Discussion in 'Alternative Theories' started by river, Sep 20, 2014.
First has anybody heard of him ?
Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.
Heres a video , just over two hours long
Before I would consider watching a 2 hour youtube video I would need a decent descriptoin of what the video was about.
here is the start
David Hudson: The Chemistry of M-state Elements
We took the material into chemistry and we dissolved it and got a
solution that would be blood red. Yet when we precipitated this material
out chemically by using a reductant of powdered zinc the material would
come out as a black precipitant just like it was supposed to be if it
was a noble element. A noble element if you chemically bring it out of
the acid it won't re-dissolve in the acid.
So we precipitated this material out of the black and we took the
material and dried it. In the drying process we took a large porcelain
funnel called a Butiner funnel about this big it had a filter paper on
it. This material was about a quarter of an inch thick on top of the
filter paper. At that time I didn't have a drying furnace or a drying
oven so I just set it out in the Arizona sunshine which was about 115
degrees at 5% humidity so it really dried fast.
What happened was that after the material dried it exploded. It exploded
like no explosion I had ever seen in my life and I've worked with a lot
of explosive materials. There was no explosion and there was no
implosion. It was as if somebody had detonated about fifty thousand
flash bulbs all at one time just poof. All the material was gone, the
filter paper was gone and the funnel was cracked.
So I took a brand new pencil that had never been sharpened and stood it
on end next to the funnel and started drying another sample. When the
material detonated it burned the pencil about 30% in two but did not
knock the pencil over and all the sample was gone. So this was not an
explosion and was not an implosion. It was like a tremendous release of
It was like you set that pencil beside a fire place and after about 20
minutes you saw it was smoking on one side and burning in two. That's
what the pencil looked like immediately after the flash. Now this just
had me baffled. What ever this stuff is it's wild. We found that if we
dried it out of the sunlight it didn't explode but if we dried it in the
sunlight it exploded.
So then we took some of the powder that was dried out of the sunlight
and we decided we were going to put it in what is called a crucible
reduction. A crucible reduction involves taking a crucible (which is
like a big drinking glass made out of porcelain) and you mix your powder
with lead and all this flux and all and you heat it till the lead melts.
What happens is the metals that are heavier than lead stay in the lead
and all of those that are lighter float out. This is the basic premise
of your fire assays which have been done for hundreds of years.
Now supposedly gold and silver will stay in the lead and all your other
non heavy elements will come out of the lead. This is the tried and true
way of doing metals analysis. Well this material settled to the bottom
of the lead just like it was gold and silver. This material seemed to be
denser than lead. When we poured off the slag it would take everything
but the noble elements, then we poured off the lead and this material
came off as a constituency at the bottom of the molten lead. It was
separated from it. Yet when you take this material and put it on a bone
ash cupel the lead soaks into the cupel and it leaves your bead of gold
and silver. Well we did this and we got a bead that should have been
gold and silver.
We took this bead for analysis to all the commercial laboratories and
they said Dave there is nothing but gold and silver there. Except I
could take that bead and set it on a table and hit it with a hammer and
it shattered like glass. Now there is no known alloy of gold and silver
that is not soft. Gold and silver dissolve in each other perfectly and
they form solid solutions and they are both very soft elements and so
any alloy of gold and silver if that's all that's there is going to be
soft and ductile. You can flatten it out and make a pancake out of it.
Yet this material shattered like glass. I said something's going on here
that we are not understanding. Something unusual is happening.
So what we did is we took these beads of gold and silver and separated
them chemically with the gold and silver out. What we had left is a
whole bunch of black stuff. When I took this black stuff to the
commercial laboratories they told me that it was iron, silica and
aluminum. I said this can't be iron, silica and aluminum. First of all
you can't dissolve it in any acids or any bases once it is totally dry.
It doesn't dissolve in fuming sulfuric acid, it doesn't dissolve in
sulfuric nitric acid, it doesn't dissolve in hydrochloric nitric acid.
Even this dissolves gold yet it won't dissolve this black stuff. I
thought this material is really strange. It just has to have an
explanation. No one could tell me what it was.
Basically I went to Cornell University. I said we are just going to have
to throw some money at this problem. So I went and hired a Ph.D. at
Cornell who considered himself an expert on precious elements. I
suspected we were dealing with precious elements. I said I want to know
what this is. I paid him to come out to Arizona. He looked at the
problem. He said "we have a machine back at Cornell that can analyze
down to parts per billion". He said "you let me take this material back
to Cornell and I'll tell you exactly what you have, exactly". Unless it
is chlorine, bromine or one of the lighter elements, then we can't
analyze it. But if it is anything above iron we will find it. When he
got back there he told me it was iron silica aluminum.
