how peaceful is islam ?

[Muslim]

MAFKARNA again!
Try the BLOODY bombings in India or in Kashmir, by Islamists 'every so often' , "enlightened" "truthful" RADICAL "peaceful-holy" MUSLIM!
Or maybe you want to talk about the 15,000,000 (!!!) Hindu victims (so they claim) by Radical Muslims in recent history?

Those are terrorists, they do the same bombs in Pakistan. In Karachi they did those bombings too. Also, the Indian army occupies and gives brutal treatment to many living in India controlled Kashmir. If Jasmin's voted they would want to be separate from India. Also, Hindu extremists killed many 100 of Muslims In Gujarat, they also killed many Sikhs in operation bluestar. Bad people existed in all socoites.

 

[GeoffP]

All other divisions like Bahi, Ahmadiya (Qadiani), Yazidi, Ibadi, Nation of Islam are all deemed as not Muslim because they do not believe in the one true Allah (swt) and do not accept the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s) as the last messenger of Allah (swt)

Smells of exculpation to me. Isn't this the same excuse given for the persecution of these groups in islamic nations?

Geoff

 

[(Q)]

Different Islamic groups have different ways of interpreting shariah, but they interprete the Quran the exact same way. The Quran is plain and easy to understand, so there is little difference on Quran. It is the Sunnah and hadiths which are different and forms the basis of differences among the various groups.

The Sunni are based on the Sunnah, which are the practices and actions of the Holy Prophet (s) as observed by early Muslims. Their books are the Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Tirmizi, etc.

The Shiat are the followers (of Ali), they base their beliefs of Imams loyal only to Hazrat Ali during the dispute of the the assassination of Hazrat Usman. They don't believe alot of the books of Sunnah which Sunni believe in, but they essentially have the same view of the Quran and also same basic beliefs, notably the seven principles of faith and five pillars of Islam.

Sufi is not a division in Islam because they believe in Quran and Sunnah the exact same way Sunnis do. The Sufi are known mainly as religious Sunni monks who believe that one's life should be mainly spent in worshipping Allah (swt) in solitude from the worldly life. Sufi's believe in the Sunni scholars and have their own personal religious teachers.

Wahabbi, Salafism are different in that they believe mainly in the teachings of a few of the early scholars and reject some of them. Their division is based on the teachings of Sheikh Abdullah Abdul-Wahhab, who emphasized a different approach to return of Islam by emphasizing resistance to biddat (innovation). They are still Sunni.

All other divisions like Bahi, Ahmadiya (Qadiani), Yazidi, Ibadi, Nation of Islam are all deemed as not Muslim because they do not believe in the one true Allah (swt) and do not accept the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s) as the last messenger of Allah (swt)

Peace.

So, like most other religions, Islam has many flavors based on each persons individual interpretation. And they carry on much the same way by fighting amongst each other claiming their version of Allah can beat up the others version. Sure, they might share some basic beliefs but like all other religions, they just can't come to an agreement on a single set of beliefs.

And here you are, like most other theists, claiming your version of god is the ultimate and no other can come close. You spread propaganda, lies and deceit "by any means necessary" to get your point across, all the while ignoring and even denying the barbaric atrocities your religion and their leaders have plagued mankind with over the centuries and who continue to do today.

 

[Ritri5432]

Those are terrorists, they do the same bombs in Pakistan. In Karachi they did those bombings too. Also, the Indian army occupies and gives brutal treatment to many living in India controlled Kashmir. If Jasmin's voted they would want to be separate from India. Also, Hindu extremists killed many 100 of Muslims In Gujarat, they also killed many Sikhs in operation bluestar. Bad people existed in all socoites.

But who uses religion to kill ("allah hu akbar") ?
Radical Islamists only!

 

[DiamondHearts]

But who uses religion to kill ("allah hu akbar") ?
Radical Islamists only!

Suprising coming from a Jewish Zionist, who are responsible for the systematic genocide of Palestinian Muslim and Christians.

