Would any alien visitors be friendly?

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by roadkill, Jun 24, 2003.

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  1. Dwayne D.L.Rabon Registered Senior Member

    Oh well, but fact remains that are solar system is located on the outter edge of our galaxy, the furthest point to say, and the least likly place to find life, such as we humans might think of the planet pluto a cold forbaren place at the edge of the solar system,

    for a alien race to come this far, it would be one of the most advance alien races, in addtion the space craft that we would meet would be one of their finest craft ever built, the only reason that aliens would venture this far out in the galaxy would be to develope space craft for traveling the cosoms, meaning sppace craft for traveling out of this galaxy. and for expolration, scientific discovery.
    lastly for the alien race to discover us in the first place it would have had to have happened in the last 27,000 years, more so in the middle of that then in the begining of that say about 15,000years ago. or else they would have to be a galaxatic empire which has frequent craft that travel or solar system and different regions of the galaxy. Here also we would find that there is organization that would present peacful communication as they would have encountered other life forms and presented negociations with those life forms, what would give them reason to act violently toward human ?

    Dwayne D.L.Rabon
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  3. paulsamuel Registered Senior Member

    a comedien's perspective

    I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.
    - Jack Handey (aka Jack Handy)
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  5. zzzz Registered Member

    To get free drugs and sex

    Your question was intended as a joke right?
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  7. paulsamuel Registered Senior Member

    no opinion

    i have no opinion on whether new civilizations would be friendly, however I believe it would be prudent to prepare for beligerence.

    be that as it may, I do find it difficult to imagine why beligerent aliens would want to attack us, unless worlds which can support life (as we know it) are rare (and valuable to aliens). it could be that these types of worlds can only exist at the ends or edges of galaxies, and so aliens would know where to search for them. but, there is evidence that aliens have visited us and are perhaps still monitoring us. if that's the case, then, if the aliens were beligerent, there would be no reason to wait to attack. they would do it early in our technological development (27000 years ago) or early in our evolutionary development (100000 years ago when H.sapiens first arose).

    another thing which no one has brought up; time it takes for technological advancement; the universe is how old? some estimates are in the 10 billion year range. life started here on earth about as soon as it could (my belief is that if life can exist, i.e. if conditions for life are present, then life will exist) about 4 billion years ago. it then took about 3.5 billion years for multi-cellular life to exist, then it took about 0.5 billion years for humans to exist. it could be, given the life of the universe and evolutionary rates, that there aren't any more advanced forms of life out there because there hasn't been enough time for them to become more advanced than us. we're it!
  8. roadkill Registered Senior Member

    They might have the ability to do that. They might not. The question is whether they can be bothered. It would take time and they might have other higher priorities on their agenda's. What value would communication with us offer them? Assuming they are that advanced. They might know everything we know already.

    We don't know that its the least likely place to find life. Civilisations might litter the outer edge of the sagittarius arm. We are here aren't we?

    Or they could be from one of the local star systems. Maybe even on their first interstellar voyage. I'm sorry but I don't accept your theory that any space travellers other than ourselves must be from the galactic core. That seems to me the most unlikely origin for other sentient life. The stars are packed too tightly together.

    How do you know they would have presented negotiations? It's questionable whether two sentient life forms would even be capable of dialogue. Their customs would be very different so almost any action is liable to cause offence. Any creature with survival instincts is natually suspicious and some behaviours might be misconstrued as attacks. They might have had bad experiences with other Alien life and have the attitude that up and coming species should be wiped out before they become a threat.

    They are valuable to us. Tracking down other Earths is the holy grail of NASA's exoplanet survey programs. Assuming there were two or three Earthlike Worlds on average at every suitable star with a habitable zone large enough, we would still find Earths rare. You have to take interstellar distances into consideration. What good is a hundred Earths if they are spread across 500 light years or more. Most stars are paired which would mean any planets formed would have unstable orbits. Many stars are too old or too young. I don't think there is much question about Earths being valuable.

