Skeptics have already made their minds up about UAPs

Discussion in 'Conspiracies' started by Yazata, Sep 1, 2023.

  1. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    12,492
    Here we see the classic MR lie, deliberately misquoting the critical statement.

    The speaker does not say "interesting manoeuvres".

    He says "interesting apparent manoeuvres".

    There is thus no endorsement of any notion of a "technology".
     
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  3. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    You said
    So, no. There was no "admission of ... unknown technology", as you tried to assert. Disingenuous. Very Trumpian.


    No quote. Didn't happen.... what a shock.


    Can we expunge such "deliberate falsehoods"* from thread?

    *I'm being kind here
     
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  5. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    So, no quotes from NASA saying they think it's technology, then? I thought so.

    Will you retract your false claim, then?
     
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  7. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Sure, I'll retract that they said it was technology, but I'm sticking to the evidence showing it is technology. The characteristics of the metallic spheres presented in the slide presentation of Sean Kirkpatrick and which I listed all point to some sort of advanced technology. Do you have a better suggestion as to what it is?
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2023
  8. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    12,492
    Haha, this is something creationists do. Something science cannot yet explain? Then godidit unless you have a better idea.

    In science, one resists the urge to jump in prematurely with half-arsed notions, for phenomena on which there is insufficient evidence. Instead, one gathers more information, while keeping one’s trap shut.
     
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  9. foghorn Valued Senior Member

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    1,476
    “we see these in making very interesting apparent maneuvers.”
    Is this to do with off world technology? See quote below

    This is Kirkpatrick talking at Defence meeting in April 2023:
    My bold above
    https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/download/kirkpatrick-statement?download=1
     
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  10. foghorn Valued Senior Member

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    1,476
    About the slide.
    Sean Kirkpatrick talking about the Middle East orb at the NASA meeting: My bold below:
    My bold above. NASA meeting transcript:
    https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/nasa-holds-first-public-meeting-on-ufos-transcript
    The slide itself (also shown in Magical Realist’s clip) has this to say about that Middle East orb:
    See my blue arrow on that slide below.
    https://science.nasa.gov/science-red/s3fs-public/atoms/files/Sean Kirkpatrick - 1100am to 1130am.pdf

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    ****************************************************

    " we see these in making very interesting apparent maneuvers." See my post #86 above
    Kirkpatrick defence meeting April 2023:
    "I should also state clearly for the record that in our research AARO has found no credible evidence thus far of extraterrestrial activity, off-world technology, or objects that defy the known laws of physics."
    https://www.armed-services.senate.gov/download/kirkpatrick-statement?download=1
     
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  11. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    What evidence do you have that shows it is technology? What are you referring to?
    Not according to Sean Kirkpatrick.

    I guess that if you're willing to refer to something like an ordinary weather balloon as "some sort of advanced technology" then perhaps you're right. When somebody says "advanced technology", the question of "compared to what?" can always be asked. Thus, the wheel and axle is advanced technology compared to the log-roll. The modern weather balloon is advanced technology compared to your average party balloon. A modern F15 fighter is advanced technology compared to the Wright Flyer.

    What you really want to show is that there's some sort of technology in play that is advanced beyond anything that human beings have produced. Unfortunately for you, you have no good evidence in support of your wish, as usual.

    Better than what? You haven't suggested what it is. Tell me what you think it is. Then I'll tell you whether I have a better suggestion. Okay?

    Also ... are we playing a round of Who Has the Best Fantasy? Or are we going to judge "better explanation" with reference to some actual evidence? For me, "better suggestions" tend to mean suggestions that are more closely aligned with what we actually know about the thing in question. How about you?
     
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  12. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    It's God.
    All those properties point to God.
     
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  13. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    [QUOTE="Magical Realist, post: 3719148]If that isn't technology then what is it? The planet Venus?

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    [/QUOTE]
    I'd go with an aerostat that was misidentified.
     
  14. C C Consular Corps - "the backbone of diplomacy" Valued Senior Member

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    In terms of proof, I don't know what they are. And that may be the case for years, if the Middle East orbs were property of military establishment or rogue organizations. Similar to Kirkpatrick ambiguity, future mediating spokespeople would be wavering: "These appear interesting... but not really that interesting" for some reason gone undisclosed.

    The best guess of the doubter and debunker community, despite misgivings about hasty judgements, is (surprise and shock!) that they are balloons.

    (metabunk) Anti-drone countermeasure? A reflective balloon designed to spoof radar?
    https://www.metabunk.org/threads/mi...rent-spherical-uap-via-aaro.12932/post-289445

    (meatbunk) Orb similar to Winch Aerostat Small Platform [WASP], used by the US military
    https://www.metabunk.org/threads/mi...ent-spherical-uap-via-aaro.12932/#post-289446

    2016 Mosul orb
    http://www.sciforums.com/threads/sk...inds-up-about-uaps.166140/page-4#post-3719117

    Pop-market debunkers from visual effects trade
    http://www.sciforums.com/threads/ufos-uaps-explanations.160045/page-463#post-3719158

    If military spy balloons that broke free from a tow tether, rather than party balloons -- and something other than a "radar spoofer", then the images and footage shot from above could feature the balloon itself obscuring a payload. Or occasionally the latter looks like a blended part of the former, in frames where the UAP becomes less round-shaped. Plus, some promotional photos of WASP exhibit a generic, underlying apparatus hugging very close to the belly of the balloon rather than extending far below it.

    Some of the Chinese inflatables (and probably those of other nations) may also have a metal-coated appearance, if going by this: "The unidentified flying object was described by a Pentagon memo as a 'small, metallic balloon with a tethered payload below it.'" (LINK)

    video link --> Ordinary balloon appearing to move extraordinarily fast
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2023
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  15. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    I don't think so..

    Aerostat:

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    Last edited: Sep 13, 2023
  16. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Might be a balloon if we cherry pick out of the characteristics that it makes very interesting maneuvers and flies up to Mach 2. Typical editing of account to make it fit their preconclusion.
     
  17. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    12,492
    Except it probably does neither.
     
  18. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    We have been over this. No one account is described as having all the characteristics.

    I'll use crayons:
    "Typical Midwest Fruit Crops include purple grapes and seedless oranges."
    MR: "See how they admit the existence of purple oranges?"

    (Talk about "editing of accounts to make it fit your preconclusion". You got that right!)

    You are so dishonest.
     
  19. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    Aerostat:

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    So dishonest.
     
  20. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    aer·o·stat
    /ˈerōˌstat/
    noun
    1. an airship or hot-air balloon, especially one that is tethered."
     
  21. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    16,686
    Still the fact that some accounts have these attributes rules out them being balloons.
     
  22. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    I find it ironic that you use the phrase "cherry picking" since that's exactly what you're doing.

    Someone: "Grapes can rot."
    MR: "Here's twelve pictures of grapes that are not rotten."
    Someone: "OK well, here's one pic of grapes that are rotten."

    You wanna play quotes? OK.

    "Originally, aerostats were simply known as balloons. As lighter-than-air flight technology evolved, new types of powered aerostats were invented, with “balloon” being reserved for unpowered aerostats. Perhaps the simplest form of aerostat, a balloon is an unpowered aerostat with no capability for propulsion."

    So there's your rotten grape.

    So dishonest.
     
  23. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,959
    No it doesn't.

    Because they don't say they have these traits; they say "they appear to have these apparent traits".

    Which is worded that way to make it clear those traits are not considered fact.

    So dishonest.
     

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