Extincting mosquitoes and other blood-sucking, disease-spreading parasites

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by Peter Dow, Dec 21, 2018.

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Should we extinct malaria-spreading mosquitoes and other blood-sucking, disease-spreading parasites?

  1. Yes.

    40.0%
  2. No.

    40.0%
  3. I'm not sure.

    20.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

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    And as I already admitted -
     
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  3. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    It is a recent invention, an awkward and unrecognized one, and an unnecessary one - the adjective "extinct" derives from the past participle of the root of "extinguish", which is the verb you seek.

    That kind of carelessness should not be allowed to do anything, much less run a genetic manipulation outside a lab.
     
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  5. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

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    As any fire fighter can confirm, a fire which has been extinguished can sometimes reignite. So one might assume that something else which has been extinguished also may not stay extinguished.

    However, a species which has gone extinct stays extinct.

    So if we want to use a short-form for "to render extinct" / "to make extinct" / "to cause to go extinct" etc. then "to extinct" implies extinction more accurately than "to extinguish".


    That kind of high-handedness shouldn't be heeded by anyone, much less by a scientist.

    I'm not "careless" about the ecosystem but I don't care about mosquitoes which the ecosystem can do without and I do care about the health of those who are now at risk of catching, or who would in future suffer from, mosquito-borne diseases if we don't extinct the pest species.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
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  7. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    You can misuse the word "extinguish" - that does not make "extinct" a verb.
    You are not careless about the ecosystem, but you are willing to make dramatic and uncontrollable and cascading alterations in its genetic pool from a position of complete ignorance. Got it.

    Before you do this, check out the early days of global DDT broadcast. See if the arguments used sound familiar.
    You mean this bizarre threat - "Species go extinct all the time and the ecosystem is just fine." ?
    Nobody who talks like that should be allowed to handle edge tools in a natural environment.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  8. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    215
    Well "to google" didn't used to be a verb either so don't be too proud of this linguistic pedantry you have constructed. The ability to cite from a dictionary is insignificant next to the power of people to use words as they see fit.

    Well that's what nature does all the time when species go extinct.

    I can't imagine that anyone claimed that DDT was a species-specific pesticide but if you can find such a quote, I will read it.

    Nature doesn't make "bizarre threats" when she drives species to extinction.

    Up until now, my excuse for not doing any gardening - "my pollen allergy" - has served me well.
    I do not think that your suggestion that talking like a scientist about species extinction would serve as well.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2018
  9. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Humpty Dumpty would be proud

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  10. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    20,365
    Well, if you call mass extinctions or disease 'fine' then that's true. There are plenty of examples of one species going extinct causing the extinction of several others, as their food source goes away - or of increases in disease and mortality as a result of an upset in a food chain.

    Examples -

    Due to overmining in the US, an entire species of river snail went extinct. Who cares right? Well, the harelip sucker fish did. It went extinct when its food source disappeared.

    In Africa, lion and leopards are endangered, and their numbers are dwindling. As a result baboon populations have exploded, resulting in more contact with humans - and explosions in human parasites from the exposure.

    So what if mosquitoes went extinct? Well, bass, birds, bats, frogs and turtles all eat mosquitoes. What if they went extinct? Bass are one of the fish that keeps freshwater ecologies in balance. Lose those and you could lose drinking water. Bats pollinate a lot of flowering plants, so you might lose whole species of plants. And lots of other people (including humans) eat plants. How about frogs? Who cares about frogs, right? Birds, fish, herons, otters and minks do, because they make up a big part of their diet.

    This human conceit that 'well, we will only change this one thing and it will be fine' is why:

    - we have Australia overrrun with rabbits. They were imported as food animals. After all, what can a few furry critters do? Today they devastate forests and do millions of dollars of crop damage a year.

    -we have cane toads. Farmers imported them to wipe out insects in their crops. They are now the #1 invasive species in the world, and kill untold farm animals and dogs a year. (They are poisonous.)