I said "look doctor do you have a chemistry laboratory around here we
could borrow?" He said "yes." I said "let's go to the chemistry
laboratory." We worked in the chemistry laboratory all the rest of that
day and we were able to remove all the silica, all the iron and all the
aluminum. We still had 98% of the sample and that was pure nothing. I
said "look I can hold this in my hand, I can weigh it, I can performs
chemistries with it". "I said that is something". "I know that is
something." "It is not nothing."
He said "the absorption or emissions spectrum does not agree with
anything we have programmed into our instrument." I said "well that is
something and I'm going to find out what." And he said "Mr. Hudson why
don't you give us a $35 0,000 dollar grant and we'll put graduate
students to looking into it." Well I had already paid this man about
$22,000 because he claimed he could analyze anything and he hadn't. He
didn't offer to pay any of my money back. I said "sir, I don't know what
you pay the people around here but we pay minimum wage on the farm where
I work and I can get a lot more out of $350,000 than you can." "So I'm
going to go back and do the work myself."
I came back to Phoenix totally disillusioned with academia. I was not
impressed with the Ph.D's. I was not impressed with the people I had
paid money to. I found out that it is just a big system where they
worked the graduate students to generate paper but they never say
anything but the government pays them for every paper they write so they
get their money based on the number of papers they turned out. They all
say the same thing they just re-word it and turn out another paper. It
really is disillusioning when you find out what academia is doing right
Fortunately I asked around the Phoenix area and I found out about a man
who was a spectroscopist. He had been trained in West Germany at the
institute for spectroscopy. He had been the senior technician for Lab
Test company in Los Angeles which builds spectroscopic equipment. He's
the man who blue printed them, designed them, constructed them then took
them to the field and then made them work. I said here's a good man.
This is not just a technician. Here is a man who knows how the machine
I went to him with a Soviet book that the fire assay man had given me.
It was called The Analytical Chemistry of the Platinum Group Elements by
Ginsberg. It was published by the Soviet Academy of Sciences. In this
book, according to the Soviets, you had to do a 300 second burn on these
elements to read them.
Now for those of you who have never done spectroscopy it involves taking
a carbon electrode that is cupped at the top. You put the powder on that
electrode and you bring the other electrode down above it and you strike
an arc. In about fifteen seconds the carbon at this high temperature
burns away and the electrode's gone and your sample's gone. So all the
laboratories in this country are doing fifteen second burns and giving
you the results. According to the Soviet Academy of Sciences the boiling
temperature of water is to the boiling temperature of iron just like the
boiling temperature of iron is to the boiling temperature of these
As you know from driving a car as long as there is water in the motor of
your car the temperature of that car engine will never hotter than the
boiling temperature of water until all the water is gone. If you just
heated the water on the stove in a pan you know that pan never gets
hotter than the boiling temperature of the water till all the water is
gone. Once all the water is gone the temperature skyrockets really fast.
As long as there is iron there the temperature of the sample can never
get hotter than the boiling temperature of the iron until all of the
iron is gone so you can then heat this stuff. Now this is hard to fathom
how something with as high a boiling temperature as iron could be just
like water to these elements but it is. So literally we had to design
and build an excitation chamber where argon gas could be put around this
electrode so than no oxygen or air could get in to the carbon electrode
and we could burn it not for fifteen seconds but for three hundred
seconds. According to the Soviet Academy of Sciences this is the length
of time we have to burn the sample.
We set up, we got the [PK blenders?], we got the standards, we modified
the machine, we did all the analysis for results, we did all the
spectral lines on this three and a half meter instrument. That's the
spec for how big the prism is which opens up the line spectrum. For
those of you who don't know, most universities have a one point five
meter instrument. This is a three and a half meter instrument. A huge
machine. It took up the whole garage area. It was about thirty feet long
and about eight or nine feet high.
Anyway when we ran this material during the first fifteen seconds we got
iron, silica, aluminum, little traces of calcium, sodium maybe a little
titanium now and then and then it goes quiet and nothing reads. So at
the end of fifteen seconds you are getting nothing. Twenty seconds,
twenty five seconds, thirty seconds, thirty five seconds, forty seconds
still got nothing. Forty five seconds, fifty seconds, fifty five
seconds, sixty seconds, sixty five seconds but if you look in through
the colored glass sitting there on the carbon electrode is this little
ball of white material. There's still something in there.
At seventy seconds, exactly when the Soviet Academy of Science said it
would read, palladium begins to read. And after the palladium platinum
begins to read. And after the platinum I think it was rhodium begins to
read. After rhodium ruthenium begins to read. After ruthenium then
iridium begins to read and after the iridium osmium begins to read.
Now if you're like me I didn't know what these elements were. I had
heard of platinum, platinum jewelry, but what are these other elements.
