You mean the most glaring drawback? Simple. All geological evidence show an absence of high pressure at the surface of Earth during its whole existence.
Is the earth expanding?
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You mean the most glaring drawback? Simple. All geological evidence show an absence of high pressure at the surface of Earth during its whole existence.
Well I can't disprove that at the moment as I am not conversant in all things geological, but I'll keep that thought in the back of my mind, and continue looking for evidence to refute this.
Thanks.
Well I can't disprove that at the moment as I am not conversant in all things geological, but I'll keep that thought in the back of my mind, and continue looking for evidence to refute this.
Thanks.
You're welcome
Just one quick clarification. The phrase "during its whole existence" does that mean at any time during its existence? For it certainly hasn't been under pressure for the whole of its existence has it!
At any time during the last 4.5 Billion years the Earth has shown no evidence of ever being under pressures, over the entire globe, sufficient to cause compression to account for a significant size reduction of the Terrestrial part.
Does that sum up the challenge?
At any time during the last 4.5 Billion years the surface of Earth has shown no evidence of ever being under pressures, over the entire globe, sufficient to cause compression to account for a significant size reduction of the Terrestrial part.
By surface we are talking Continental crust.
Because no part of the Oceanic crust is more than 200 million years old, we must look for the evidence of this in the Continental crust. Using Wikipedia as a source of definitions:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithosphere#Earth.27s_lithosphere
Earth's lithosphere
In the earth the lithosphere includes the crust and the uppermost mantle, which constitute the hard and rigid outer layer of the Earth. The lithosphere is underlain by the asthenosphere, the weaker, hotter, and deeper part of the upper mantle. The boundary between the lithosphere and the underlying asthenosphere is defined by a difference in response to stress: the lithosphere remains rigid for very long periods of geologic time in which it deforms elastically and through brittle failure, while the asthenosphere deforms viscously and accommodates strain through plastic deformation. The lithosphere is broken into tectonic plates. …..
There are two types of lithosphere:
• Oceanic lithosphere, which is associated with Oceanic crust and exists in the ocean basins
• Continental lithosphere, which is associated with Continental crust
The thickness of the lithosphere is considered to be the depth to the isotherm associated with the transition between brittle and viscous behavior.[6] The temperature at which olivine begins to deform viscously (~1000°C) is often used to set this isotherm because olivine is generally the weakest mineral in the upper mantle. Oceanic lithosphere is typically about 50–100 km thick (but beneath the mid-ocean ridges is no thicker than the crust), while continental lithosphere has a range in thickness from about 40 km to perhaps 200 km; the upper ~30 to ~50 km of typical continental lithosphere is crust. The mantle part of the lithosphere consists largely of peridotite. The crust is distinguished from the upper mantle by the change in chemical composition that takes place at the Moho discontinuity.
What is the oldest ophiolite material found?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oceanic_crust
In section on “Oceanic Crust”
“Estimations of composition are based on analyses of ophiolites (sections of oceanic crust that are preserved on the continents)”
Now if the Earth has never been covered with large oceans of volatiles, and there have always been ocean floors, at sometime in the long distant past there ought to be ancient ophioltes found on the continents, brought there during say a large meteor impact or seafloor volanic eruption.
So that will be my first line of enquiry. What is the oldest ophiolite material found?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oceanic_crust
In section on “Oceanic Crust”
“Estimations of composition are based on analyses of ophiolites (sections of oceanic crust that are preserved on the continents)”
Now if the Earth has never been covered with large oceans of volatiles, and there have always been ocean floors, at sometime in the long distant past there ought to be ancient ophioltes found on the continents, brought there during say a large meteor impact or seafloor volanic eruption.
So that will be my first line of enquiry. What is the oldest ophiolite material found?
We're talking crust that was exposed at the time, continental or oceanic.
And yes, there was oceanic crust before 200 millions years as proven by billions years old ophiolites.
Can you prove these old ophiolites were once on the sea floor and not just associated with a mountain ridge fault zone?
Have you got any internet references please?
Gneiss2011
Registered Senior Member
If you ask this question, then you don't know what are ophiolites. Learn what they are, their characteristics, then we can discuss
Reality can be ironic.
Gneiss2011
Registered Senior Member
Indeed.
Side note: post rationalskepticism.org/pseudoscience/expanding-earth-do-the-continents-wind-back-to-a-sphere-t8539-2120.html#p1082594 is amazing.
