rethink that a smidge, but I'm too lazy at the moment.
 
I am certain that the personification of natural forces is the most unlikely possibility there is, since personality is the rarest phenomenon in the known universe. Therefore to grant equal likelyhood to all possibilities (especially those concieved of before science) discounts our own reasoning abilities. There are degrees of uncertainty.
 
Joseph Barron said:
A narcissist does not want to change because the agnostic view is a place of uncertainty which they would not like. A narcissist goes with what makes them feel powerful I suspect.
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What's wrong with narcissicm? It's fun! :D
 
spidergoat said:
I am certain that the personification of natural forces is the most unlikely possibility there is, since personality is the rarest phenomenon in the known universe. Therefore to grant equal likelyhood to all possibilities (especially those concieved of before science) discounts our own reasoning abilities. There are degrees of uncertainty.
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I wonder from where you gather one must think of all things with equal probability?
 
How are you defining narcissism?

Strictly speaking it’s the love or infatuation with an image, one that is not real.

In the classic story, he finds his image in a body of water and can't stop looking at it- it’s the
image and not the reality that has him captivated.

Likewise in psychology- a narcissist creates an illusion of who they are and expends great
amounts of energy to maintain that illusion, usually to mask some great flaw - ether perceived
correctly or not, but they are not willing to admit the flaw. A type of self delusion.

It appears to be self love while in reality its self hate.
 
Wes, Joseph Barron characterizes agnosticism as "a place of uncertainty", and I'm simply pointing out that some things are more uncertain than others. You may be correct that agnostics do not actually view all possibilities as equally probable, but view the entire subject as unknowable. I suppose I am promoting Agnostic atheism—the view that God may or may not exist, but that his non-existence is more likely. Some agnostic atheists would at least partially base their beliefs on Occam's Razor.
(definition from wikipedia)
 
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spidergoat said:
Wes, Joseph Barron characterizes agnosticism as "a place of uncertainty", and I'm simply pointing out that some things are more uncertain than others.
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My take on that whole situation is ultimately a matter of authority.

You have the absolute authority over your own perspective. You can express with 100% confidence how things seem. You cannot however, express with 100% confidence, how things are. IMO, this is what the term agnosticism recognizes. It's not a choice, it's an observation and labelling of a geometric relationship of a perspective to its environment. IMO, everyone is agnostic, but some are more narcissitic and for whatever reason must pretend their authority extends beyond what things seem to be. This is an illusion.

You may be correct that agnostics do not actually view all possibilities as equally probable, but view the entire subject as unknowable.
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IMO, agnosticim means that knowledge is tentative, flexible and never absolute regarding matters beyond one's perception. I cannot say with absolute certainty that I have typed this message. I can say that I'm absolutely sure it seems that I've typed this message, and that you'd have a goddamned hard time convincing me otherwise.

I do not need to, and cannot know "what is real". Neither can anyone. It's impossible due to the nature of a perspective. We are limited to "what appears to be real".

I suppose I am promoting Agnostic atheism—the view that God may or may not exist, but that his non-existence is more likely.
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Technically I'd think agnostic athiesm could yeild any degree of probability short of certainty. I do not believe nor disbelief in god. I find the topic moot, but fascinating from a psychological perspecitive. The subject is moot due to the points above.

Some agnostic atheists would at least partially base their beliefs on Occam's Razor.
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Sure.
 
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