Xelasnave.1947
Valued Senior Member
Thank you for taking the time but I only wanted one, the best, so I will take your favorite as the best.
Alex
Top 8 most controversial UFO photos
- Thread starter cuong077
- Start date
Alex
I remain totally unconvinced MR.Blurry photos and unexplained phenomena at best.
Have you ever observed in a photo how the wheels of cars seem to be going backwards?
There's a 5m 30s video at this site
http://www.space.com/34541-alien-life-search-possible-seti-signals.html
that answers 4 questions re ETL and the current search with comments by Jill Tarter, Seth Shostak and David Levy, that discusses what I have said many times...such as maybe ETI has visited Earth in the past, maybe we are under serveillance at this time, maybe they are amongst us, but as yet, and despite personally my great desire, as well as those above I mentioned] to dearly want to verify such, as of this time, sadly we just as yet, have no evidence of such: Perhaps its there, all we need to do is find it.
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Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Blurry photos and unexplained phenomena at best.
Have you ever observed in a photo how the wheels of cars seem to be going backwards?
There's a 5m 30s video at this site
http://www.space.com/34541-alien-life-search-possible-seti-signals.html
that answers 4 questions re ETL and the current search with comments by Jill Tarter, Seth Shostak and David Levy, that discusses what I have said many times...such as maybe ETI has visited Earth in the past, maybe we are under serveillance at this time, maybe they are amongst us, but as yet, and despite personally my great desire, as well as those above I mentioned] to dearly want to verify such, as of this time, sadly it just hasn't as yet happened.
It's sad when the self-proclaimed purveyors of science have to twist themselves up into argumentative knots just to deny the evidence that is right before their eyes. Use to be science was all about evidence. But when it comes to ufos, it's suddenly all about 101 ways to deny the evidence. Semantic parlour tricks and rhetorical sophistry and such. That tells you something about their so called "science"..It's more akin to theological apologetics, complete with absolute pseudological maxims like "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." and "Since evidence can be faked it isn't reliable."
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If what you say were true, yes it would be sad. But it isn't true. Extraordinary evidence for ETL is out there somewhere: We havn't found it as yet. All we need to do is to find it.
Big difference... with the Moon Landing, we have reflectors up there that anyone with a decent laser rangefinder can bounce off of and verify they are there... hell, Mythbusters even did a segment on this IIRC.
And... are you really comparing the Holocaust and 9/11 to UFO's...? Sure, because several millions dead is so similar to an unknown object being spotted in the sky...
Agreed
The thing is also MR, they are now caught in conumdrum of ; its true but , I have denied the UFO evidence all along , so to admit otherwise , is tough .
At least Hynek had the courage to reevaluate his thinking .
Some need to think upon Hynek's reevaluation , of his thinking upon UFO'S.
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As usual, typical false information from you river. Most all, if not all scientists of all pursasions recognise that UFO's have been sighted and that they remain just that: Unidentified.
The problem exists when gullible people who have watched too much X-Files, and have the need of "want to believe", are immediatley inclined to feed their gulliblity, impressionable and consign any unexplained event as Aliens, ghosts, bigfoot, fairies, or some other figment of their vivid imagination.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
As usual, typical false information from you river. Most all, if not all scientists of all pursasions recognise that UFO's have been sighted and that they remain just that: Unidentified.
The problem exists when gullible people who have watched too much X-Files, and have the need of "want to believe", are immediatley inclined to feed their gulliblity, impressionable and consign any unexplained event as Aliens, ghosts, bigfoot, fairies, or some other figment of their vivid imagination.
Once again, paddoboy's excuse to dismiss this phenomenon--it's unidentified, and that's it. No reason for further research or comparison of thousands of similar cases of witnessing and photographing the same objects. No reason investigating radiation effects on eyewitnesses, soil samples, or plant samples. No reason comparing radar signatures to pilot reports. No reason comparing energy effects on flight instruments, automobiles, etc. It's like they are scared of examining the evidence.
What happened to the courage of science to embrace the unknown phenomenon? To pursue it relentlessly until it can be explained? It's the ufo researchers that are doing the science on this. The denialists quickly move on and change the subject, knowing they are confronting a truly real and extraordinary phenomenon that doesn't fit their world view. They can pontificate endlessly about everything they learned in science class. The speed of light, electron shells, and gravitons. But confront them with a real mystery like ufos or the paranormal or sasquatch or esp and they run like scared rabbits.
“Cut through the ridicule and search for factual information in most of the skeptical commentary and one is usually left with nothing. This is not surprising. After all, how can one rationally object to a call for scientific examination of evidence? Be skeptical of the "skeptics."”
Bernard Haisch, “UFOs and Mainstream Science”
http://www.ufoevidence.org/NewSite/Papers/UFOQuotes.htm
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No, not at all MR, and you are being totally misleading to claim that.