Well there are six platinum group elements in the periodic table not
just platinum. They didn't find out about them at the same time so they
have been added one at a time. They are all elements just like iron,
cobalt and nickel are three different elements ruthenium, rhodium and
palladium are light platinums and osmium, iridium and platinum are the
Well we came to find out that rhodium was selling for about three
thousand dollars per ounce. Gold sells for about four hundred dollars an
ounce. Iridium sells for about eight hundred dollars an ounce and
ruthenium sells for one hundred and fifty dollars an ounce.
Then you say gee these are important materials aren't they. They are
important materials because in the world the best known deposit is now
being mined in South Africa. In this deposit you have to go a half mile
into the ground and mine an 18 inch seam of this stuff. When you bring
it out it contains one third of one ounce per ton of all the precious
Our analysis, which we ran for two and a half years and we checked over
and over; we checked every spectral line, we checked every potential on
interference, we checked every aspect of this. We created apples and
apples, oranges and oranges, bananas and bananas. We wanted exact
When we were finished the man was able to do quantitative analysis and
he said "Dave, you have six to eight ounces per ton of palladium, twelve
to thirteen ounces per ton of platinum, one hundred fifty ounces per ton
of osmium, two hundred fifty ounces per ton of ruthenium, six hundred
ounces per ton of iridium, and eight hundred ounces per ton of rhodium.
Or a total of about 2400 ounces per ton when the best known deposit in
the world is one third of one ounce per ton.
As you can see this work wasn't an indicator that these elements were
there; these elements were there and they were there in boucoups
amounts. They were saying hey stupid man pay attention we are trying to
show you something.
If they had been there in little amounts I probably would have contended
with this. But they were there in such huge amounts I said golly, how
can they be there in these quantities and no one knew it. Now you keep
in mind, it wasn't one spectral analysis it was two and a half years of
spectral analysis running this material every day. And the man actually
sent me away when they read because he couldn't believe it either. And
he worked on it another two months before he called me up and apologized
to me and he said "Dave you are right." That is how skeptical he was
about it. He couldn't apologize to me. He is a German researcher with
German pride so he had his wife call and apologize to me.
He was so impressed that he went back to Germany to the Institute of
Spectroscopy. He was actually written up in the spectroscopic journals
as having proven the existence of these elements in the Southwestern
United States in natural materials. It's not journals that you would
ever read but I actually saw the journals, he was written up.
They had no idea where this stuff was coming from, how we were producing
it, what concentrations we had gone through or anything, they just had
analyzed this small amount of powder. The crazy thing about it is, all
we had done is remove the silica and sent the other stuff in. It was
pretty unbelievable numbers. After we had come at this in every way we
know how, to disprove it, I decided all we have to do is throw money at
this problem because money solves everything, right?
So at 69 seconds I stopped the burn. I let the machine cool down and I
took a pocket knife and dug that little bead out of the top of the
electrode. When you shut off the arc it sort of absorbs down into the
carbon and you have to dig down into the carbon to get it out; this
little bead of metal.
So I sent this little bead of metal over to Harlow Laboratories in
London. They made a precious metals analysis on this bead. I get the
report back "no precious element detected". Now this was one second
before the palladium was supposed to start leaving. Yet according to
neutron activation, which analyzes the nucleus itself, there were no
precious elements detected.
This made absolutely no sense at all. There had to be an explanation
here. Either this material was converted to another element or it's in a
form that we don't understand yet. So I decided that I just had to get
more information on it. I went to a Ph.D. analytical chemist, a man who
was trained at separating and purifying individual elements out of
unknown material. He was trained at Iowa State University and he had a
Ph.D. in metal separation systems. He's the man that Motorola and Sperry
used in the state of Arizona to handle their waste water problems.
He has worked with every element on the periodic table with the
exception of four. He has worked with all the rare earths, he has worked
with all the man made elements. He has physically separated everything
on the periodic table with the exception of four elements.
Coincidentally I came to him to have him separate six elements. Four of
those were the elements he had never worked on. He said "you know David
Hudson, I have heard this story before. All my life, and I'm a native
Arizonan too, I have heard this story about these precious elements. I
am very impressed with the way you have gone about this: with the
systematic way you have approached it. I cannot accept any money because
if I accept money from you I have to write you a written report.
All I have to sell is my reputation. All I have to sell is my
credibility. I'm a certified expert witness in the state of Arizona in
metallurgical separation systems. He said "David I will work for you at
no charge until I can show you where you are wrong." "When I can tell
you where you are wrong I'll give you a written report." "Then you will
pay me sixty dollars an hour for the time I spent." This would have come
to about twelve to fifteen thousand dollars. If this gets rid of the
curse; if this just gets the thing answered once and for all it's worth
it. It was for me at the time. Do it, get on with it.
