depends on how you define liberty. if you define it as wanting the most freedom they are against it. if you define it as no checks on the powerful than they are all for it.
Yeah, pretty good. If it is for the other guy it is welfare. If it is for me, its mine. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Kind of funny how that works with these folks. Actually, I think and the survey bears out is that these folks are very misinformed.
A few points? Nearly three-quarters of Tea Party activists attended college, compared to 54 percent of all Americans Really? The poll indicates that about 24 percent of the public generally favors the Tea Party movement but has not taken any actions such as donating money or attending a rally. Adding in the 11 percent who say they are active, a total of 35 percent could be described as Tea Party supporters http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/17/tea.party.poll/index.html 35% is not a fringe group. If it is, then liberals are also a fringe group since fewer than 35% of Americans call themselves liberal. When you add the fact that Tea Party activists are extremely energized and much more likely to vote than the Average American; 35% becomes a very powerful number.
But not "graduated college," note. And that stat gets much less impressive if you compare it to Americans from the comparable age group - which is to say, largely middle-aged and old. That they've attended more school than kids who aren't even old enough to drive does not impress. And as long as we're comparing educational penises, I'll add that I've attended more school - and graduated - than all but a tiny fraction of the teabaggers. So they should be deferring to my views, if there's some sort of hierarchy of political respect implied here. But let me just add something I have learned in my many, many years of education: there are lots of educated people who are still idiots, especially about politics. Same goes for millionaires.
The obvious Liberalism is a fringe group these days. I mean, come on. People think Hillary Clinton is a liberal, for heaven's sake; the popular definition of liberalism these days pretty much matches a functional definition for centrism, and thus keeps drifting further to the right. Meanwhile, more genuine liberalism is generally disdained, as it long has in this country.
Yes perspective is funny is it not. To limbaugh, hannity, beck, levin, et al devotees anyone who disagrees with their point of view are liberals. So that would mean that roughly 75 percent of the population is liberal. I don't call that a fringe.
Untrue. Is tea-party support gained mainly from the elderly? No. And that’s quite emphatic. By far the largest group represented are 30-49 year olds at 40% whilst 18-29 year olds constitute 20% of tea-party support. In fact 18-29 year olds are over-represented in the tea-party movement, they only make up 18% of the electorate. 18-29 years old 20% 30-49 years old 40% 50-64 years old 29% 65 and older 12%http://www.conservativecabbie.com/2010/02/17/tea-party-demographics/ It was Joe who brought up the issue, and misquoted the stats. I was merely correcting his error. What the hell are you going on about? So what if you've got a degree. So do I. That fact is so obvious I don't know why you bothered to say it.
No you were not correcting anything, you were spinning. The difference between those who hold degrees Tea Partiers versus the general population is not that great, only a few percentage points. The bottom line is this is a fringe of the Republican Party. And the Republican Party numbers about 35 percent of the general population. The other interesting thing is that they get all of their news from Fox News...no wonder they are so misinformed.
What are the numbers? I gave you actual numbers with a source. Stop blowing smoke and show me the specific numbers. No, the Tea Party movement by itself is about 35% of the population (or maybe it's of voters, not that it makes a difference). Joe, Fox News has ratings that are greater than all other cable news networks combined! Most of the US gets it's news from Fox. That is not at all unique to Tea Party activists. PS Here's a video of a Nazi (or perhaps a liberal pretending to be a Nazi trying to make the Tea Party look bad) being evicted from a Tea Party gathering: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYfmShJe5MA&feature=player_embedded
Fox News is one channel. Remember, NBC's nightly news telecast has 8 million + viewers. Combine that with MSNBC viewers and you'll have millions more.
The Boston Tea Party... fundraiser for Dr. Paul. Though I have heard that it started before then. But yes, the accusations have been that the Tea Party thing is being subverted into a typical mainstream "conservative" propaganda platform, where people are righteously indignant about the Constitution being dismantled... as long as it's Obama doing the dismantling. Nary a word about what the Neocons achieved!