Maybe once you stop supporting occupying other's land by some 'inherent right' in the bible, Muslims will not be so eager to kill Zionists to avenge their fellow people being massacred by Zionists.

And here you are, like most other theists, claiming your version of god is the ultimate and no other can come close. You spread propaganda, lies and deceit "by any means necessary" to get your point across, all the while ignoring and even denying the barbaric atrocities your religion and their leaders have plagued mankind with over the centuries and who continue to do today.

Wrong, all the Muslim groups I mentioned are in total agreement on the Quran and even a majority of traditions. Like I said, we believe in the same God, same last Prophet (s). There is no dissagreement between us on this, the only major difference is based on the political system. Sunni Muslims (which includes Sufi and Wahhabi) believe that a concensus among the people on who rules in necessary for leaders, while Shiat believe only the descendants of the Holy Prophet (s) can be rulers.

I promote belief and propagation of Islam based on honesty and reason.

I promote alleviation of oppression and the upholding of justice by any means necessary.

Islam has furthered the conscience of mankind, unlike the West we had our renaissance during the time of the Prophet (s) and we developed our beliefs based around Allah's law. Allah (s) elevated us. From weakness and disunity, He gave us strength and power. We defeated and freed the citizens of the oppressive and unjust rulers of the Romans and Persians and brought justice for all people.

Your renaissance thinkers and intellectuals were the students of Muslim scholars. It's time you recognize who and what brought you out of the dark ages. It was the Muslims and their vast knowledge and respect for other beliefs.

So next time you try to say we are backwards, remember, it was the Muslims which guided the West out of its barbarity. We have a positive and respectful culture which we hold sacred. We honor our parents, respect the elderly, love our children, and treat other people as human beings. Most importantly we love and adore God, something which will bring people together and create brotherhood and good will toward people. These things are not practiced in the West, so don't tell me about who is barbaric.

It is the West which engages in barbarity under the slogan the war on terror to civilize the most noble and respectful human beings on earth, the Muslims. The freedom and democracy they bring, is nothing but a future of more tyrants and dictators loyal to the west. Your culture cannot help us, it can only corrupt us. We tell you we respect you as human beings, but you must learn to respect others if you want us to look favorably upon you.

The age when western hegemony extends into the South America countries, Cental Asia, Africa, Southeast Asia, and Eastern Europe is over. You might have tried your hardest to subdue our brethren, but when you invaded the Middle East you will feel the wrath of a people who refuse to be conquered. A people who believe firmly in their Prophet Muhammad (s), who said, it is better to die a martyr than be conquered and enslaved.

Allahu Akbar.

 

[spidergoat]

Shalom alaikum,
Fortunately most muslims are smarter than you. Muslims lost their edge in science and reason a thousand years ago.

 

[(Q)]

Muslims will not be so eager to kill Zionists to avenge their fellow people being massacred by Zionists.

Muslims will simply find someone else to kill, as it is the right of every Muslim to do so.

Sunni Muslims (which includes Sufi and Wahhabi) believe that a concensus among the people on who rules in necessary for leaders, while Shiat believe only the descendants of the Holy Prophet (s) can be rulers.

In other words, they disagree. That's what I said, numbnuts.

I promote belief and propagation of Islam based on honesty and reason.

I promote alleviation of oppression and the upholding of justice by any means necessary.

You are a boldface liar, other than the fact you will do whatever you want by any means necessary, that part is true.

Islam has furthered the conscience of mankind, unlike the West we had our renaissance during the time of the Prophet (s) and we developed our beliefs based around Allah's law. Allah (s) elevated us. From weakness and disunity, He gave us strength and power. We defeated and freed the citizens of the oppressive and unjust rulers of the Romans and Persians and brought justice for all people.

What a load of crap.

Your renaissance thinkers and intellectuals were the students of Muslim scholars. It's time you recognize who and what brought you out of the dark ages. It was the Muslims and their vast knowledge and respect for other beliefs.

Islam is very embodiment of the dark ages. You will always remain there.

