More probability questions

Discussion in 'Physics & Math' started by kingwinner, Apr 29, 2006.

  1. kingwinner Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    796
    12) There are 3 white balls, 4 green balls, 5 red balls, and 6 blue balls in a bag. If 2 balls are drawn, with replacement being made after the first ball is drawn. Find
    12a) P(red and blue)
    12b) P(both are red)


    12a) I calculated 5/18 * 6/18 + 6/18 * 5/18=(5/18 * 6/18) *2 = 0.1852 on a test and got 3 marks deduced off for this question. I am very frustrated.

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    I was talking to my instructor about that but he claims that the probability shouldn't be multiplied by 2 and asks me why didn't I multiply the question to 12b by 2 also. One of his arguments is that most students did not multiply it by 2. :bugeye:

    For 12b) I did 5/18 * 5/18=0.07716, do I actually have to multiply this by 2 if ORDER matters?
    Is there a powerful alternate solution (another way) of doing question 12a) ? What solid arguments can I provide to support my answer and to convince my instructor? Does the probability 5/18 * 6/18 include the cases in which the blue ball is drawn first and then a red ball is drawn?

    My interpretation of question 12a) is that as soon as you have a red ball and a blue ball after 2 draws, you are fine, these are the favorable outcomes. I strongly believe that my original answer to 12a) is correct...I will have to "debate" with my instructor tomorrow.

    Could someone help me out? Thank you!

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    Last edited: May 9, 2006
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  3. przyk squishy Valued Senior Member

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    You can argue that the exam question was ambiguous (again

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    ). Is order important or not? Your answer is correct if order is not important.
    In general, if order is not important, you multiply the probability of getting all the colours in one particular order by the number of possible orders (ie. there are 2 ways of drawing a red and a blue ball: RB and BR, 6 ways of drawing 3 different coloured balls, etc.) There's only one way of getting 2 reds though, so there's no reason to double your final answer. (NB: this only works if the balls are replaced after each draw)
     
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  5. kingwinner Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    796
    12) But for probability questions, order should always be important (i.e. permutations), right?

    Consider a bag of 1 red ball and 1 blue ball. 2 balls are drawn with replacement.
    The probability of drawing a red and a blue ball is (1/2 * 1/2) * 2= 2/4 (RB, BR)
    The probability of drawing 2 red balls is 1/2 * 1/2 = 1/4 (RR)

    Listing all the possible outcomes confirm this nicely: RR, RB, BR, BB

    If order is not important (i.e. combinations), the possible outcomes become: {R,R}, {R,B}, {B,B}, but we know that the probability of drawing a red ball and a blue ball is NOT 1/3.
     
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  7. przyk squishy Valued Senior Member

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    3,203
    The probability that the first ball drawn is red and that the second ball is blue (order is important) is 1/4.

    The probability that one red and one blue ball is drawn (order is not important) is 1/2.

    P(red and blue) could be interpreted either way.
     
  8. herry Registered Member

    Messages:
    4
    distribution probablity

    any help

    Roll two dice and denote X the higher number and Y the lower number
    shown.
    (a) Is the joint distribution of X; Y discrete, continuous or neither?
    Explain.
    (b) Find IP(X = Y ), IP(X > 2Y ).
     
  9. AnthonyGerges Registered Member

    Messages:
    1
    number 8 was not explained
     
  10. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

    Messages:
    39,426
    Calculate the probability that a randomly-selected person currently suffers side-effects:
    $(1/2 \times 1/400) + (1/2 \times 1/1200) = 1/600$

    If Acetylin is taken off the market the probability the same person suffers side-effects becomes:
    $1 \times 1/1200 = 1/1200$

    which is half as great as before.

    Phew! I'm glad we got that solved! It's been a long eleven-and-something year wait.
     
  11. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,077
    Here is a probability teaser

    I know the answer and how to work out and have tested it

    However am interested in those who might like to guess the odds and hope those fluent in maths don't spoil it for those who guess

    I will say YES or NO to those who guess or even those who work out a answer OFF POST and only post the result

    Also don't obtain items needed and run a simulation as almost same as pencil paper work out

    OK

    Two packs normal cards less the blanks and jokers

    Each random shuffled

    Placed alongside each other, two piles face down

    Each card on top of each pile is turned over at same moment

    Continue until all cards are face up, that is counted as one go

    Guess, or work out off post, odds of turning up 2 matching cards

    Matching means IDENTICAL, not any suite 4 to any other suite 4

    If one pack you turn up 4 spades other pack has to turn up 4 spades

    So looking for odds any card turned up will have to its counterpart in other pile turn up at same moment

    GO

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  12. Halc Registered Senior Member

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    350
    A couple button pushes on a calculator, no simulation needed. I got 63.57% odds that at least one pair of cards matches.
     
  13. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    13,077
    Pushing buttons on calculator is a simulation

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  14. Halc Registered Senior Member

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    You and I have a different definition of a simulation.
    I simply evaluated an arithmetic expression that could be typed in 11 characters, but is beyond my ability to do in my head.
     
  15. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    18,960
    This is an interesting puzzle that can be solved binarily (it's a word).

    Conditions:
    A: The first is a girl
    B: the next 3 are boys
    0=g

    Possible outcomes and matches:

    0: 0000 A
    1: 0001 A
    2: 0010 A
    3: 0011 A
    4: 0100 A
    5: 0101 A
    6: 0110 A
    7: 0111 A B
    8: 1000
    9: 1001
    10: 1010
    11: 1011
    12: 1100
    13: 1101
    14: 1110
    15: 1111 B


    The first eight meet condition A.
    Of those, #7 also meets condition B.
    As does #15.

    Google: "When two events, A and B, are not mutually exclusive, the probability that A or B will occur is the sum of the probability of each event, minus the probability of the overlap."
    https://www.mathgoodies.com/lessons/vol6/addition_rules

    In other words, the probability is simply the sum of outcomes that meet any of the conditions (the sum automatically eliminates overlap).

    9 out of 16 meet at least one condition, thus the probability is 9/16 or 0.5625.
     
  16. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    13,077
    Mathematics explained



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