Don't get it twisted, I do believe that there is an alien species that has discovered our little planet and they have been taking us out of our beds and examining us for God knows exactly what purpose, but if these millions of people are getting abducted like Dr. Mack would seem to think, then why has this never been caught on film. We have plenty of videos of UFO's flying around in the sky, but none where they are just hovering over somebody's house and floating them through their stucco wall and up into the mothership. Now, I know what your going to say. The reason we don't have any abductions on film, is because the ET's can make their ships dissapear and we don't see the ship, or the light beam, or the human floating out of the house. If that is the case, then why don't they make their ships invisible all the time, and then we wouldn't have any videos of their ships flying around. You would also think that if somebody was going to try to prove the existence of ET's they would find someone who is being abducted with a very high frequency and put them under 24 hour surveilence. You could put this person in a special house, with 24 hour cameras, in every room, as well as some on the roof and the exterior of the house, as well as radar equipment and magnetic field equipment. Obviously if you are watching this person sleeping in a controlled environment, and then all of a sudden they dissapear, that would be pretty compeling proof to me! Of course, because the ET's are telepathic, they would realize before hand that we were trying to catch them in the act, and they would simply avoid abducting this person that they used to abduct on a regular basis. This may sound stupid, but I actually want some serious answers if possible.
Professor David Jacob's book "The Threat" had some references along the lines of "videocamera detection equipment" (pgs. 24, 113-114, 253, & 262n). This direct quote from "The Threat" is from the note on page 262, which pretty much answers your question: "Training a video camera and recorder on an abductee every night has produced limited results. Some abductees report a dramatic decrease in abductions. Most report that the frequency of abductions tends to decrease only a bit. So far, no abductions have been videotaped. Rather, tapes reveal people getting up and inexplicably turning off the VCR, or unusual power outages during which the camera turns off, or the camera simply goes off mysteriously." This note also lists the pages from his earlier book "Secret Life" (pgs 258-260) in reference to the same topic.
Also you consider that you may be talking of something subjacent to our reality and it may well fit its will some UFO sightings and far fewer phantasm photos. I mean, will and mind are implied in the UFO phenomenon, and it seem (and many say) in reality itself (hindi, for example). Also think that the "enacted dramas" are also even by testimony played at a mind level, and being recorded in the mind in the same manner that "objective" facts, they could be subjective. What bring us to the cavern mythos, and the critical thinking about the ability to know, which is the most proper consideration for all reality, science, and UFOs. [This message has been edited by ishvaaag (edited March 04, 2000).]
Ishvaaag- could you please speak english. I read your post and have absolutely no idea what the heck you were talking about. I mean, come on, lets get serious. If we really want the so called "Smoking Gun" evidence, then why don't we go about it logically. Yeah, Dr. Jacobs talks about the mysterious power outages and people getting up and turning of the camera, and stuff like that, but if you really want to get serious about it, you research people that are abducted on a regular basis, like say once a week. You get one of these people to agree to sleep every night for like six months or less in a special house that is under 24 hour surveilance. You would actually have a team of researchers that would be in the garage of the house next door, with all kinds of sensing equipment. They would have radar devices for planes and things going over the house (and hopefully at some point a UFO), and they would have magnetic field sensing devices to see if the magnetic field in the area has flucuated. They would also have the house wired for sound and picture in every room and outside the home in all logical places. Then, if the power goes out mysteriously, there would actually be a team of people there to document it as fact. The person who is sleeping, would not be able to get up and shut anything off, because all the cameras and microphones, would be wired into the house and be controlled from the house next door's garage. If all of a sudden at 3:00 A.M. they get a blip on their radar equipment, and their magnetic field sensing equipment starts acting strangely, and all of a sudden their video and sound goes out, then the team would rush out of the garage with hand held camcorders and would aim at the sky and run into the persons house and check on them. Now, of course this would cost money, but basically you would do it in an area with alot of UFO buffs that would be willing to donate some of their free time to rotate in shifts to watch this person while they are sleeping. All you would have to do is rent the cameras and microphones and radar equipment and magnetic field sensing equipment, and the man hours would all be donated by UFO buffs. Sure it would cost some money, but I would think that the chance to prove this thing once and for all, would be worth it.
That's actually similar to something I'd once thought of awhile back. For a civilian agency/group to try and get "conclusive" proof of the abduction phenomenon, it would require a lot of money. The Gov. and the military have the money and manpower to get to the bottom of the whole UFO phenomenon, but don't do it because it either doesn't exist at all(which is pretty hard to believe)or they have already gotten to the bottom of it and aren't releasing any relevant information on it(which sounds like the typical workings of Gov.)The idea that I had awhile back was a lot more "underhanded" than yours I guess. I'd once thought of how "easily" it would be to get "conclusive" proof by doing what the former KGB did to obtain it via hidden cameras and mikes. Forget the hurdles of the legal system, forget as to whether or not you have the willing consent of the people involved, just wire the place full of bugs and see what turns up.
Actually Peter, in a way, that could be very effective, in terms of not having the abductee aware that they are being recorded. It would make sense that the ET's would have a mental link with the abductee, so them not knowing, might not allow the ET's to know that they are being watched and potentially recorded. As for it costing alot of money, I disagree. The little tiny cameras that people have on their computers, could be bought for as little as $39 dollars nowadays. We wouldn't necessarily need state of the art equipment, just a video picture and sound.
I can just imagine the ramifications if one were to be caught installing such cameras or if one had the "smoking gun" proof, but now had to answer to charges of illegal/unlawful entry, unauthorized search, invasion of privacy, etc., etc.,. Even if the ends did justify the means, one would probably find themselves in some nice cell somewheres.