Actually, JoeEp has correctly quoted the stats according to the poll referred to in the opening post, which is the NY Times/CBS Poll. You're referring to stats from a CNN poll. The NY Times survey is by far the larger, more scientific and comprehensive study with significant tracking data. The sample was also weighted towards Tea Party supporters. In the NY Times poll: 21% of all respondents said they have a favourable opinion of the Tea Party. 18% of all respondents consider themselves a Tea Party supporter. Of these Tea Party supporters: 46% are aged 45 to 64 29% are 65+ 59% approve of insurance companies being required to provide cover if there are pre-existing conditions or illnesses. 62% supporters think the benefits of programs like Medicare and Social Security are worth the cost to taxpayers. 44% are currently covered by Medicare (themselves or an immediate family member) and yet... 73% would favour cuts in programs like Medicare, Social Security, Education if it meant smaller government. Only 6% think Bush is to blame for the budget deficit Top three most admired political figures: 1. Newt Gingrich 2. Sarah Palin 3. George Bush/Mitt Romney 41% think Obama was born in the US, 30% think he wasn't and 29% say they don't know. 64% think Obama has increased taxes [wrong] Only 2% think he's decreased taxes [correct] ... and lots of other interesting stuff over 41 pages/100+ questions. The CNN study's light and fluffy by comparison.
Battle of the Numbers? Interesting. A battle of the polls. According to the NYT/CBS News poll examined by Media Matters (cited in Joe's opening post), 46% of Tea Party supporters fall in the 46-64 age group, and another 29% in the 64+. That's three quarters of the Tea Party supporters polled at least having reached middle age. Compared to the broader sampling, that is twelve and thirteen percent, respectively, more than the cumulative result for all respondents. Interestingly, in the one age range that matches exactly between the two polls, there is a striking difference. The CNN poll cited by your Cabbie says 20% of Tea Party supporters are age 18-29. The NYT/CBS poll suggests only 7%. Where CNN found only 12% over the age of 65%, NYT/CBS recorded 29%. Additionally, 32% of the Tea Party contingent surveyed in the NYT/CBS poll are retired, compared to 18% over the range of all respondents. On the education question, the numbers are fairly close°: Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! In either case, the numbers are higher than the sample for all respondents in the NYT/CBS poll. But if we put the polls head to head, what are our criteria for comparison? The NYT/CBS numbers more recent, rely on a much larger sample (sevenfold), and are not restricted only to Tea Party "activists" (as compared to supporters). Both polls were conducted for organizations frequently accused of participating in the mythical "liberal media conspiracy". I think "untrue" isn't a fair response on your part. At best, you might argue dueling statistics, but in the end, one of those data sets—the one you and the Cabbie argue from—is weaker than the other. It's not, in that sense, a good posture for the duel. You might argue that the polls show the Tea Party generally bucking identifiable trends, save for its significant underrepresentation among blacks. But, given the nature of Obamanoia, perhaps that is to be expected. Or, as you once explained°: "As I said, race is not the motivating factor, it's policy. But some ... will use any weapon at hand to stop Obama. Not because he's black, but because they believe he's going to destroy what they believe is unique about America." That underrepresentation aside, as it is not necessarily important to our consideration here, the differences between the polls might be found in changing sentiments (over the course of a month, which seems unlikely), geography of the sample, or perhaps the size and nature of the sample. That latter would suggest greater accuracy for the NYT/CBS poll, which you have declared to be "untrue". Indeed, the CNN poll analysis notes a margin of error for its Tea Party numbers of nine points. Lastly, I would note of the 35% figure, there are some issues with the way you're using it: Of 1,023 adults surveyed for CNN, a total of 124—approximately twelve percent according to straight math (their analysis says 11%)—claimed to have participated actively in the Tea Party movement, and that includes those whose only contribution might be forwarding news stories to their friends via e-mail, or promoting its agenda at boards like Sciforums. Of 881 Tea Party supporters surveyed in the NYT/CBS poll, fifteen percent have either donated money or attended a rally or meeting; five percent have done both. Of the thirty-five percent who variously "support" the Tea Party, a bit over a third are active in the movement. 