So next time you try to say we are backwards, remember, it was the Muslims which guided the West out of its barbarity. We have a positive and respectful culture which we hold sacred. We honor our parents, respect the elderly, love our children, and treat other people as human beings. Most importantly we love and adore God, something which will bring people together and create brotherhood and good will toward people. These things are not practiced in the West, so don't tell me about who is barbaric.

Muslims did no such thing. Are there no lies you won't tell?

A people who believe firmly in their Prophet Muhammad (s), who said, it is better to die a martyr than be conquered and enslaved.

As has been in the past, the present and will be the in the future, you will always look for ways to murder and die for your barbaric religion and your god, forever tormenting mankind.

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

Muslims will simply find someone else to kill,

as will Americans

Americans have done more killing than anyone else this and last century! WAR WAR WAR WAR WAR WAR or am I worng, whats the death toll on Americas hands?

 

[GeoffP]

Maybe once you stop supporting occupying other's land by some 'inherent right' in the bible, Muslims will not be so eager to kill Zionists to avenge their fellow people being massacred by Zionists.

But the killing of "kufr" by muslims extends far earlier than that - the helpless communities of the Armenians were massacred by Turkish muslims from 1908-1920. What crime had they committed? What crime have any of the "kufr" under muslim domination committed, apart from not being muslims?

I promote belief and propagation of Islam based on honesty and reason.

And when reason fails its propagation, and honesty is unrooted in certainty? What then?

I promote alleviation of oppression and the upholding of justice by any means necessary.

Then we can agree, at least, that the vile concept of dhimmitude has no place in islamic society or in sharia.

Islam has furthered the conscience of mankind

How?

We defeated and freed the citizens of the oppressive and unjust rulers of the Romans and Persians and brought justice for all people.

Except the conquered.

It's time you recognize who and what brought you out of the dark ages. It was the Muslims and their vast knowledge and respect for other beliefs.

Amply demonstrated by massacre in Spain, Anatolia, and North Africa.

So next time you try to say we are backwards, remember, it was the Muslims which guided the West out of its barbarity. We have a positive and respectful culture which we hold sacred. We honor our parents, respect the elderly, love our children, and treat other people as human beings.[/quote]

Excepting women, non-muslims, apostates and homosexuals.

It is the West which engages in barbarity under the slogan the war on terror to civilize the most noble and respectful human beings on earth, the Muslims.

/sarc Well at least that last bit wasn't a pile of supremacist hogwash. /sarc off

That nobility is evident with every hostage decapitated, every civil war, every gobbet of vitriol, every burnt embassy and every oppressed minority.

Don't let it go to your head, now.

A people who believe firmly in their Prophet Muhammad (s), who said, it is better to die a martyr than be conquered and enslaved.

...so now slavery is a bad thing again? Before, though, I think you implied that it was a good thing. But now it's bad? Or did you mean only islamic slavery is good - you know, because you're muslim and all.

Me, I don't agree with slavery for anyone. Not everybody feels the way I do, of course.

Allahu Akbar.

I think the cry of the oppressor says it all.

Geoff

 

[leopold]

All other divisions like Bahi, Ahmadiya (Qadiani), Yazidi, Ibadi, Nation of Islam are all deemed as not Muslim because they do not believe in the one true Allah (swt) and do not accept the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s) as the last messenger of Allah (swt)

Peace.

can you give me some background info on the nation of islam?
and what does the (swt) stand for

 

[leopold]

whats the death toll on Americas hands?

it all depends, are you talking war deaths or deaths by other means?

if you are talking about war deaths then those deaths are on the hands who started the war

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

it all depends, are you talking war deaths or deaths by other means?

if you are talking about war deaths then those deaths are on the hands who started the war

Come on now, you're cleverer than that!
1)You don't need a sledgehammer to
crack a nut.
2)You also know they would never involve themselves in any war if there wasn't self interest and something to gain,
3) you should also know that they are not beyond manufacturing/inciting others to attack them in order that they can fulfill their aim of destroying them...again for gain.

Why do you think they have launched this propoganda assault on the Arab muslim world...they want you all to turn a blind eye while they commit their crimes.