In my theory no matter is added other than space junk that falls to earth (Space dust , meteors , Solar Flare particles??, comet dust.) which in the scheme of things lately has been minimal but it would not have been so in the Early Earth period. So there must have been an exponential decline with time.
We certainly aren’t going to discuss the magical appearance of more mass.
Now what I am getting is doubts about just a straight mechanical compression of the Earth. For if that was the case the lithosphere would have needed to be compressed as well. You can’t say that the centre of the Earth was made 4 times as dense without increasing the density of the Lithosphere as well. Now it was established that liquids like water might not be able to be compressed to an ever increasing density, but what about the lithosphere? What is it's compressibility? Certainly the metal cores can be compressed and even made degenerate with enough pressure.
So what I am thinking is we have to detail a chain of events where the lithosphere appears as the pressure is coming off. But the core material can't rebound till it is further heated so the rebound is far delayed after the pressure removal.
So once the core expands the skin had already expanded and was stable. So it reflects the size of compressed core/magma with out the Lithosphere still being compressed itself.
Now that could be quite challenging to show evidence for this.
So what I am thinking is we have to detail a chain of events where the lithosphere appears as the pressure is coming off. But the core material can't rebound till it is further heated so the rebound is far delayed after the pressure removal.
So once the core expands the skin had already expanded and was stable. So it reflects the size of compressed core/magma with out the Lithosphere still being compressed itself.
Now that could be quite challenging to show evidence for this.
I am thinking this could happen if the core magma "froze" as the heat required to boil off the 27 earth masses of volatiles removed too much heat from the core so once the pressure come of it has taken time to reheat and re-expand. Now this takes a bit of thinking to see if any of this is possible. But the core of the Earth would have needed to be very hot and stable to allow the separation of the lithosphere minerals. If there had been strong mixing within itself the separation may not have happened.
Now we are talking of time ranges 4.7 - 3.7 billion years ago.
Now we are talking of time ranges 4.7 - 3.7 billion years ago.
You just keep trying one bullshit idea after another at random.
Have you got the experience in Earth building to come up with a better concept?
How do you tie up the availability of material in the protoplanetary disc with the separation of the lithosphere from the rest, remove the masses of volatiles and cause delayed Earth Expansion? It takes a bit of BS thinking, but then let's test the idea. Can it happen? Do the Hawking Black Holes just explode back to size once their massiveness reduced? No it takes time and energy to re-inflate a black hole. Does degenerate material just pop back up? No it takes time and energy to reverse this too. So why not the core of the Earth if it had been compressed and cooled at some stage?
rogerharris
Registered Senior Member
It just occured to me how complex this problem is today. I sat down and wrote a list of all the major mechanisms proposed so far that still have some aspect left standing and there were about .....12 !! On my other PC thankfully.
but bits from some work, and bits dont. Its a pretty complex system and a lot is not understood.
The way i see it is aggregate all the part of the complexity and perhaps something might integrate.
Now im going to throw in another part to the pot.
There are a lot of current attempts to try and unify gravity with EMF force...
e.g. (dont take this as a representation of this, just whats on my browser right now)
http://www.kokus.net/magnetism
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJxs7dCpq9k&feature=related
One thing thats interesting is florian points out mcCarthys work on the asymmetry of expansion at the south tilted of the axis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAlDFetGS0E&feature=player_embedded
interestingly the south pole magnetic force diverges at tilt..
so the magnetic south force is asymmetric anyway with an outward push force. Most of the spreading is occurring as an asymmetric south push.
If the magnetic force and gravity are unified then perhaps this snippet might contribute to the asymmetry in a magnetohydroynamic EE model, that involves thermodynamics and who knows what else, nuclear aspects, reaction diffusion of hydrogen etc etc...
It would be great to lay all this stuff and see if any of it integrates well. Any final solution is going to have to integrate all these various aspects of earth sciences at the end of the day anyway.
Just another bit of divergent ramblings to dump into the mix....but who knows..:shrug:
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@rogerharris
Would you care to list those 12 "major mechanisms proposed so far that still have some aspect left standing"
Just so I can tell what you are thinking.
Would you care to list those 12 "major mechanisms proposed so far that still have some aspect left standing"
Just so I can tell what you are thinking.