A God We Know Nothing About

glaucon said:
Bravo!

'nuff said.
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beside..atheists are smarter than normal people in certain methods..but when confronted in debates or with people their size..they always lose.. again because their concept and way of thought is not wrong..but incomplete..letting them go around giving raw cookies to avarage people is poisonous..but we're not ready to assign an expert cook to follow every seller..it's like this:

1-full philosophers (know what they're talking about 99.99%) -very rare-
2- atheists (know enought not to doubt everything) -selected few-
3-avarage people (do as they told and don't think in un practical things too much) - the majaroty-

if you ran a community..what will you do?
 
scifes said:
beside..atheists are smarter than normal people in certain methods..
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The only thing that would correlate "smart" to "atheism" is the decision to not accept the unfounded claims of theists. Beyond that, atheism has no correlation.

1-full philosophers (know what they're talking about 99.99%) -very rare-
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Agreed. A philosopher that actually knows what they're talking about is extremely rare as philosophy is pretty much all BS.
 
(Q) said:
The only thing that would correlate "smart" to "atheism" is the decision to not accept the unfounded claims of theists. Beyond that, atheism has no correlation.


QUOTE]

yes
but atheists should go on with their personal thinking and be fair when it reaches those of theists...they should also not neglect the possibility that although theists don't have a good explanation for their POV..they could still be right..so the atheist explores it on his own giving it a fair part of research and consideration...and not condemn the concept as stupid because the people following it are stupid.
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1-full philosophers (know what they're talking about 99.99%) -very rare-
2- atheists (know enought not to doubt everything) -selected few-
3-avarage people (do as they told and don't think in un practical things too much) - the majaroty-
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Isn't that the same general break down of every population on earth?

Swarm: As an atheist I have to say I don't quite agree with you. Religion served an incredibly valuable purpose for many centuries. Even if now it did not have a purpose in first world countries, that is a relatively recent event (at best) and it will take a long time to kick off a 5000+ year habit.

I think in this day and age with the knowledge we do have, creationism is somewhat idiotic. One has to not only look past but actively deny millions of pieces of collected evidence to agree with the 7 days story. That said, some people far more intelligent than you or myself have been theists.

The world is mystical and phenomenal. That life sprang forth is unthinkable. That it developed to such complexity is the most beautiful thing I can comprehend. If there are not times during your day that you don't sit back and simply soak in the wonder of what is around you then something is drearily wrong. If one chooses to express and enrich this sensation - one that I believe most people have had - through music, worship, meditation, research, camping or whatever other method works for them, in what way is it stupid?

We all operate on a large set of beliefs. If you did not believe hundreds of unproven things you could hardly get through your day. When you wake up in the morning you put your foot down next to the bed. How did you know there wasn't a giant scorpion there? You didn't. But with good reason you believed there was no scorpion. Most of our beliefs come with some degree of reasonability based on previous experience, logic and the laws of nature. Some of the beliefs we operate on are based on very little of any of those three.

Religious belief - at least, that of the non-creationist sort - is just another way that people interpret the marvel and beauty of the universe. Like all other convictions (political, social, ethnic, scientific) it has led to violence. But you wouldn't suggest that all political convictions were stupid and hazardous simply because some of them lead to violence.

Such is life. Don't let it bother you much.
 
swarm said:
Its not condemned because you are stupid. It is condemned beecause it is also stupid in and of itself.
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lool how can you say that..everyone can see that yo're not giving it enough chance of though..but you also seem to lack knowledge about it too..
 
Tyler said:
Isn't that the same general break down of every population on earth?
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yeah so what?
[ As an atheist I have to say I don't quite agree with you. Religion served an incredibly valuable purpose for many centuries. Even if now it did not have a purpose in first world countries, that is a relatively recent event (at best) and it will take a long time to kick off a 5000+ year habit.

I think in this day and age with the knowledge we do have, creationism is somewhat idiotic. One has to not only look past but actively deny millions of pieces of collected evidence to agree with the 7 days story. That said, some people far more intelligent than you or myself have been theists.

The world is mystical and phenomenal. That life sprang forth is unthinkable. That it developed to such complexity is the most beautiful thing I can comprehend. If there are not times during your day that you don't sit back and simply soak in the wonder of what is around you then something is drearily wrong. If one chooses to express and enrich this sensation - one that I believe most people have had - through music, worship, meditation, research, camping or whatever other method works for them, in what way is it stupid?

We all operate on a large set of beliefs. If you did not believe hundreds of unproven things you could hardly get through your day. When you wake up in the morning you put your foot down next to the bed. How did you know there wasn't a giant scorpion there? You didn't. But with good reason you believed there was no scorpion. Most of our beliefs come with some degree of reasonability based on previous experience, logic and the laws of nature. Some of the beliefs we operate on are based on very little of any of those three.

Religious belief - at least, that of the non-creationist sort - is just another way that people interpret the marvel and beauty of the universe. Like all other convictions (political, social, ethnic, scientific) it has led to violence. But you wouldn't suggest that all political convictions were stupid and hazardous simply because some of them lead to violence.

Such is life. Don't let it bother you much.
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niiiice..wht a very peacful and resonable creature..now THATS the atheist i might've been if i didn't hear of islam...

so why am i not atheist??..simply because i had previos knowledge of islam and it fitted extremly well whith all what tylor said..see swarm..if you're going to be an atheist..then at least live peacfully and reasonably like this guy..
 
