UFOs (UAPs): Explanations?

Discussion in 'UFOs, Ghosts and Monsters' started by Magical Realist, Oct 10, 2017.

  1. foghorn Valued Senior Member

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    Okay, what you seem to be saying there, is that you or the members have not made it wrong to lie on this site until there's a there's a suggestion to change the 'rules' to make it so. No wonder this thread is so full of off topic crap.
     
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  3. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    I didn't lie. I simply excerpted an article because I have been told cutting and pasting whole articles is against the rules. There was no devious motive for me leaving out a paragraph. I do it all the time.
     
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  5. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    This is a lie.
     
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  7. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    And that's a lie!

    See how stupid this is?
     
  8. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    You want us to conclude that you ether can't or won't distinguish between calling out a lie and simply parroting someone's words facetiously. It's all the same to you, is it?
    OK, so be it, Yazata.
     
  9. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    I didn't perceive any "lie". People quote excerpts from longer pieces of text all the time. (It's the point of quoting.) I'm sure that I can find examples of Dave quoting from longer pieces of text and leaving some of the original text out.

    Certainly quote mining or quoting text out of context can be misleading if it is done with the intention of making an author seem to have said something different than he/she meant to say. I assume that's what Dave is accusing you of doing.

    I see no evidence that you did that. Your excerpts are completely in line with the author's original thesis statement at the beginning and his conclusion at the end. The material that you left out was description of ocean phosphorescence that the author was contrasting the light-wheels with. It wasn't his explanation for the wheels, which he clearly says remains unknown.

    If Dave thinks that you somehow falsified the message of the text you quoted and that you intentionally left out what Dave seemingly thinks was the author's explanation for the wheels, then the onus is on him to demonstrate that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2023
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  10. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    You mean like leaving out "bioluminescence is the source of the light display?"

    OK, so be it.
     
  11. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    Here's the complete text from the original source:

    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/apr/01/farout

    I don't see tbe text-string "bioluminescence is the source of the light display" anywhere on that page. The author doesn't appear to have said it.

    (If he did, it would contradict some of the other things he says.)
     
  12. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    Sometimes, this thread reads like the Salem witch trials of 1692.

    I don’t get why some of you want MR to be banned.
     
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  13. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Strawman. Nobody wants MR to be banned. fer cryin' out loud.
     
  14. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Looks like Dave is lying now. OMG,.,what a terrible person he must be! lol
     
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  15. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    It’s an observation, not a straw man. Virtually any time you or others post inflammatory remarks about his character, he’s usually given a temp-ban.
     
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  16. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I did not claim the author said that.

    Note what you said:
    which tracks well.

    I'm not going to argue with you about honesty versus facetiousness Yazata. This is not the school playground. If this is the take away you want, then so be it.
     
  17. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    It is a textbook strawman.

    No one wants MR banned. That is a baseless and false claim you attribute to your opponent(s) - a strawman.

    On the playground at recess:
    MR: :tells all the boys Susie is giving out kisses behind the swing:
    The boys: "Teacher! MR is lying about Susie!"
    wegs: "Why does everyone want MR banned** from recess?"
    The boys: "What? We don't. What we want is for him to stop lying about Susie! (The question is: will MR change his ways, or will he get himself banned for his continued unacceptable behavior!)"

    ** This is a strawman.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2023
  18. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    5,902
    My role on this board seems to have evolved into defending heretics against the court of the inquisition. Which no doubt will get me condemned as a heretic as well.
     
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  19. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Bullshit analogy.

    Deliberate omission of critical information relevant to the attempted explanation of an event is directly counter-productive to the stated topic of this thread.

    If that's OK with then this may not be the board for you.
     
  20. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    That’s sooo not what’s happening. What? lol

    Every time MR has been banned, what has preceded it is this exact type of banter. Just because you disagree with MR’s stance on these UFO sightings, and his logic, doesn’t mean he’s lying.
     
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  21. Baldeee Valued Senior Member

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    From an external perspective, I'm not sure I would say someone deliberately seeks to mislead with what they quote when they also provide the link that they are quoting from.
    As such I see no "lie of omission" here.
    Had there been no such link provided, perhaps there would be more grounds to be concerned as to motive.
    But that's just my take.

    Please, let's put the handbags down, shall we?

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    Anyone have any idea as to what might cause the particular pattern in the water that Magical Realist brought to our attention?
    I'm sure most of us accept that the likeliest cause of the light is bioluminescence, right?
    If not, what other more plausible explanations would you suggest?
    And what is causing the particular spoked wheel pattern?
    Or is it a bona fide mystery at the moment?
     
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  22. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Here's some eyewitness reports of the phenomena. I will quote them at length to avert the risk of being accused by Dave of editing them for some sinister purpose:

    "My description to my family:

    Imagine standing on the bridge wing of a ship on a dark moonless overcast night. Looking down at the water from a height of about 50 feet. Just above the surface of the sea appears to be waves of white light (low intensity) pulsating out of nowhere with a synchronized rhythm. Outward expanding circles, inward imploding circles, waves, moving snakes and boomerangs! The waves of light appear to be traveling at or near the speed of sound and reach as far out on the horizon as the eye can see. With each pulse, the sea explodes with millions of tiny green lights that appear as emeralds on the surface of the water (bioluminescent). It was Incredible and almost unbelievable. It would be hard for me to believe if I had not seen it myself. The light show continued for about 40 minutes before we steamed out of the area and it faded in our wake.