Sure, investigate, research, to try and reach a reasonable conclusion, but don't invoke Aliens. ghosts, goblins, big foot, that yourself and river so quickly do, until that evidence is conclusive, and I have mentioned what would constitute conclusive evidence many times.
But until then, you guessed it, it remains as Unidentified.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
I don't invoke aliens. I have no idea where the ufonauts are from. But going by hundreds of eyewitness accounts of humanoid occupants leaving and entering the craft from all over the world, they are very real.
http://www.ufoevidence.org/topics/humanoid.htm
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Or perhaps just figments of people's imaginations.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
No..hundreds of people all over the world--from farmers to policemen to loggers to miners--don't "imagine" metallic craft setting down and beings coming out of them. There's no motive for them to do so nor enough power in imagination to create such a distinctive and lucid scene. And even then the imprints and burnt marks and radiation traces in the soil and on plant life proves it was very real.
http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc201.htm
http://www.nicap.org/NSID_DBListingbyCat6.pdf
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Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence:
People sometimes do have confirmation bias, that can lead them to reach unreal conclusions, people do suffer from illusions, the atmospheric disturbances, anomalies can cause weird sightings, people do play tricks on other people, and yes, some are certainly unexplained or unidentified.
But as of yet, we certainly have no extraordinary evidence of any ETL anywhere in the universe, let alone visiting Earth and conducting isolated mayhem.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Detailed eyewitness accounts by the hundreds of the same sort of objects and physical traces left by the objects ARE extraordinary evidence. There's simply no way of dismissing this mountain of consistent data we have on this phenomenon. And the phenomenon continues to this day.
Sorry, Scientists do not see it as extraordinary, rather unexplained and/or unidentified.
And they arrive at that conclusion for many reasons that I have stated here in the past.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Scientists DO see it as extraordinary and see it as evidence of a real physical phenomenon. See Vallee, Hynek, McDonald, Sturrock, Freidman, Haisch, Mack, Maccabee, Haines, et al.
http://www.ufoevidence.org/NewSite/Papers/UFOQuotes.htm
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Most scientists do not see it as extraordinary evidence: My apologies.
And as long as "they
" keep on flittering in and flittering out again, it will remain so.When we find an Alien body, an Alien artifact, some Alien excreta, an Alien space ship, for all to see in an official capacity, then, and only then, will we have extraordinary evidence that Aliens have visited Earth.
This flittering in and flittering out again, thousands of times, conducting medical experiments, appearing to small groups or individuals in out of the way places, is not extraordinary.
Magical Realist
Valued Senior Member
Fallacy ad populum--because most believe something or don't believe something, it is therefore true.
And as long as "they
They don't just flitter in and out again in remote places. I already listed hundreds of cases of them landing in fields and occupants exiting from them. They have been seen by thousands as big as a football field hovering over cities, seen by dozens shooting up thru a cloud at Chicago O'Hare airport, picked up on multiple radars accelerating and maneuvering at impossible speeds, and witnessed by thousands of well-trained pilots flying alongside and circling their planes. Again you just can't deny the solid evidence. Unless you are just defending your worldview that they don''t exist. Isn't that what you're doing? Protecting your faithheld belief that flying saucers aren't real no matter what the evidence says? This is religion for you not science, isn't it?
http://www.ufoevidence.org/Cases/CaseView.asp?section=Pilot
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And your list of supposed scientists that accept them?
Of course they do! and you certainly know what I mean, don't you?
Again, when they make their visitation official, when they stop landing in out of the way fields, when they eventually leave some artifact, body, excreta, or a space craft with mechanical trouble, then we can say we have extraordinary evidence.
I don't deny the evidence: I'm simply saying as I have said many times before [
] there are many other possible explanations for the majority of sightings.And of course I'm no more defending any world wide view, rather simply accepting that over riding fact, that as yet we have no extraordinary evidence.
And if that's the accepted world wide view, its possibly because it is the most logical view.
Your "faith held"comment actually extracted a giggle from me, since in actual fact it is you who has the "faith held" illusion that flying saucers are real.
My view simply is gauged by the lack of all that extraordinary evidence I speak so much of.
I am one of those pilots who saw such a UFO. It is not evidence of extraterrestrials.
Agreed, you cannot deny solid evidence. There is none. No pictures that show a UFO that could not be something else. No bodies of aliens. No alien poop. No materials that cannot be explained by modern technology.
In other words, if you claimed that a crime had been committed by someone with the "evidence" you have - a grainy picture of a person near your house, secondhand stories about abductions of neighbors who had no hard evidence they were abducted, a car driving away at 8000 mph, Bigfoot footprints in your backyard - you would be (rightly) laughed out of court, just as you are laughed out of science forums.