78% of the NYT/CBS Tea Party supporters have not donated money or attended a meeting or rally. You are overstating the movement by your general application of the terms and numbers. ____________________ Notes: ° the numbers are fairly close — I should here offer a clarification. Instead of the intended verb, "Graduate", which can also be treated as an adjective, I should have used the past tense, "Graduated", for clarity. Frankly, it's late, and I'm not inclined to spend the whole five to ten minutes required to compose the graphic anew. Thus, this note will have to suffice. ° you once explained — And we might as well reiterate Iceaura's response to that, as a preemptive attempt to clear up any confusion: "So let me make sure I've read this correctly: racism is a weapon used by non-racists, not an important factor in itself - these people are not racists, they're just using racism as a weapon, and so calling them on the racism behind what they do and say is "playing the race card" and not fair?" Works Cited: Zernike, Kate and Megan Thee-Brenan. "Poll Finds Tea Party Backers Wealthier and More Educated". The New York Times. April 15, 2010; page A1. NYTimes.com. April 17, 2010. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/15/us/politics/15poll.html "Polling the Tea Party". The New York Times. April 14, 2010. NYTimes.com. April 17, 2010. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/04/14/us/politics/20100414-tea-party-poll-graphic.html Cable News Network. "CNN Poll: Who are the Tea Party activists". Political Ticker. February 17, 2010. PoliticalTicker.Blogs.CNN.com. April 17, 2010. http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/02/17/cnn-poll-who-are-the-tea-party-activists/ Cable News Network and Opinion Research Corporation. CNN/Opinion Research Poll. February 17, 2010. i2.cdn.turner.com. April 17, 2010. http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/02/17/rel4b.pdf
Good analysis. I can't argue much with anything you said there. Except to say I'm a bit suspicious of anything from media matters. Here is the first sentence from the about us section of their website: Media Matters for America is a Web-based, not-for-profit, 501(c)(3) progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative misinformation in the U.S. media.http://mediamatters.org/p/about_us/ So the declared purpose of the website is to "correct conservative misinformation". Which means they clearly have an ax to grind.
(Insert Title Here) Be as dubious as you like about Media Matters. One thing I've noticed about conservatives and MM is that they seem to act like if the organization covers a news story, the story is automatically invalidated. This is a fallacious regard, to say the least. As to the numbers and sources, I would simply reiterate, from my post: According to the NYT/CBS News poll examined by Media Matters (cited in Joe's opening post) .... .... Both polls were conducted for organizations frequently accused of participating in the mythical "liberal media conspiracy". (Boldface accent added) Additionally, just because it amuses me, I would note of this thread as a whole that when I posted this poll seventeen hours before Joe, nobody cared. Don't take me wrongly here: I buried it in the, "Another Stupid Tea Party" thread, asserted a slightly more complicated critique of the Tea Party than the topic post for this thread, and am not Joe—and thus not trying to play the role of a liberal Rush, Glenn, or FOX News. My ego isn't bruised or anything; but I do find it interesting that people seem to be looking for something to fight about more than searching for truth.
How is the Tea Party wanting a smaller government with less control on our life is "far right" ? Apparently Adolf Hitler had a puny tiny tiny government with virtually no control ? am I right ? .... If there's Republicans in there posing as Tea Partiers, yea, they might be right, but the Tea Party itself doesn't stand for a far right-wing government.
No it stands for we the misinformed and further more we don't want to be well and truthfully informed crowd. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Because they also favor a government with less control over (and greater cooperation with) the behavior of powerful corporations, which they have mistaken for "people".