Tyler said:
Religion served an incredibly valuable purpose for many centuries. Even if now it did not have a purpose in first world countries, that is a relatively recent event (at best) and it will take a long time to kick off a 5000+ year habit.
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God belief has always done much more harm than good. While chance circumstance could have some individual incidents different, overall believing things without evidence is harmful.


Tyler said:
We all operate on a large set of beliefs. If you did not believe hundreds of unproven things you could hardly get through your day. When you wake up in the morning you put your foot down next to the bed. How did you know there wasn't a giant scorpion there? You didn't. But with good reason you believed there was no scorpion. Most of our beliefs come with some degree of reasonability based on previous experience, logic and the laws of nature. Some of the beliefs we operate on are based on very little of any of those three.
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Bullshit.
 
scifes said:
niiiice..wht a very peacful and resonable creature..now THATS the atheist i might've been if i didn't hear of islam...

so why am i not atheist??..simply because i had previos knowledge of islam and it fitted extremly well whith all what tylor said..see swarm..if you're going to be an atheist..then at least live peacfully and reasonably like this guy..
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It is theists who won't live peacefully & reasonably.
 
scifes said:
...they should also not neglect the possibility that although theists don't have a good explanation for their POV..they could still be right..so the atheist explores it on his own giving it a fair part of research and consideration...and not condemn the concept as stupid because the people following it are stupid.
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Theists have had many centuries to demonstrate their position, but have failed at every turn to do so. Scientists have had only decades in comparison but have revealed a tremendous amount of understand as to how the universe works.

Religion has failed, it's time to give up those myths and superstitions that enslave the human mind that forces it to accept that which cannot be demonstrated.
 
Tyler said:
Swarm: As an atheist I have to say I don't quite agree with you. Religion served an incredibly valuable purpose for many centuries.
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That fine, but I'd like to point out that there wasn't any choice before. The places which had brief flowerings of independent thought, like Greece, made huge contributions while when religion was its strongest, like the dark ages, much of what had been known was purposefully destroyed and lost.

I think it no longer has a purpose in first world nations because we finally have a choice.
 
scifes said:
everyone can see that yo're not giving it enough chance of though..but you also seem to lack knowledge about it too..
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Tell you what. You give the worship of Kali a chance and once I see you are a devoted thuggie then I will try islame.
 
(Q) said:
Religion has failed, it's time to give up those myths and superstitions that enslave the human mind that forces it to accept that which cannot be demonstrated.
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like gravity and quantum mechanics?
 
swarm said:
You already said its so you can get down on your knees.
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everyone gets down on his knees..both physically and metaphorally..some do it to pride..some mony..some to ego..some to power..some to logic..some to all these..some to only the good reasons..

some atheists kneel down to logic only if it supports their ego..like a self made dogma..
 
swarm said:
Tell you what. You give the worship of Kali a chance and once I see you are a devoted thuggie then I will try islame.
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you ache my heart.. i feel for you..

if i were you i would think:
"who the hell does this arrogant sheep think he's showing sympathy on?? isn't there a bottom to this guy's patheticness??"

but i just can't seem to make you think as if you were me..
 
God belief has always done much more harm than good. While chance circumstance could have some individual incidents different, overall believing things without evidence is harmful.
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I think you'd be very hard-pressed to prove that. Not only was religion a completely natural development - it's hard to imagine civilization not developing religion of some sort - but it's contributed towards some of the greatest art and achievement in human history. I agree that certain pockets of the developed world are ready to move on and leave it somewhat in the dust, but I don't believe a quick transition is possible or helpful.
Bullshit.
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Well that's an impressive argument. You're certain to win respect and an open mind from theists when you speak with such elegance.
That fine, but I'd like to point out that there wasn't any choice before. The places which had brief flowerings of independent thought, like Greece, made huge contributions while when religion was its strongest, like the dark ages, much of what had been known was purposefully destroyed and lost.

I think it no longer has a purpose in first world nations because we finally have a choice.
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Religion was unbelievably strong in democratic Athens. So strong that the rabble were whipped up enough to slaughter Socrates largely over his questioning of gods. It was not, however, religion that closed off the democracy - rather it was military loss and the cities perceived need for more focus on army and strength.

I'm not suggesting that some cultures may be moving away from religion now. Just that it's foolish to think such a thoroughly ingrained aspect could be removed like a band-aid.
 
Oh, and by the way, you're taking a very Christian, Euro-centric view of world history. The Chinese experienced massive periods of opening up and discovery during some of their most Buddhist phases. The Jews developed intense legalistic traditions through religion, traditions that have largely shaped modern law. Until the 19th century, most of the basis of our great stores of philosophy came from intensely religious individuals.

I do, however, agree that the modern world is only possible under secular government.
 
scifes said:
everyone gets down on his knees..both physically and metaphorally..some do it to pride..some mony..some to ego..some to power..some to logic..some to all these..some to only the good reasons..

some atheists kneel down to logic only if it supports their ego..like a self made dogma..
Click to expand...


scifes said:
you ache my heart.. i feel for you..

if i were you i would think:
"who the hell does this arrogant sheep think he's showing sympathy on?? isn't there a bottom to this guy's patheticness??"

but i just can't seem to make you think as if you were me..
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You are so full of inane absurd crap.
 
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