...DID we go to the moon?

[James R]

Okay, so let's see. Fat Freddy has posted a previously-debunked video that has Buzz Aldrin apparently claiming that we never went to the moon. Is that correct? Freddy posted that after I told him what would happen concerning his posting of previously debunked videos.

Please confirm.

 

[RainbowSingularity]

...

 

[FatFreddy]

Fat Freddy has posted a previously-debunked video that has Buzz Aldrin apparently claiming that we never went to the moon.

I don't remember having seen that video before I posted it. Anyway, I agreed that what he said was probably taken out-of-context intentionally.

You people can pretend all you want. You can consider these anomalies to be debunked but that doesn't make them debunked.
http://www.sciforums.com/threads/did-we-go-to-the-moon.134682/page-2#post-3151173

They're such clear anomalies that there's really nothing you can do to make people think they went to the moon once people have seen them. They haven't been debunked.

It's pretty clear that the great debunkers don't even believe their own arguments. Check out page #2 of this thread.
https://forum.cosmoquest.org/showthread.php?87594-Chinese-space-walk-conspiracy/page2

Check out this one too.
http://www.apollohoax.net/forum/index.php?topic=1118.15

 

[RainbowSingularity]

You people can pretend all you want. You can consider these anomalies to be debunked but that doesn't make them debunked.

so why use the word "de-bunking" ?
when you assign faith and then use science to prove faith is right and do not accept science to prove faith wrong, your not being scientific.
here you have said you already do not beleive in science
yet you use science to try and prove science isn't real, then believe it.

They're such clear anomalies that there's really nothing you can do to make people think they went to the moon once people have seen them

this clearly labels your belief as a religion and not science.
you believe in a religion called "we did not go to the moon"
when in fact you never attempted to go to the moon.
your use of the term "we" is also religious

the religion of "we moon"

 

[billvon]

You people can pretend all you want. You can consider these anomalies to be debunked but that doesn't make them debunked.

Debunking something actually does make it debunked. It's the definition of the word.

They're such clear anomalies that there's really nothing you can do to make people think they went to the moon once people have seen them. They haven't been debunked.

I have seen them. They have been debunked. I still know we went to the moon.

 

[sideshowbob]

There used to be a guy here (I think it was on this site) who called people "pseudo-debunkers". Anybody remember him?

 

[dumbest man on earth]

Not sure of the use of the word "we" in " did we go to the moon", but if the use of "we" includes me, then No, "we" did not go to the moon!

However, I am fairly certain that a few people have went to the moon!

But I would say "they" went to the moon, not "we" because I, myself, did not get to go!
...no one even asked if I wanted to go!

I do not offer the following as any definitive determination or "proof" that "they" went to the moon, but I have been party, on numerous occasions, to active Lunar Laser Ranging utilizing three(3) of the five(5) different retro-reflectors that were placed on the moon during the Apollo Program.
Cannot figure how those retro-reflectors got on the moon if "they", or in your vernacular, "we", did not put them there!

 

[James R]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but does Fat Freddy believe that no robot vehicles have gone to the moon as well, or is it just the human missions that he believes were faked?

It would be good if Freddy could clarify for us just what he believes are the limits of human ability to send things into space. Can we get to orbit? Are satellites real? If so, are we capable of sending something to the moon? Have we ever sent anything there? What about Mars? What about the Voyager spacecraft? Are any of those real?

Is it just human spaceflight that's disputed? Can people go to the International Space Station (if it's real)? Can people orbit the Earth? Could people, in principle, go to the moon if we wanted to send them there - if not using 1960s technology, then today's technology?

Do you think the Chinese will be faking it if they claim to be sending people to the moon in the near future?

Actually, come to think of it, it's interesting to contemplate how much more difficult it will be for you moon-conspiracists to keep up the pretence once people do start going back to the moon. Do you think you'll feel like a bit of an idiot at the end of the day? Or do you think you'll keep denying the obvious, like the Flat Earthers?

I look forward to your reply, Freddy.

