Religion

Discussion in 'Religion' started by timojin, Sep 30, 2016.

  1. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    On the contrary, the farther something is from what we know to be true, the LESS believable it is. Unicorns are quite believable. Santa Claus is somewhat believable, even if some of his accomplishments are suspect.

    God, on the other hand, is often defined by believers as something that is practically inconceivable.
     
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  3. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    So, in short, what you're saying is that you haven't bothered to inform yourself about anything.
    You're not interested in facts, nor in what can be shown to be true (or even valid), and that you'd rather stick with some sort of utterly uninformed lack of intellectual commitment/ integrity.

    This makes no sense.
     
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  5. ForrestDean Registered Senior Member

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    Whenever I feel it's appropriate. But other than that... should I? Is this a requirement?

    Then it makes no sense.

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  7. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Why not He created you and me The fact that you and I are here we are a product of His work
     
  8. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Well you can't argue against that but there are those of us who do not believe what you say has any factual basis.
    There is a better case that Santa is real but that is just another story humans made up to make kids behave.
    Alex
     
  9. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Alex , there is no problem , there are those created and those who are descendant of Adam
     
  10. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I can't argue with that.
    You seem like a decent man and we just have different beliefs.
    You have had good experience with religion whereas I find the religious folk in my life do not live by what they preach and so I can only go on my sad experience.

    I have read the bible (King James) and find many things that I don't find reflect a God but do reflect man's view.

    As I have said before no one I have met who says they believe have read the bible and that suggests to me they are hypocrites.

    If you take the time line from the bible you get a universe that is a mere 6000 years old and that does not line up with reality.

    Religion is behind many good deeds I believe but is also responsible for many very bad things.

    I like my approach because it enables me to accept that it is me who is responsible for my deeds I do not have to ask God why this or that happened to me but always look to how my input has guided final outcomes.

    I could not imagine you could change your beliefs and I hope you can see how mine work for me.

    But I find it impossible to accept we came from ancestors who were created, as set out in the bible, some 6000 years ago.

    Not when there is, what seems, good evidence of many humans walking the planet well before 6000 years.

    To accept a 6000 year time line would mean one would have to reject more science than I could cite.

    I think honesty is important not only when dealing with others but particularly with oneself and honestly I can not believe there is a God who created the universe and cares about humans more than the poor creatures we are given dominion over.

    I say such a belief, that God Cates about us, is attributable to man's arrogance.

    Then there is the suffering, the inequity, the cruelty and the horrible war and killing...much of these things are a direct result of religion.

    If I were God I would not stand by whilst a child is hurt, a women is beaten or abused, whilst someone starves whilst others indulge gluttony, and well I would not have war..there are so many things that just are wrong that a God should fix.

    I spent hours on the phone talking to machines to get a problem fixed on my phone with no result but finally when I got to speak to a human they fixed my problem in under a minute.

    You could think that if a god could step in our problems could be fixed faster than the human fixed my phone problem.

    A farmer would never leave his flock or herd unattended so why are we left unattended... There either is no farmer caring for us or he is a negligent farmer either way I could not follow or believe in something so uncaring and cruel.

    And JC tells us that's what we should do...be kind treat your fellow man with respect etc.

    Sorry I rant yet again ... Have a nice day.
    Alex
     
  11. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Alex . I think of my self I am a pawn on a chess board game and there are two players, and so at a given position or time I am to be sacrificed for a better good. This how I see good or evil in the world
     
  12. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    That's an interesting way to see things Timojin thank you for sharing your approach with me.
    Moreover thank you for the way you have taken my rants.
    I know I am doing it and that I would be best staying silent.
    But I do go on I see it at least.
    Again thank you for being decent.
    Alex
     
  13. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Me, I'm the Queen.

    And agnostic,
     
  14. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    Ok... but what grater good coud come from a child bein raped an murdered.???
     
  15. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    What about the religion and faith that members of, say, Islamic State, have? I don't see much pacifism there.
     
  16. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    ForrestDean:

    A person who believes god is all things is called a pantheist. A pantheist makes no distinction between the universe and God. That sounds like it describes you. Am I right?

    You want to tie yourself in semantic knots. Ok then. Tell me what is it about nothing that you believe, exactly. Or, tell me what your belief in nothing entails in your life, specifically.

    To me, it just sounds like you don't want to commit to anything, or you're unable to make up your mind about things. On the other hand, I'm fairly confident that if I scratched the surface of your claims to hold no opinions on anything, I'd quickly find that you do, in fact, believe in lots of things, and you don't believe in other things.

    Do you feel like it makes you an enigma to others to claim that you have no set beliefs? Does it make you feel freer? Are you sure that's not just a comforting illusion you're creating for yourself there?
     
  17. PhysBang Valued Senior Member

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    Those sentences are a great demonstration.
     
  18. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    For the stone doth maketh the dull knife sharp and doth holdeth the door open to let in the clean air.
    For the stone is strong and shall not be harmed even if it be wrapped in the paper. And the stone shall break the scissors lest the paper be cut.
    Alex
     
  19. sculptor Valued Senior Member

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    I don't think I'd use the concept "defined".
     
  20. kx000 Valued Senior Member

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    They should have to prove their belief just like a theory. The all mighty is passive, without you go numb of joy and become stupid.
     
  21. ForrestDean Registered Senior Member

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    Sounds good to me.

    Ahh well that's easy. Well, the concept is easy but the act is somewhat more challenging. It's really nothing more than the ability to just let go... of EVERYTHING. It's kind of like committing suicide but without actually killing the physical body. It's like taking a backward dive off a cliff and just free falling into nothingness.

    That would be correct. I'd prefer to not be bound by anything. As far as making up my mind about things, well what I decide is what I decide. There are no right or wrong decisions. It's just experience. I'm just here to play the game like everyone else.

    Hehe, oh I do have an ego, and mastering it is still very much a work in progress, so I do have opinions from time to time, but nothing from which I can quickly change if it suits me or the situation. Yes, I do believe in lots of things, I believe in everything, but again it is not in my interest to be bound, enslaved, or imprisoned by any of them. I am of course still very much bound by many beliefs, but that is a work in progress that can take an entire life time.

    I don't feel any lesser or greater than anyone else. Nothing is greater or lesser than anything or anyone else. All life is equal without exception. Like I said earlier I'm just here to play the game like everyone else. I'm just here for the ride with my hands up in the air. I'm just passing through. None of this is even real. The experience is real to be sure, but everything in it is nothing more than an illusion.

    Yes, it can be quite liberating.

    Well, it's comforting, but I wouldn't call it an illusion, more like a goal.
     
  22. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    You didn't respond to what I said. I said that a God that you can't even define is LESS likely than a unicorn which is only slightly different from a known animal.
     
  23. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

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    I just told timojin that God can't even be defined, so I guess you're right.
     

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