    Thats one possibility. Here's another. A regional star turns supernova long ago and wipes out all of the more advanced life in our local star systems. Everybody is now on an equal footing. Given the somewhat random yet ultimately progressive nature of evolution there is no telling if intelligence would arise or in how many places but intelligence does seem to have survival value so you can expect it will eventually appear. It's a race. Whoever realises the value of interstellar spaceflight first claims this region of the galaxy. They colonise every available world. It is the nature of life to expand. They keep expanding until they meet another race expanding in the other direction and like two entwined amoeba's they then try to devour one another. The larger more widespread race will win because it has more resources and time to figure out the enemies weaknesses. They outnumber them. Species that don't play this game remain small and easily defeated. We used to play this game on a planetary scale. It was called empire building. Alexander the Great was rather good at it. Species without interstellar travel aren't even a threat. They are just assimilated quickly. I think we will either be conquerors or conquered. Depending on how long it takes for us to develop starships.
  9. Evil_Genius Registered Senior Member

    I believe an alien race would not be aggresive towards us. In order to get here they would obviously have to have far superior intellect then us piss poor earthlings. I believe they would use some type of inter-dimensional travel to get here, maybe the folding of space. One can also assume that they would have great knowlege of snythetics. If so, that might rule out the possibility of them coming here to rape earth of any of its natural resources.

    Are ansectors were violent in order to survive,a trait we inherited. They used this violence in there everyday life i.e. protection, hunting etc...Eventually, trough the process of evolution, we will loose this violence in us. If a race were to be that intelligent, I would assume they would have to be amazingly evolved. If that assumption is correct then I would think they would have gotten past that need for violence and would have seen the incredible benefits of peace.

    I honestly can not think of to many reasons for them coming here.

    1. Exploration/Advancing themselves
    2. The need of something e.g. natural resources, food etc...
    3. Fear/Competition

    The first seems the most logical.
  10. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    I don't believe in aliens. If one were to actually come here, touch me and talk to me, then I would believe it.
  11. dinokg Registered Senior Member

    I hope the won you would come in contact with would be friendly cosmictraveler.

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  12. Evil_Genius Registered Senior Member

    Why not?
  13. buffys Registered Loser Registered Senior Member

    i dont think whether or not one believes in aliens matters much, either way the discussion is hypothetical since contact (i mean formal contact) hasn't happened. We're all just throwing ideas around about the possibility and potential consequences.

    either you think its an interesting exercise or not, belief isn't required.

  14. troj Registered Senior Member

    harsh realities

    Reading this article everyones gone for the 'yeah they'd be pretty dam' hospitable and wack on the U.F BBQ!!!!!' impression.

    sadly..I really doubt that would be the scenario.

    Dont get me wrong ,ok I'm not pesamistic im a realist; and conversing on this (as buffs said) purley hyperthetical conversation I must outline the harsh reality of species behavior.

    Yeah I agree as someone said earlier that for them to come here it would take far supierior technology compared with our efforts.

    but do you really think a superior species would pop in for a tea and cake then p155 off 500 lights years to go home..............nah!!!

    Or think another way................take our great civilisation of mankind:

    We have had the oportuity to learn from 'lower' forms of life ie animals on our planet; and what have we done............weve ripped 'em apart......roasted them with seasoning and a white wine sauce. performed inhuman scientific experiments. Even kept them in cages and tanks for ammusment..........

    Bearing in mind that we are considered the most 'advanced' forms of life:

    Given our blatent disrespect for anything 'lower' than us and our expectations that we can 'use' and 'discard' as and when we feel appropriate ............do you really believe that a 'higher' lifeform would revert to the lower characteristics of a life form.

    I know generally fear is the reason for human aggression and possibly a life form above us is securer in emotional outburst. Thus controlling this fear.

    Pure speculation can lead down many paths.

    I long for the day of extraterestrial contact........and hope that an alliance could be created................but I doubt humans could learn to live with another/better race. I mean whites/Blacks are only just starting to come to terms with each other in the last 25 yrs ...........religions are still killing each other for differences with speculation!!!!

    humans heh!!! take me E.T....I want out!!!!!!
  15. KitNyx Registered Senior Member

    I hope they do not have a religion similar to the one presented in the Bible. Dominion over all other life can be taken a long way, not to mention Manifest Destiny.