 

[RainbowSingularity]

like the Flat Earthers?

that is one of the biggest problems with semi-subversive-subconscious monothiesm religious indoctrination as a nurture process.
it creates a breeding ground for cultist type belief systems.

the water or oil concept of compulsory moral value tends to create extremism.

 

[exchemist]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but does Fat Freddy believe that no robot vehicles have gone to the moon as well, or is it just the human missions that he believes were faked?

It would be good if Freddy could clarify for us just what he believes are the limits of human ability to send things into space. Can we get to orbit? Are satellites real? If so, are we capable of sending something to the moon? Have we ever sent anything there? What about Mars? What about the Voyager spacecraft? Are any of those real?

Is it just human spaceflight that's disputed? Can people go to the International Space Station (if it's real)? Can people orbit the Earth? Could people, in principle, go to the moon if we wanted to send them there - if not using 1960s technology, then today's technology?

Do you think the Chinese will be faking it if they claim to be sending people to the moon in the near future?

Actually, come to think of it, it's interesting to contemplate how much more difficult it will be for you moon-conspiracists to keep up the pretence once people do start going back to the moon. Do you think you'll feel like a bit of an idiot at the end of the day? Or do you think you'll keep denying the obvious, like the Flat Earthers?

I look forward to your reply, Freddy.

To be honest, I find all these questions a bit naive. They seem to assume Fat Freddie posts in good faith, i.e. actually believes in all this horsesh*t.

To me, by far the most plausible explanation of the "Fat Freddie" phenomenon is that it is all a troll game, to keep people annoying people and getting them to waste time responding. We have after all seen similar phenomena on other topics, with other posters, over the years.

But then again, I have to admit it is also possible that the responders also quite enjoy the game of knocking over each little pile of bricks presented by "Fat Freddie" for their attention.

 

[Michael 345]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but does Fat Freddy believe that no robot vehicles have gone to the moon as well, or is it just the human missions that he believes were faked?

Along the same lines I have questioned if the next set of fake moon landings will correct the defects in the first set

ie put a crater under the lander and pepper the background with stars

 

[FatFreddy]

I do not offer the following as any definitive determination or "proof" that "they" went to the moon, but I have been party, on numerous occasions, to active Lunar Laser Ranging utilizing three(3) of the five(5) different retro-reflectors that were placed on the moon during the Apollo Program.

I dealt with this issue in post #72.
http://www.sciforums.com/threads/did-we-go-to-the-moon.134682/page-4#post-3154916

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but does Fat Freddy believe that no robot vehicles have gone to the moon as well, or is it just the human missions that he believes were faked?

I wouldn't be surprised if a robot has been sent to the moon.

It would be good if Freddy could clarify for us just what he believes are the limits of human ability to send things into space. Can we get to orbit? Are satellites real? If so, are we capable of sending something to the moon? Have we ever sent anything there? What about Mars? What about the Voyager spacecraft? Are any of those real?

I believe that a lot of unmanned stuff has been sent beyond the Van Allen belts*.

Is it just human spaceflight that's disputed? Can people go to the International Space Station (if it's real)? Can people orbit the Earth? Could people, in principle, go to the moon if we wanted to send them there - if not using 1960s technology, then today's technology?

The theory is that humans can go up until they reach the beginning of the Van Allen belts. Beyond that they need two meters of lead to protect them. I'm not in a position to verify this as it's all second hand info but it fits the scenario of the Apollo missions' having been faked but a lot of real stuff happening too such as sending people into low earth orbit.

Do you think the Chinese will be faking it if they claim to be sending people to the moon in the near future?

They faked their spacewalk so nothing they say should be taken seriously.

Actually, come to think of it, it's interesting to contemplate how much more difficult it will be for you moon-conspiracists to keep up the pretence once people do start going back to the moon. Do you think you'll feel like a bit of an idiot at the end of the day? Or do you think you'll keep denying the obvious, like the Flat Earthers?

You're assuming they're going to start going back. Let's wait and see if something actually happens.