Guys, I applaud your ideas, and fully endorse them. I've been calling for much the same thing for a long time now. And there is no liability or transgression of law, if the subject of these experiments signs off on all the consent forms. ------------------ I am; therefore I think.
A big duh here, cause they're episodes of demonic oppression that do not "physically" occur in the sense that many assume they do. They are spiritual experiences that involve the soul and the mind, but only effect the body in a "psycho-somatic" type of way. Duh. ------------------ You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.
Lori- Obviously, know one (other than some sect inside our secret Government) really knows what is truly going on, so to speak like it is common knowledge that these are demons or spirits or whatever, is of course your choice, but I think that you should simply state that that is what you choose to believe although it may indeed not be fact.
No, honey, it's a fact. I wouldn't come out here saying this if I wasn't 100% sure. I have been best buddies with an abductee for some time now. And Jesus and I are pretty tight. He's told me this message, and this is what He wants me to tell you. There is OVERWHELMING evidence, you just have to know where to look. It's obvious. I don't mean to sound like some know-it-all, don't get me wrong, I'm sure I don't have all the details straight, but THIS I KNOW.....THEY ARE SPIRITS, THEY ARE DEMONS, AND THEY ARE HERE TO COVER UP THE END TIME TRIBULATION SPOKEN OF IN THE BIBLE. Nothing else makes sense. That's why it just kills me that after all of this time, you guys are STILL out here asking the same, rather dumb (sorry) questions. If you don't believe me, then check out the Bible for yourself. Get to know Jesus, and ask Him yourself. You'll see. ------------------ You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.
Lori, Are we to understand that your claim is: it's all in the mind? People floating out windows, perceiving things through all kinds of modalities, etc, etc.? (Incidentally, I tend to believe the same thing...) But that is only a hypothesis that needs testing. But then the kind of research program we've been discussing would do exactly just that -- test a hypothesis. What's wrong with that? Duh? ------------------ I am; therefore I think.
Lori- What are you going to do, when aliens land and the reality of aliens is a real as the reality that a small percentage of the population is born gay? What will happen, when what you supposedly know to be true is proven false? I do believe in the Lord, but what is happening on our planet and what is spoken in the bible is not related IMHO. The Bible has been wrong many times before, so to simply believe everything in it to be true would be quite ludicrous. Does the name Copernicus ring a bell. The Copernican system which has of course since been proven correct, was considered heretical and expounding it cost at least one man his life. Giordano Bruno was burned at the stake for refusing to denounce Copernican theory. Don't fight the future!
Commander X, IF, not when. "What are you going to do, if aliens land and the reality of aliens is a real as the reality that a small percentage of the population is born gay." The jury is still out. -242
Boris, You are soooooooo close, but no cigar. It occurs in the soul, not the mind. I don't have a grasp on the relationship of the soul to the mind, I'm sure that the state of your sould affects your mind and shapes it, but it is more than that. In other words, it is not "imaginery" like you are suggesting, and it is not conjered by some arbitrary chemical imbalance or emotional state or mental suggestion. It is real, it really happens, it's just a metaphysical experience (which I know, I know, you don't believe in). Like astral projection is this type of experience, when your soul leaves your body. Not to say that a spirit can not simply "plant" an image or false memorie in your mind, they can and do, that is where screen memories come from. But I don't think that describes the entire abduction experience. ------------------ You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.
Commander, I'm going to fight the doctrine of the Antichrist that they spew with the Word of God and all that is within me. BUT, I honestly don't think that will happen til after I'm gone. I think that is when the mass landing or whatever will happen, in response to the rapture. That's what they are "waiting" for. And if you have a relationship with Jesus, there is NO WAY you could possibly think like you do. How much praying do you actually do for guidance from the Holy Spirit? How much LISTENING do you do to Him? I KNOW that He is NOT the one telling you to discard the teachings in the Bible, and if you are thinking that the Word of God does not totally refute the false doctrine that you are inclined to believe, then you are not familiar with a large part of said doctrine. This information is not hidden, it is obvious. You are looking for a sugar pill sir. ------------------ You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.
Lori, Soul, mind, whatever... The argument is basically about whether it actually physically happens in this the material world outside your skull, or not. Which can be ascertained to a high degree of certainty with intensive monitoring programs like the ones suggested previously in this thread. You simply assume the answer; but that assumption may or may not be correct at this point. To be sure, we need to conduct structured and comprehensive investigations. With that out of the way, let us brush up on the relationship between mind and soul. These 'abductees' certainly retain memories of their experiences, since they can verbally describe what happened. Such memories are clearly stored in the brain, biochemically. I could go into a really tedious neurophysiological explanation of all the theory and evidence for that, but I hope you can just trust me on this. Given that memory formation implies impact upon the material brain, such impact can indeed be measured experimentally even as it happens. Corresponding brain activity will then give a hint as to the true nature of the 'abduction' experiences -- which I suspect are merely a form of sleep disorder. But in either case, by constantly monitoring subjects, we would certainly be able to determine if they ever physically interact with anything (whether they move or are being moved, etc...) ------------------ I am; therefore I think.
Ok guys there is a case in NY in early 90's of a woman who was abducted from her apt in a high-rise complex at 3 am she was witnessed floating out her window in a nightgown with 2 entities. This was witnessed by a man on the Brooklyn Bridge as well as 2 other people one who was a prominent UN politician. Read the archives you will find it.As far as why people arent witnessed missing i do believe this is a mental abduction more then a physical one, also consider that they can switch off witnesses as well and they are excellent electricians when it comes to switching off cameras. As Far as your idea for surveillance i love it and would be willing to assist as far as man-power,military pay wont allow me to help financially lol. The Edge Co. has excellent surveillance gear and there is a site that tells how to build the magnetic disturbance detectors i'll have to find that site again. Take care all and have a great day. Love and Light ------------------ Eric Cooper