    That presents another question...even if the aliens wanted peace, would we, a species who believes they are God's chosen, allow that? What if their emissaries where missionaries? That is what our more civilized cultures do to those cultures we view as less civilized. Could we accept them?

    Another question...Most Americans already have no faith in the American government (neither does the rest of the world for that matter). If aliens were to advise us on our politics, would we have any trust that our politicians were anything but puppets? Would it matter if their was evidence or not?

    - KitNyx
  16. troj Registered Senior Member


    good points there..................KITNYX

    but the main one is the fact that human nature is to attack when fear'd.

    Therefore before the aliens even got within the atmoshpere Bush, Blair n all the other 'red button' boyz are gonna pump the skys so full of nuc's /missles n good ol' fashioned lead that there isnt going to be sniff of 'we come in peace'...............and its is for this human level of behavior I have started to believe that there hasn't been contact.

    They simply realise we havent evolved/matured enough to consider there definate precence.
  17. troj Registered Senior Member

    omg ive got an antennia in ma A$$!!!

    smoking way to much weed....and going right off the wall here:

    with tv pushing 'real life telly' for the 'evoloution' of home entertainment.....................

    howz this for a explanation:

    'its the yr 2525...humans have developped time travel but there so bored from watching sh1tty real life tv shows that everyones going skitso and commiting suicide..............theres once shot....................go back in time and travel to that little plannet that is inhabitable called earth............then we could set a handful of animals.......a male and female (adam and eve) then watch creation rebirth.....................sucess the real world was saved but the only problem being that we are a tv show!!!! we are a tv show!!!! we are a tv show!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'
  18. dinokg Registered Senior Member

    Considering what reality tv shows we have now I think something very similar could happen way in the future.

    In a planet circling Alpha Centari it's:

    Survivor: On Another Planet!

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  19. troj Registered Senior Member

    dino king man!!! your in all the alien related convos.

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    not to busy at work either bro??? :bugeye:
  20. dinokg Registered Senior Member

    Well I have been interested in aliens since I was real little.

    So I have alot of alien info that I have read about over the years.

    I have been into aliens,dinosaurs, and all science related things since I was about 8 or so.

    Thats why I like talking about aliens.

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  21. eburacum45 Valued Senior Member

  22. dinokg Registered Senior Member

    Thanks for the link!

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  23. roadkill Registered Senior Member

    Ok, to those who believe that every intelligent race in the universe except us is completely peaceful I offer this thought.

    How many of you are active members of GreenPeace or Earth First? I don't mean giving them a $5 donation back in 1996. I mean blockading whaler boats in a rubber dingy. Walking down city central waving a placard damning the use of tuna nets which trap dolphins.

    The truth is that active environmentalists make up a minority of the population. Business managers who make a living out of raping nature are also a minority but the difference is that they are rich and can afford to hire workforces in the thousands.

    To achieve our level of scientific understanding and technological progress we had to diversify. Our society had to specialise. In the beginning men hunted, women collected berries and there might have been a medicine man or witch doctor. The elders with experience but failing health did the thinking. Now we have to be more diversified in our learning. We need thousands of different technicians and workers to maintain society.

    We have both nature rapers and environmentalists. Why do you think other races will be different?

    Slavery is a good illustration of the ethical implications of biological nature. The similarities between ant slavery and human slavery suggest that in both cases slavery arises as a natural form of social parasitism in which slavemakers exploit their slaves through coercion and manipulation. Just as ant slavery emerges from the coercion of territorial warfare in which the stronger colony enslaves some of the ants of the weaker colony, human slavery can often be traced back to the coercion of war in which victors enslave their captives. And just as ant slavery depends on the manipulation of the slave ants through deceptive communication--the slaves identify the odor of the alien colony as their own--so that they adopt the slavemakers as if they were relatives, human masters promote the false conception of human slavery as a paternalistic relationship in which masters rule over slaves as parents rule over their children.
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2003
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