There was no Sun worship

Cave drawing?
My you are uneducated aren't you?
Ra (eqypt - no caves but buildings) was a sun god.
Mithras was a sun god.
Helios/ Phaeton was a sun god.
Sol Invictus was a sun god.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/connecte...=A1&xml=/connected/2007/03/02/nscience102.xml

Ever tried something called google?

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

Education as it realtes to this subject is relative to who is telling the story, this is not technical skill.

You are naive, but the reality is much more is made of this than is even remotely true.

Tell me everything about worshippers of Mithras and how you know even the most remote thing about them. The sun was never worshipped in any way that we equate religious worship to. Name one person who believed that the sun was responsible for creation of life, not sustaining life but creating life.

And do not make assumptions on my education, just because i dont believe what you do.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

Sun worship
(written by Dr. F. J. Los, reprinted from "The Northlaender")

The sun has been revered as a deity by a variety of peoples. However, it is clear that it was not only as a beneficial, but also as a dreaded and destructive power, that this heavenly body was adored in hot countries. So in ancient Egypt the sun god Rah (or Amon-Rah)was represented by a man bearing a sun disc on his head, which was surmounted by the Uraeus-snake. The reptile symbolizing the withering effect of the sun often has been used in the Near East. Quite different was the situation in Central and Northern Europe, where a sufficient amount of sunshine was essential for the ripening of crops. Here the sun was worshipped as a beneficial power as soon as agriculture became the principal means of support during the Neolithic period (+/- 4000 - 2000 BCI).

Consequently it was the ancient Indogermans, originally centered in the basin of the Danube, who spread its cult throughout Europe and even into other parts of the world. How firmly the befief in the creative power of the sun was rooted in the minds of these early Nordics becomes clear when we look at the ruins of the biggest megatithic monuments of Northern Europe, the sun sanctuary of Stonehenge.

Of course it is unnecessary here to desctibe in detail this gigantic monument the remains of which command, since prehistoric times, the Salisbury Plain in Southern England. The visitor wonders how it was possible to transport and set up the enormous blocks of stone the majority of which had been hewn, as modern research has proven, from the rocks of the Prescelly Chain in South Wales, a distance of 274 km measured along the overland route that was in all probability followed. What people erected this imposing monument and what was its purpose?

The scientific investigation of its ruins, which was carried through in recent times, has made it possible to answer both questions. The sanctuary was undoubtedly dedicated to the worship of the Sun as is proven by the fact that the line from the middle of the so-called "altar stone", lying in its center, to the "Hele Stone" at the entrance, is directed to the point in the NE where the sun rose on midsummer day.

According to the archaeologists there were three building periods, the first of which is dated by means of a radio-carbon test, at about 1840 BCI. Recently a number of drawings of Mycenean daggers and flanged axes were detected on some of the stones, and it is supposed that the final completion of the sanctuary, about 1700 BCI, took place under the direction of an architect from the Greek town of Mycenae.

However, its construction is ascribed to the so-called Bellbeaker Folk whose graves, known as the 'round barrows', abound in the vicinity of the monument.

This people whose original habitat lay in Central Spain spread over Europe at the beginning of the second millennium BCI, diffusing at the same time the knowledge of the first metals: copper and bronze. They reached Britain in two successive waves, the first coming from the Netherlands, the second from the western parts of Germany (about 1700 BCI).

In both countries they had mixed with elements of another people, the Indogermanic (Indo-European) Battle Axe People, whose original fatherland lay in Saxony and Thuringia. The amalgamation of both peoples makes understandable why the skeletons which have been unearthed from the round barrows belong partly to the Faelian, partly to the Nordic type, and why copper daggers as well as stone hammers were found in them.

That it was the Nordic element of the Beaker Folk that introduced the worship of the sun in Britain is admitted by one leading English archaeologist in the forllowing words: "So it was the strong Indo-European element infused into our Beaker culture by the Battle Axe Warriors which gave its religion this skyward trend. We are witnessing the triumph of a more barbaric Zeus over the ancient Earth Mother dear to the Neolithic peasantry, the goddess whom they had brought with them from the centers of her fertile power in the Mediterranean and the Near East. "

To make it clear that this replacement of one religion by another was the consequence, not of a gradual evolution, but of an invasion, we must cast a glance at the Scandinavia of the Bronze Age. There, on the rock engravings of Bohuslan in Southern Sweden, are to be seen ships bearing a sun disc and manned by men who swing battle axes; winged horses, concentric circles, spirals, wheel crosses and other symbols of the sun can also be seen.