Small example: Iraq, who started that war? George Bush American, every American/English/Iraq and very other nation involved loss of life and blood is on his hands. War criminal and mass murderer.

Atomic bombs? legacy of that?

 

[leopold]

come on now, you're cleverer than that! You don't need a sledgehammer to
crack a nut.

Small example: Iraq, who started that war? George Bush American, every American/English/Iraq and very other nation involved loss of life is on his hands. War criminal and mass murderer.

Atomic bombs? legacy of that?

i'll give you iraq

the atomic bomb is another matter
japan shouldn't have taken a bite of something she couldn't handle
but we are getting off topic here

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

i'll give you iraq

the atomic bomb is another matter
japan shouldn't have taken a bite of something she couldn't handle
but we are getting off topic here

re your above comment about atomic bomb, precisely what I meant by you don't need a sledgehammer to crack a nut, heavy handed mass murderers...and the mass murder continues disguised as self defense.

copied from another thread:

Brian Foley said in reply to Mountainhare
No Gods No Masters (1,621 posts) 03-12-06, 08:30 AM
report | reply
“ Originally Posted by mountainhare
It's funny how whenever you mention the Vietnam War to an American, they stress that it wasn't a WAR, it was just a 'conflict'. As if they are indirectly implying that the mighty U.S.A didn't lose a war... just a conflict. ”

It wasnt a conflict nor a war , the Vietnam tragedy was an attack deliberately manufactured by the US establishment for the finacial benefit of the US military-industrial complex . The arms demand by the US military tripled the hardware orders to this military-industrial complex . The operation lasted some 10 years , at no time were the American military threatened with defeat by the Vietnamese . This "war" was deliberately initiated by the Gulf of Tonkin incident which has been proven to of never happened . The rest was history , 5 million dead Vietnamese and some 55,000 dead americans but the US military-industrial complex made a whopping several hundred billion $$$$$ profit . "


It's on topic when we are talking of the pots calling the kettle black.

America hasn't been around as long as the arab world yet they've achieved a lot of death and destruction in the brief time they have been around...now thats an achievement and they will bring about the start of the third world war if we have one...and the rest of the world lets them.

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

In fact if you look at the death toll and average it out over the time each has been in existance, Americans are top of mass death list.

The world is waking up to America and it doesn't much like what it sees.

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

Islamic Justice

If the son desires to have the man killed in vengence, that is his right.

However, Allah (swt) says in the Quran that it would be better for him to forgive.

.

This is a good example of HOW far men have stretched from the words of 'Allah' There is a BIG difference between forgiveness and retaliation in kind....BIG BIG BIG.

This in itself is evidence that the word of 'Allah' means very little in Shariah law.

This is the problem with shariah law Diamond Heart, people unfamilair with the Qu'ran and the teachings think that the law reflects it and it blatantly does not as the above example aptly shows. So they think Allah is unpeaceful war God and that the teachings of Islam are blood thirsty.

Note. Before every Christian jumps on the badwagon here, Christians also twist the words of God to suit themselves as your 'God' also says thou shall not kill and forgive etc, but much blood has been shed in name of Christianity too.

The problem here is not religion it is MEN.

 

[GeoffP]

The problem here is not religion it is MEN.

But only one of the two religions you mentioned has a direct rejoinder to do war - physical war, complete with killing, pillage and rape - in the name of religion.

Can you guess which one?

Geoff

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

But only one of the two religions you mentioned has a direct rejoinder to do war - physical war, complete with killing, pillage and rape - in the name of religion.

Can you guess which one?

Geoff

So which religion has declared war and whom have they declared war on?

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

I know that a bunch of muslims are doing some bad stuff as have thousands of Christians before them in name of religion.

Now America does bad stuff in name of money. Money is Americas God.

 

[spuriousmonkey]

Has anyone read about all the commotion about the converted christian (from islam) in afghanistan which could be executed from having converted from islam to christianity. wow..that sentence sucked.

Don't stop there I would say. Execute all theists, not just the converted ones.