Well, three years later he said "I can tell you it is not any of the
other elements on the periodic table. We are educated; we are taught to
do the chemical separation of the material and then send it for
The example I use is rhodium because it has a very unique color to the
chloride solution. It is a cranberry color almost like the color of
grape juice. There is no other element that produces the same color in
chloride solution. When my rhodium was separated from all the other
elements it produced that color of chloride. The last procedure you do
to separate the material out is to neutralize the acid solution and it
precipitates out of solution as a red brown dioxide. That is heated
under a controlled atmosphere to 800 degrees for an hour and that
creates the anhydrous dioxide. Then you hydro reduce that under a
controlled atmosphere to get the element and then you anneal away the
So when we did that, we neutralized the acid solution and precipitated
it out as a red-brown dioxide. Which is the color it is supposed to
precipitate. Then we filtered that out. We heated it under oxygen for an
hour in a tube furnace then we hydro-reduced it to this gray-white
powder: exactly the color rhodium should be as an element. Then we
heated it up to 1400 degrees under argon to anneal away the material and
it turned snow white.
Now this wasn't expected. This just isn't what is supposed to happen. So
what John did was he said "Dave, I'm going to heat it to the anhydrous
dioxide, I'm going to cool it down. I'm going to take one third of the
sample and put it in a sealed vial. I'm going to put the rest of the
sample back in the tube furnace and heat it up under oxygen, cool it
back down, purge it with inert gas, heat it back up under hydrogen to
reduce away the oxides and the hydrogen reacts with oxygen forming water
and cleans the metal. I'll cool that down to the gray-white powder. I'll
take half of that and put it in another sealed vial. I'll take the rest
of the powder and put it back in the furnace. I'm going to oxidize it,
and hydro-reduce it and anneal it to the white powder. Then I will put
it into a vial and send all three vials to Pacific Spectrochem over in
Los Angeles, one of the best spectroscopic firms in the U.S.
The first analysis comes back. The red-brown dioxide is iron oxide. The
next material comes back; silica and aluminum. No iron present. Now just
putting hydrogen on the iron oxide has made the iron quit being iron and
now it has become silica and aluminum. Now this was a big sample. We
just made the iron turn into silica and aluminum. The snow white
annealed sample was analyzed as calcium and silica. Where did the
aluminum go? John said "Dave my life was so simple before I met you." He
said "this makes absolutely no sense at all." He said "what what you are
working with is going to cause them to re-write physics books to
re-write chemistry books and come to a complete new understanding.
John gave me his bill, it was a hundred and thirty thousand dollars
which I paid. But he said "Dave, I have separated physically and I have
checked it chemically fifty different ways and you have four to six
ounces per ton of palladium, twelve to fourteen ounces per ton of
platinum, a hundred fifty ounces per ton of osmium, two hundred fifty
ounces per ton of ruthenium, six hundred ounces per ton of iridium, and
eight hundred ounces per ton of osmium. The exact same numbers that the
spectroscopist had told me were there. It was such an incredible number
that John said "Dave, I've got to go to the natural place where this
stuff comes from and I've got to take my own samples. So he went up and
actually walked the property and took his own samples, put it in a bag,
brought them back to the laboratory, pulverized the entire sample and
then started doing the analysis on what is called the master blend
sample which represented the whole geology and he got the same numbers.
Hudson is a scientifically illiterate nutcase and his claims are nonsense.
He and his claims have come up before:
Thanks river. I only had to read the first 4 paragraphs of what you wrote to see that I won't be wasting my time on that particular video.
Regardless of subject, it's a fair bet that if River subscribes to it then it'll be unscientific b*llocks.
That does indeed seem to be the pattern.
Well both of you , orig And dyw
Are not known for expanding ones understanding of things beyond your imagination
And really why bother to respond to my posts if you think so highly of me ?
Well both of you , orig And dyw
Are not known for expanding ones understanding of things beyond your imagination
And really why bother to respond to my posts if you think so highly of me ?
Please don't assume things you don't know anything about.
Because not every one reading your posts will recognise them for the utter crap that they are.
Interesting because really , your the pinnacle of utter crap
The interesting pattern too , is constant putting any thinking outside the box , down
Never saying " thats interesting "
It's not "outside the box thinking" that I put down, it's unscientific crap.
If you posted something that was interesting - as opposed to old unmitigated crap - then I might say "That's interesting".
But all you ever come up with is sh*t that I came across years ago.
Isn't it though?
All the stuff YOU think is "new and exciting" and "outside the box" turns out to be tired old crap that was debunked ages back: but you haven't bothered to read up on it.
The constricted still have comments
And worse they rely on others to form their " thinking "
Separate names with a comma.