    -we have European starlings in the US, where they cause millions in damage to crops every year. They were imported so that English people living in the US could have all the birds Shakespeare wrote about near them.

    Fortunately, we have now learned our lessons, and are quite careful before importing (or wiping out) any species.
     
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  11. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I don't know how billvon's post, above, isn't the last word on the subject.
     
  12. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    any casual readers who do not follow naturalist topics, there are entire species of birds and fish which rely on eating mosquitoes as a survival food gap between food sources.

    imagine starving out hundreds of species of fish over 2 years and millions of birds...
    imagine the massive increase in algae that those decomposing animals will cause and the ridiculous increase in carbon emissions from them rotting and the algae blooms caused by them and the methane created from decomposing bird carcasses and the predators like foxes and Eagles and Falcons Snakes...
    (what do snakes keep in check ? mice & rats, what do eagles keep in check ? rats and mice...)
    which live off those birds as a food source.
    what eats ticks & plague and disease causing insects off cattle and wild animals ? birds.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
  13. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    215
    They also eat moths, beetles, other flies etc. They'll be fine.

    They won't.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
  14. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

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    215
    Too many red herrings.
     
  15. Peter Dow Registered Senior Member

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    215
    You forgot to mention that the sky would fall down.
     
  16. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    Fantasy abstract dog whistle politics to use bully tactics to undermine factual value.
    how dull and ordinary of you.

    you claim to be a scientist
    prove some scientific method by dividing the facts and commenting on them.
    list some links etc.
    show this supposed mind of mathematics that you claim.
    being able to paint between the lines to get a certificate is a long way short of being an anti establishment anti-royalist.

    are you intentionally trying to play both sides of the conspiracy fence ?

    you protest about authority models yet seek the heirs they bestow to anoint yourself as a scientist.
    you cant simply divide up the entire country and throw away the parts that don't suit you.
    that makes you a tyrannical dictator.
    associating your cause as being socialist to position yourself into a uniform as an anti establishment activist is more like Hitler youth type of programming.

    don't think i haven't noticed your over tones of misogyny around your assertion to have the right to send valentines cards with anything you like written in them.
    your predatory expectation to assert what you feel as a right to jam your foot in the door to force personal engagement is an act of abusive intent to assert your will over the rights of another.
    regardless of how conservative you paint your moral values as a form of defense.
    http://peter-dow.blogspot.com/
    oh ... didn't you already say the sky was falling down by having a monarchy ?
    and the institutions who you appeal to change that do not accept your personal opinion ?

    is it not you who is claiming the sky has already fallen ?

    ...
    but by all means
    start with the science discussion as soon as your ready.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
  17. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Just as Chicken Little predicted

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  18. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    if you want to talk science, talk science. if you wish to mock others for being scientific...
    well, good luck with that.
    your personality disorder is not other peoples ego.
    you should try and remember that.
    but it would require you to do some scientific reading on psychology.

    if you separate the 2, you may be able to go on and do some science.
    it would be a sad to have your talent lost amongst stodgy childhood behavior crutches & nonsense conspiracy thinking.
     
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  19. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    16,195
    OK, so this thread is merely an argument, not a discussion of the science of bio-ecology. Noted.

    In that case, you have an opinion. The general opinion of biologists runs counter to yours. We have no obligation to disabuse you of your opinion.

    [ EDIT ]
    Oh, I just realized this is not new:
    http://www.sciforums.com/threads/pe...itish-science-festival-aberdeen.117021/page-4
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
  20. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    What are this week's winning lottery numbers?
     
  21. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    Ignorance at that bottom level of basic understanding should not be allowed to make significant genetic manipulations outside of laboratories and other adult supervised settings. They are too dangerous.

    In fact, without very reliable assurance that these gene drive extinctions of pest species are under the complete control of people who know better than that, they should be forbidden altogether.
     
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  22. RainbowSingularity Valued Senior Member

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    https://animals.mom.me/mosquitoes-valuable-ecosystem-8494.html
     
  23. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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