The horses are destined to pull the sun chariot along the sky in day time, which reminds us of the ancient myth of Phaeton; a ship was thought to transport the sun through the underworld back to the East at night. A slightly different version of the same idea is well-known from the Norse legends.

To the same Nordic culture belong bronze razors adorned with a sun wheel or the head of a horse. From a later phase of the Bronze Age dates the famoussun chariot of Trundholm, a magnificent testimony to the artistic taste and professional skill of the old Nordics.

With all the Indogermanic peoples we find at the dawn of history the worship of heaven gods: Dyas piter with the Aryan Indians, Ahura mazda with the Persians, Papios with the Scythians, Zeus with the Germans and Dasjbog with the Slavs. However, the Greek Phoibos Apollo (i.e. "the radiant" Apollo), the Roman Sol invictus (the unconquered sun) and the Persian and Mitannian Mithra(s) remained genuine sun gods. The anthropomorphic (humanized) character these gods had assumed in the course of time is a late development which might be considered a degeneration.

How far the sun worship had spread during the Bronze Age becomes clear when we look at three countries that lie far apart: Peru, Egypt and Palestine. In the empire of the Inca's the sun was adored in the form of a golden disc, surrounded by beams. Its principal festival was that of the winter solstice, on June 21.

The Incas (which were an aristocratic leading class among the mongolian American Indians) are described by a Spanish author as of a white complexion with hair that was as blond as ripened wheat. Of one of their forbears, Vicacocha Inca, who was described as a blond and bearded man of white complexion, the first Spaniards were told that he had conquered the land coming from the North, and later fled overseas having suffered a crushing defeat. According to Thor Heyerdahl, he reached Polynesia where ancient legends speak of him as Kon-Tiki. All these facts and many more make it possible that sun worship was imported into Peru by immigrants from Europe.

We know today that not only the Vikings reached America before Columbus, but that also many years previous peoples from North Africa (ruled and occupied by a Nordic upper class) could cross the ocean in primitive but sea-worthy vessels.

With regard to Egypt it is generally known that the pharaoh Amenophis IV (1375-1358 BCI) tried to introduce a monotheistic religion by declaring the sun god Aten the only god, while he renamed himself Akhenaten (i.e. glory of the sun disc). The historians usually omit the fact that this pharaoh was in all probability, just as his father Amenophis III, the son of a Mitannian princess as in portraits he appears as a Nordic.

The Mitanni were ati Aryan people who had founded a mighty empire in Northern Syria. Also in this case the connection between culture and race is apparent. Another religious reform, but in the opposite direction, was carried through in 622 BC in the kingdom of Judah by King Josias. Among other cults, sun wlorship was suppressed by him in a barbaric and bloody manner. It is very remarkable when we read in II Kings 23:11 "And he took away the horses that the kings of Judah had given to the sun... and burned the chariot of the sun with fire". Does not this text remind us of the sun chariot of Trundholm?

Sun worship belongs to the sunken world of the Northern Bronze Age, the culture that was destroyed by the nature catastrophes of about 1220 BCI. With the Indogermanic religions of later times it has in common its character of nature worship. To the elrements of the former cult that submerged into christianization among the Teutons belong the feasts of the summer and winter solstices, but also a number of symbols such as the wheel cross and the swastika. It may be that the christian mode of praying with closed eyes is atso a relic of the religion of our forbears as it is impossible to look at the sun with your eyes fully open.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

Believe what you want, human nature has not changed. If you are going to draw conclusions from ancient coins and drawings then go right ahead.

I stand by this assertion:

The sun was never worshipped in any way that we equate religious worship to. Name one person who believed that the sun was responsible for creation of life, not sustaining life but creating life.

 

I don't even want to know what you equate with religious worship.

By the way you don't need to believe that a particular god created life in order to worship it.

Zalktis, a latvian snake god, was worshipped as the god of secrets, wisdom and magic, Laima was worshipped as the goddess of luck and fate (still is worshipped, by some by the way), Pērkons was worshipped as the god of war and was associated with victory over enemy and dark forces, Saule was the goddess Sun and there are many hymns dedicated to her.

If you think that worship means putting two hands together and praying for life after death...

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

 

Wrong, on both counts.

Riiight - I paid for my education, why should you get it for free?