*
http://www.apollohoax.net/forum/index.php?topic=1147.0

 

[RainbowSingularity]

The theory is that humans can go up until they reach the beginning of the Van Allen belts.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jillia...allen-belts-barrier-spaceflight/#3f5fb7eb6f8d

In the case of the Apollo missions, the solution was to minimize the second two factors. We can’t control the energy of those particles, though they can be large. The density of the Van Allen belts is well known (from sending uncrewed probes through them), and there are hotspots you can definitely avoid. In particular, the innermost belt is a rather tightly defined region, and it was possible to stay out of it for the trip to the Moon. The second belt is much larger, and harder to avoid, but there are still denser regions to avoid. For the Apollo trips, we wanted to send the astronauts through a sparse region of the belts, and to try and get through them quickly. This was necessary in any case; the crafts had to make it to the Moon in a reasonable amount of time, and the shorter the trip, the less exposure to all sorts of radiation the astronauts would get.
In the end, it seemed that these tactics worked; the on-board dose counters for the Apollo missions registered average radiation doses to the skin of the astronauts of 0.38 rad. This is about the same radiation dose as getting two CT scans of your head, or half the dose of a single chest CT scan; not too bad, though not something you should do every week.

 

[dumbest man on earth]

I do not offer the following as any definitive determination or "proof" that "they" went to the moon, but I have been party, on numerous occasions, to active Lunar Laser Ranging utilizing three(3) of the five(5) different retro-reflectors that were placed on the moon during the Apollo Program.
Cannot figure how those retro-reflectors got on the moon if "they", or in your vernacular, "we", did not put them there!

I dealt with this issue in post #72.
http://www.sciforums.com/threads/did-we-go-to-the-moon.134682/page-4#post-3154916

I can only reiterate, I did not offer the anecdote as any definitive determination or "proof" that "they", or in your vernacular, "we", went to the moon...

 

[David C]

Fatfreddy88 and his off forum ramblings:-

Here's a post I just made that might get deleted or edited or get me banned. As of now it's post #223 on page #12 of this thread.
http://www.sciforums.com/threads/did...e-moon.134682/

Let's see what the moderator does.

Originally Posted by James R, post: 3580686, member: 4402
Fat Freddy has posted a previously-debunked video that has Buzz Aldrin apparently claiming that we never went to the moon.
I don't remember having seen that video before I posted it. Anyway, I agreed that what he said was probably taken out-of-context intentionally.

You people can pretend all you want. You can consider these anomalies to be debunked but that doesn't make them debunked.
http://www.sciforums.com/threads/did-we-go-to-the-moon.134682/page-2#post-3151173

They're such clear anomalies that there's really nothing you can do to make people think they went to the moon once people have seen them. They haven't been debunked.

It's pretty clear that the great debunkers don't even believe their own arguments. Check out page #2 of this thread.
https://forum.cosmoquest.org/showthr...nspiracy/page2

Check out this one too.
http://www.apollohoax.net/forum/index.php?topic=1118.15

That is one sad individual. What on Earth motivates this bloke. Crazy.

 

[billvon]

The theory is that humans can go up until they reach the beginning of the Van Allen belts. Beyond that they need two meters of lead to protect them. I'm not in a position to verify this as it's all second hand info but it fits the scenario of the Apollo missions' having been faked but a lot of real stuff happening too such as sending people into low earth orbit.

The Van Allen belts start at 400 miles. Are you now going to claim that the Gemini flights were faked as well? Or that they had "two meters" of lead?

At this point you are more amusing than anything else.

 

[sideshowbob]

You're assuming they're going to start going back. Let's wait and see if something actually happens.

They're still working on developing a flutter-proof flag.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

There used to be a guy here (I think it was on this site) who called people "pseudo-debunkers". Anybody remember him?

Maybe the guy that started the faux SCICOP site?

 

[FatFreddy]

The Van Allen belts start at 400 miles. Are you now going to claim that the Gemini flights were faked as well? Or that they had "two meters" of lead?

I think it's quite possible that they lied about the altitude of the Gemini flights. Why are you so quick to believe the official story?

 

[Michael 345]

I think one day we will truly truly go to the Moon

To shield the space travelers from the Van Allen belts we will coat the outside of the capsule with moon hoaxers

Nothing will get through them