Modern belief in nonsense?

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Dinosaur, Oct 5, 2016.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    Just as I have told you...the application of logic and common sense, is the ground work of science. And certainly part and parcel of the scientific method

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    To deny such, is to deny science.
     
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    That's not the OP at all. It was why there is such widespread belief in modern times in New Age practices like palmistry and channeling and mediumship. It has nothing to do with what "science" says.
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    http://www-history.mcs.st-and.ac.uk/Biographies/Eratosthenes.html
    extract:
    Several of the papers referenced, for example [Ptolemy tells us that Eratosthenes measured the tilt of the Earth's axis with great accuracy obtaining the value of 11/83 of 180°, namely 23° 51' 15".

    The value 11/83 has fascinated historians of mathematics, for example the papers [Ptolemy and not to Eratosthenes.Heath [Ptolemy. Taisbak [Ptolemy although he believes that Eratosthenes used the value 2/15 of 180°. However Rawlins [15] believes that a continued fraction method was used to calculate the value 11/83 while Fowler [9] proposes that the anthyphairesis (orEuclidean algorithm) method was used (see also [3]).

    Eratosthenes made many other major contributions to the progress of science. He worked out a calendar that included leap years, and he laid the foundations of a systematic chronography of the world when he tried to give the dates of literary and political events from the time of the siege of Troy. He is also said to have compiled a star catalogue containing 675 stars
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    Logic and common sense exist outside of and prior to science. It's not the same thing as theorizing and experimenting.
     
  8. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    Of course it has! Science has shown why such beliefs along with other mythical nonsense are baseless.
     
  9. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    Rubbish! How do you believe that science can operate without logic and common sense?
    As I have said, early man operated under that auspices [the scientific method] without actually knowing it.
     
  10. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    That doesn't explain why New Age concepts are so popular nowadays. In fact if science has shown these things to be nonsense, then they shouldn't be popular at all. And yet they are.
     
  11. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,622
    No it wasn't.

    He had a hypothesis - he could use distant angle measurements to determine the size of the Earth. He then ran the experiemnt and reviewed the results.

    If the results showed the Earth was flat, his experiment would have failed, and his hypothesis disproven. Measurement would not have been sufficient in that case.
    If the results showed the Earth was three miles across, his experiment would have failed, and his hypothesis disproven. Measurement would not have been sufficient in that case.

    But since it showed him a size that was reasonable, and fit into other scientific data (the mapped size of the Earth so far) it was proven, at least in a preliminary sense. Later measurements proved it further.

    That is how science works, even if you don't understand it.
     
  12. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    Doesn't mean logic and common sense are science. Science just uses it to achieve it's own ends. Like historians do, and engineers, and philosophers, and businessmen, and SOME politicians.
     
  13. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    He knows: As usual, he is in denial.
     
  14. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    That's how taking measurements works and inferring what the measurements mean. It doesn't make it the scientific method, which wasn't invented until the 12th century. Look it up. It's a historical fact.
     
  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    From the OP:
    "It amazes me that there seems to be significant numbers of people who believe in astrology, fortune tellers, seances, channeling, & other supernatural nonsense. Practitioners of such nonsense make a living off of the gullible. "

    People may still not yet be fully informed, but I do not believe they are as popular as you suggest.
    I know people who read their star charts, but just for laughs!

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    I had my fortune told when I was a teen, just to impress a young lady, and we both had a great laugh over it.
    People have a great laugh over many things, including the paranormal and supernatural nonsense they are sometimes confronted with.
     
  16. billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    12,622
    You posted a chart of the scientific method. Eratosthenes used the method you posted to measure the size of the Earth. Now you claim that that is not the scientific method.

    No wonder you believe in UFO's. And thank God you're not a scientist or engineer.
     
    paddoboy likes this.
  17. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    That's what the OP claimed. Are you disputing it now?
     
  18. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    Tell me, how did he achieve his results of the tilt of the Earth's axis?
    His measurements on land and other aspects, lead him to correctly deduce such tilt. that's science, that's the scientific method, not withstanding your own expected unsupported denial of such.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

     
  19. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    Then Eratosthenes invented a time machine too and copied the scientific method from the 12th century. lol! Taking measurements and drawing conclusions from it is not the scientific method. It's closer to engineering and construction. It's how they built the pyramids. It's how a chef cooks a meal. It's how a tailor makes a suit. It's how you put oil in your car. It's not science.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  20. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225
    Look up what Historical fact?

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    What are you on about?
    The OP was simply a statement as to why people still believe in some of the nonsense that they do.
    Science hasn't cured all our ills as yet, and some will steadfastly refuse to be swayed from beliefs that they have had for years.
    Religion is one aspect...paranormal and other supernatural beliefs are another.
    In time, as science leads the way, by trial and error, by the scientific method, by logic and common sense, it will also answer more questions.
    eg: When I went to school [Catholic] there were 6 masses on every Sunday morning: Now there is one and the attendances are still way below par.
    People may call themselves Christian, people may say they are religious, but its more convention now than anything else.
    In time, that convention will be further eroded. We can thank science for answering the big questions as I have mentioned previously for its gradual demise.
     
  21. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,528
    I'm gonna let ya'll turn this thread back into the Superscience infomerical you wanted it to be before I get infracted again just for thinking differently. Have fun!
     
  22. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,225

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    And that is science and the scientific method, despite your denial!
     
  23. iceaura Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,689
    Generating hypotheses from observations and testing them against experiment is not how one puts oil in a car.

    "The" scientific method, being essentially careful investigation evaluated with sound logic, was in use long before it was described and named.

    The nonsense that has survived into modern times has been altered and winnowed through evolutionary processes. It's the toughest nonsense, the stuff best able to take advantage of human culture and mental structuring.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016

Share This Page