Boarder Security

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by R1D2, Jan 30, 2013.

  1. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,690
    Next year it will be ten million. We couldn't deport them that fast without destroying our own economy. Remember: They have jobs, pay taxes, and spend money just like everybody else. Jobs, by the way, that our own lazy, entitled children won't do like plucking chickens and hanging drywall.

    That's only true in certain regions like Oklahoma, northwestern California and rural North Carolina, where local authorities are more tolerant because of its contribution to the regional economy. (And perhaps Hawaii, what happens in Hawaii seems to pretty much stay in Hawaii.

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    ) Marijuana is still by far the bread-and-butter of the drug cartels.

    It's poor journalism to combine Mexico with Central America. The Mexican economy is booming, but except for tourist mecca Costa Rica with its near-zero military budget, most of Central America is stuck in the bad old days.

    There are zillions of Salvadoreños here in the D.C. region, and every one I've gotten to know says that his family left to escape the violence, not the poverty. (For which, of course, our own government bears much of the blame--if you're old enough to remember those days.) Unfortunately MS-13 came right along with them, but at least our cops do a better job of keeping them down than they did at home.
     
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  3. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    How many undocumented "bad people" have entered the US?

    What crimes would they commit here?
     
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  5. milkweed Valued Senior Member

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    1,654
    Hmm... My neighbor kid spent two summers in N.Dakota roofing working for a company that had been working there for 5 years before he joined their crew. Why isnt he doing it now? Illegals. I know plenty of people who will work very hard for a fair wage. Illegals drive down the wage creating a downward spiral for everyone.


    Rand report on home grown weed vs mexican:
    http://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB9559.html

    Interesting how they point out the gov numbers are unconfirmed. But we know the gov lied about numbers for the drug war.

    Quote from article:
    RAND’s exploratory analysis on this point suggests that 15–26 percent is a more credible range.

    Thats why I put the link for the whole article. Here let me help you:

    According to a Pew Hispanic Center report, Mexicans make up 57 percent of immigrants present in the United States illegally. Another 24 percent are from other Latin American countries. Approximately 9 percent are from Asia, 6 percent from Europe and Canada, with the remaining 4 percent from the rest of the world...

    Another relevant piece regarding your "stuck in 1975" portion of the previous post:

    Net advances by illegal aliens into the USA have also soared from about 130,000 per year in the 1970s, to 300,000+ per year in the 1980s, to over 500,000 per year in the 1990s, to over 700,000 per year in the 2000s. Total entrance by illegal aliens into the USA may have been as high as 1,500,000 per year in 2006 - with a net of at least 700,000 more illegal aliens arriving each year to join the 12,000,000 to 20,000,000 that are already here in the USA.

    Its not me who is stuck in 1975...

    Zillions... *rolls eyes*

    Origin Number % % change 2000-09
    Mexico 6,650,000 62% +42%
    El Salvador 530,000 5% +25%
    Guatemala 480,000 4% +65%

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration_to_the_United_States
     
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  7. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    Some good info Milkweed
     
  8. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    17,881
    That downward spiral (or, to use economics terms, "pressures holding wages down") might be the one thing that saves a few American jobs from being outsourced. The reason we are losing jobs is that our labor costs too much; it's much cheaper to send the jobs to Mexico due to the very high wages that US workers demand. I'd much rather have those Mexican workers working here for the same money they'd get in Mexico - but paying taxes, raising their kids and buying homes here in the US.
     
  9. milkweed Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,654
    Ah yes... Labor costs too much.

    No. Safety standards, workers comp, liability insurance, enviromental laws, overtime, 40 hour workweeks, paid vacation, sick leave, health insurance cost too much.

    Costs more to have a higher standard of living.
    Except its a net loss for the people of the USA.
    http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/ftpdocs/87xx/doc8711/12-6-immigration.pdf

    I chose the above (to add to the others posted) because it is 15 years worth of pre-recession info.

    Now more currently:
    http://abcnews.go.com/Business/illegal-immigrants-cost-us-100-billion-year-group/story?id=10699317

    A typical advocate response (from above link):
    The above ignores the information which has already show a net loss for taxpayers (without amnesty). Amnesty will only make it worse as they WILL qualify for more tax-payer funded poverty shields. Courts will strike down any language which puts these immigrants under different standards than other immigrants.

    Plenty of illegals have signed up for the IRS tax number and do pay taxes. However, because they are in the poverty level already (and wont be lifted out of it with amnesty), they will be shifted from an illegal status net loss to a legal status net loss for taxpayers.
     
  10. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,881
    Agreed.

    Also true. Those things all drive up the cost of labor.

    How so? Those immigrants will need to buy stuff at Wal-Mart - so Americans will be employed to service them. They will pay taxes to support other Americans who want to send their kids to school, or launch a war in the Middle East. It's a win-win. (Well, except for the Middle East.)

    And will also "qualify" to pay more in taxes.
     
  11. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    If they are illegal and make it in for a number of years. I still worry about there past. If they go through hoops and get a green card and do military service for like 2 years. Or if they get a honorable discharge. I have no issue with them being granted citizenship.
     
  12. Cowboy My Aim Is True Valued Senior Member

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    3,707
    Because there are plenty of people in this world who we DON'T want as neighbors. Terrorists, pedophiles, people with contagious deadly diseases, etc.
     
  13. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

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    Woot Woot!!
    There sure are!!!
     
  14. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    17,881
    Agreed. However, there are more of them already here than there are in the people who are willing to make the move to the US.

    If avoiding pedophiles is your thing, replacing all US priests with immigrants would do wonders for the safety of our kids. If getting rid of terrorists is your goal, allowing immigrants to replace disgruntled veterans would be the way to go. Etc etc.
     
  15. arauca Banned Banned

    Messages:
    4,564
    God bells the immigrants we need them here, we need lower cost labor, when my brother come here he worked for 0.75 / hour when the minimum wage was $ 6.00 . I use them in construction or in yard work ,. Think about housing , This country have a surplus of housing , We need those Syrian and Iraqi to rent or to sell our inventory , so the high paid American can have high union wages and continue to drive inflation , and force the manufacturers out of the Asia .
     
  16. R1D2 many leagues under the sea. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,321
    Wait! Hold the flipping phone! WHAT Are You Thinking? WHY? Again, WHY? I don't get it... Explain yourself. And why would that be the way to go?
     
  17. Buddha12 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,862
    Yes the illegals do work...they work for less than the average American gets paid because they are here illegally, they take away jobs that Americans could be doing , they do not pay income taxes because many times employers will not pay them with a check with a social security number on it therefor not putting anything into the Federal governments taxes, they have fake ID cards which they use to take advantage of free hospital care and schools for their children. These are but a few examples of what some illegals do not all of them but many.
     
  18. vulcan947 Registered Member

    Messages:
    26
    it may or may not, but government has to be SEEN to be doing something,
    in england when a gun nut shot some children,the reaction was to ban some gunowners, the effect was not noticed
    in the crime figures, yet the public demand at least the image of real action,

    it's all smoke and mirrors !! with bells and whistles
     

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