    It is something I will remember the rest of my life!”
    - Commander Kendall Gennick, USS MIlius (DDG69)

    The Executive Officer of the USS Milius wrote the following description to his family:

    “Last night the ship passed through a bizarre natural phenomenon. Don’t know what it was and have never read about anything like it. There was energy hovering and spinning just above the water. It was pulsating. A little like glowing mist but it spun and moved faster than the waves and made circles and other patterns. It sped out as far as you could see and lasted over 20 minutes. Like the northern lights but on the surface of the water and not in the sky. There was also lightning in the air and tons of florescent plankton in the water and maybe that had something to do with it but not really sure. It was definitely something like St. Elmo’s Fire or Ball Lightning and I suspect I will never see it again.”

    And a detailed report from the Ship’s Navigator, who witnessed the entire event:

    “I assumed the watch as Officer of the Deck with all conditions normal. As the Ship’s Navigator, I had previously plotted a track that would take us from a day time operating area to our assigned night area. Tankers, Dhows, and other sea traffic made it apparent that we would have a much easier transit by altering course to the north, maintaining a comfortable distance from a previously discovered uncharted oil platform, and eventually maneuvering to the west to assume our new station. After a quick call to the Captain, our plans had been changed to do just that. At approximately 2030, just as I passing the closest point of approach with the oil platform, I glanced out to the starboard bridge wing and noticed what appeared to be strong waves hitting us directly on our beam. The ship had less than a single degree of list and virtually no roll so I went out on the bridge wing for a closer look.

    The first look at this light did not indicate that any swirls or circles were involved. Just long straight waves traveling from the horizon spanning out to the left and right as far as the eye could see. I was very impressed by the speed and consistency of the waves. The distance between the waves was about the same width as the waves themselves (on the order of ten to twenty feet) but, it was very difficult to measure the size or the speed. I pointed them out to the other bridge watch standers and we stood there in awe. Theories and possible explanations started immediately… could it be our radars?

    It became obvious that I would need to call the Captain, what was not obvious was exactly what to tell him. Obviously the USN does not have a standard report format for this situation. “Captain, this is the Officer of the Deck. We have a… strange light phenomenon occurring up here that I can’t really explain. It’s…” as I remember it. His response “I’ll be right up!”

    When the Captain arrived on the bridge the light patterns had begun to change. One of the most difficult things for me to determine was whether the pattern themselves were shifting or if we were simply driving into a different section of the phenomenon. As we progressed toward what I believe was near the center, I distinctly remember seeing central points that circles of light originated at and grew in 360 degrees. This reminded me of the impact of a drop of water hitting the surface of a calm body of water except that this wave traveled much faster.

    My scientific side kicked in. I did suspect that bioluminescence was at least partially responsible for the light show at hand. Generally this is caused when the ship’s wake disturbs species. It tends to glow in a bright green color, much like that of a phosphorescent light stick. It usually splits like a giant V from the ship’s hull as we pass through the water. If something biological was being disturbed then what was causing it? Looking at the speed and pattern… I assumed that it was sound. It was obviously slower than light but much quicker than anything that I had ever seen caused by wind or waves.

    That theory was quickly put to rest when the spirals began. It wasn’t as if something was producing the light at the center and it was following the spiral by growing. More like if you had a giant light that had a spiral cutout blocking part of it and then rotated it. Like something that belonged on a dance floor. The centers of these spirals passed directly down our ships beam. You could pinpoint the exact center. I couldn’t believe or begin to explain what I was seeing.

    The Captain had me call the Executive Officer and he soon after invited the crew to the bridge. His description to the crew was similar to the one I had previously given the Captain. About fifty of our crew members began filing into the pilot house. Their reaction and the environment it created reminded me of watching a fireworks display on the forth of July… for the first time. Very fun and exciting, certainly not what I had expected for my after dinner watch.

    As we transited at about 7 knots, the light began to fade. I thought that maybe it was over. The Captain had us turn to a reciprocal course and after a few minutes of back tracking the light was back. This was happening in an area that I believe was only a few miles in diameter.

    Having the deck, I didn’t have a chance to grab my own camera, and as far as I know, none of the pictures taken actually display what we were seeing. The Executive Officer thought that maybe it was St. Elmo’s fire. A quick internet search disproved that theory.

    It was two days later before someone discovered the link to www.Cropcircleanswers.com. The description of the Marine light wheels was spot on. The only difference that I might point out between the sketches and what I witnessed was that I didn’t see the patterns overlap at any point.

    I’m left with a mixed of feeling of being happy that I was lucky enough to see this and a real confusion about the ‘force’ that activates the light. The closest comparison that I can draw is to Magnetism. But even lines of flux do not take on such perfect symmetry. I truly hope but somehow doubt that I will witness this again.”

    -End of the Navigator’s report.

    CDR Gennick added the following further observations:

    “Other observations: The light waves were unaffected by wind. They traveled at the same speed upwind and downwind. The further the light wave got from the ship, they began to appear as just waves vice geometric designs. There was thunderstorm and lightning activity in the region that night.”

    -End of Milius’ crew reports. (Ref. 7)

    http://www.cropcircleanswers.com/marinelightwheels_arabiangulf.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2023
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  23. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    Hi Baldeee, thanks for injecting a little sanity.

    I don't. I can speculate, but they are just WAGs (wild-ass guesses).

    It's plausible, but unproven.

    I speculated earlier about light scattering from a beam of light underwater. But I don't find it really convincing and it raises more questions than it answers. Other than that, I got nothing.

    That's the real question. I can easily imagine potentially bioluminescent plankton more or less uniformly distributed in the waters. So what is stimulating them so that they emit light? Why does that stimulation take the geometrical forms that it does?

    I'm guessing that it's a combination of the light-emitting organisms and some physical process that stimulates them in that way, but I don't know what that process would be.

    Yeah, that it is.
     
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