Incorrect - most religions started out as sun worship and evolved.

Name one person?
You're joking right?

I'm not making assumptions based on a difference in belief: I'm judging it on your statements here.

 

I see what's going on here.

Avatar, Alabaster, Oli....

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

Because that's exactly what you're doing, John. Trolling. I'm still sitting here dumbfounded that you actually think that there has been NO sun worship anywhere in the history of humanity.

I guess every single website I found in this search is full of shit?
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=sun worship

What part about the Egyptians worshipping Ra, Helios and Mithra (which have all been historically documented and PROVEN) seems to have escaped your perception? They aren't the only civilization that has worshipped the sun, either.

Oh dear.

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/jeanmichel_severino/2006/12/cultivating_energy.html

In other words, they believed it to be the creation of life on earth.

 

how about all the greek writings about apollo? or is that not enough for you - just because it doesn't seem scientifically logical to you doesn't mmean it wasn't done - this is religion we are talking about.

If you were looking for something to worship and you didn't have any real education about the earth then you'd probably choose the big molten ball in the sky that keeps you warm and lights up the sorroundings. there are plenty of ancient scripts referring to sun gods and the worship of them, just look at the bloody aztec artifacts- i understand where you are coming from with the argument that it was scientifically logical, but thats not going to affect someones choice with the education of a caveman.

 

Lets not forget Amun, the sun god worshipped by Akhenaten.

 

On the contrary, that makes it even more mysterious. God doesn't respond in any way whatsoever, but that hasn't stopped Christians/Jews/Muslims from worshipping it.

 

I dont know what your referrance to apollo has to do with this discussion. And i have no doubt there were isolated groups that have worshipped the sun as a god\entity and to this day there may even be some. What I am saying is that the significance of this is way overstated and simplisitic. The SUN was and still is divine in nature, to humans obviously it would be. But it was NEVER the figurehead of any religion and certainly not to Romans or Rome proper. All entities posessing divinity are ORGANIC - derived from living organisms.

How do you know there is NEVER a response?

This part is significant:

This has been known to happen, but if you mean turning pennies into nickels then no that will not happen.

 

mikenostic,

i dont care what your google links say. There are also 2,890,000 Google hits for the word snot.

 

Hey, I thought I added a good opinion to this thread, and it seems it has been deleted. What is going on? People curse and swear and I can't speak about my views on this matter?

 

Don't feel bad , I too had my post deleted because I was trying to add some humorous things to this thread about the sun.

 

The same way you know there is never a response from the Sun.

These things have nothing to do with Comparative Religion, it doesn't discuss whether some god is real or not, you can do that in the Religion section.

Personal beliefs are not discussed here.
I had let your post stay, but Oli responded to it, so I deleted them both, because a theological discourse had started.
Besides your post was preaching creatonism and called followers of some mythologies more ignorant than followers of other mythology, i.e., Christianity.

Mild swearing is traditionally allowed on Sciforums if it comes together with a valid argument. Sometimes even without any argument.

If you have any complains, please take them to the Your Feedback thread in this subforum, or to Site Feedback subforum, or directly to admin Plazma Inferno,
or you can also send me a PM asking for a particular explanation.

 

looks like someone was lonely and just needed an argument

why is it so hard to believe we used once(or still do) worship the sun? its the only thing in our plain sight that has so much energy and changes the "mood" of the earth. The water and bacteria may be worshipped but they are all on earth, and we usually look up to get answers. I applaud your quest to look beyond, but until further notice.. its just the way we humans are...

if you have any sources that are different, its just fanatics looking for something more when there really isnt anything else... don't be one..

 

POssibly you are not familiar with John. It is a while since I have had anything to do with him, but memories are filtering back up from the depths about him being impermeable to logic or evidence. A quick scan of this thread will show that this is indeed the case.

 

John, you can 'not care what my google links say', all you want. It still doesn't remove the fact that you have been proven wrong, and not just by me. And not caring also doesn't keep the information in 'my google links' from being factual.

And, those google links don't belong to me btw. I just used a bit of researching ability and found them.

 

I am not lonely at all, though i do not have anyone to talk to about stuff like this, i like to debate but i am not the one being hostile here. I believe what I have posted to be accurate, ancient belief systems were more sophisticated than they are given credit and this coincides with my belief that human intelligence\ability has not changed only advancements. AND i can prove it too.

yes, looking for something more when there isn't, perfect description. Exactly what i have been saying.