Originally posted by Medicine*Woman
M*W: The "serpent" was a symbol of wisdom and healing. Also, the "serpent" represents god in some cultures. So, the "serpent" does symbolize Jesus. Jenyar, it's just the xians who disassociate the "serpent" from Jesus because they added the "negativity" to the symbol.
Its original connotations come from the Hebrew Bible, not from the Christians. Christians merely continued the development of meaning that already started in Genesis. It is interesting that the Jews had already formed a concept of salvation by association with the serpent. The serpent represents knowledge or shrewdness, which is neither "good" nor "bad", until it is used for good or bad.
"According to the Rabbis, Nahash must be identified with Jesse, who was called 'Nahash' [serpent] because, being himself sinless, he died in fulfilment of the sentence of death upon all humanity consequent upon the temptation of the serpent (Shab. 55b)"
- JewishEncyclopedia:
serpent
Jewish legend regarded the serpent as being selected by Satan as his tool because of its cunning nature. (And Satan spoke to the serpent: "Be my instrument, and through thy mouth will I utter a word which shall enable thee to seduce man").
The negativity associated with the serpent lies in the deception of Adam and Eve, not in the image itself.
M*W: "Repentance" means "reimbursing" the body with the One Spirit of God. Jesus called "sinners" (those whose spirit has vacated) to "repent" or to "receive the One Spirit of God" within them.
You are, as always, halfway there. But what does it mean to receive God's Spirit? Will He give it to anyone?
The full meaning of repentance, according to Jewish doctrine, is clearly indicated in the term "teshubah" (lit. "
return"; from the verb). This implies:
(1) All transgression and sin are the natural and inevitable consequence of man's straying from God and His laws.
(2) It is man's destiny, and therefore his duty, to be with God as God is with him.
(3) It is within the power of every man to redeem himself from sin by resolutely breaking away from it and turning to God, whose loving-kindness is ever extended to the returning sinner. "Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon" (Isa. 4:7).
(4) Because "there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not" (Eccl. 7:20; I Kings 8:46), every mortal stands in need of this insistence on his "
return" to God.
- JewishEncyclopedia:
repentance (where they also say there is no repentance after death, when you will have to accept God's judgment on your life.)
M*W: Your connotation of "God" is misleading. The One Spirit of God, or pure positive energy, didn't "keep people in line" per se, but with the inclusion of the One Spirit of God (energy) they were able to visualize peace, cameraderie, unity, etc. "Keeping them in line" did not mean to "correct them." It was not "God" who kept the people in line, it was the people who more or less "kept God in line." No, you're right, you cannot "make someone accept" the One Spirit of God = positive energy = eternal life = energy that never dies. These folks will still have a vacuum or worse negativity.
God frequently asks Israel to return to Him, and comments on their stubborness because they don't listen.
Jeremiah 4
1 "If you will return, O Israel,
return to me,"
declares the LORD.
"If you put your detestable idols out of my sight
and no longer go astray,
2 and if in a truthful, just and righteous way
you swear, 'As surely as the LORD lives,' [which is a declaration of faith]
then the nations will be blessed by him
and in him they will glory."
Jeremiah 13:11
For as a belt is bound around a man's waist, so I bound the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah to me,' declares the LORD , 'to be my people for my renown and praise and honor.
But they have not listened.'
Keeping them in line meant giving them laws that represented God's authority. But they could not folow them. When they visizualized peace, cameraderie and unity it always came out in prophecy. Prophecy about the coming messiah. Why do you think is that? Nobody ever reaches that state by themseves. It is only by God's grace that it can ever happen. The result of this peace is recognizing God, not the other way around. So you see, God made it possible to recognize him even in our sinful state. He brought his salvation so close to us that we only have to look at Jesus to see Him.
M*W: Jesus TAUGHT that the "key" was eternal life of the spirit. To attain this state we must be open to the One Spirit of God. There is nothing to be afraid of. Positive spiritual energy was there from the beginning of the Big Bang to beyond the next Big Bang. The One Spirit of God has no beginning and no end. Life may change, but it will ever end.
Compare Jesus' words with
Isaiah 48:12
"Listen to me, O Jacob, Israel, whom I have called: I am he; I am the first and I am the last.
But life for us
does end. We are mortal. You can't just dismiss that as something of no consequence. Life from the Spirit has to come from God.
M*W: The "key" was what Jesus TAUGHT. The lesson is to believe in the One Spirit of God. There are no "gates". There is no "savior." The only "rejection" is the vacuous state of the positive force of energy = God.
Deuteronomy 32:15
Jeshurun [Jeshurun means 'the upright one', that is, Israel] grew fat and kicked; filled with food, he became heavy and sleek. He abandoned the God who made him and rejected the Rock his Savior.
To reject God
is to reject that which gives you life. It leads to more that just a "vacuous state" - it's
fatal. Just believing in the "One Spirit of God" is not enough to know who He is or what He expects from you. Can you say:
"The LORD lives! Praise be to my Rock! Exalted be God, the Rock, my Savior!" (2 Samuel 22:47), or "Praise be to the Lord, to God our Savior, who daily bears our burdens." (Psalm 68:19)
M*W: The only way anyone can have "fruit" is through the force of positive energy. The "fruit" of the One Spirit of God = spiritual energy.
Galatians 5
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
M*W: Let me rephrase: "You can't fake knowing what Jesus TAUGHT...". Building your life on the foundation that Jesus had to die to save you IS the wrong foundation.
The call is to
return to God
by accepting His forgiveness. Jesus is the instrument of that forgiveness. So I base my foundation on the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - my God is no different than theirs: Isaiah 43:11
"I, even I, am the LORD, and apart from me there is no savior". If the God you testify about isn't either, then we should have this common ground to stand on. But if you think Israel were worshipping the wrong God, we will disagree about everything else.
M*W: Eternal life of the spirit = pure positive energy = God. THIS is what Jesus tried to TEACH, but his followers created the myth that Jesus was the savior, but it's the pure positive energy we call God that sustains us and the universe around us.
Please quote me the verses where you get this teaching of Jesus from, so that I can agree with you.
May I ask, if we are by nature divine, then how does our ignorance override it so easily?
Jenyar, I know you mean well, but you are not interpreting correctly what Jesus taught. This is so unfortunate because I know there may be a lot of human beings out there in this world upon whom you have influence. By focusing on Jesus, you are denying the One Spirit of God. The message isn't that complicated. We were created by energy, energy lives through us, energy never dies, therefore, our soul is eternal. Call it God, who cares?
I have my life in the Spirit, but it cannot remain there. It has to overflow with fruit of his Spirit, God's Spirit. So don't worry, even though our approaches differ, the outcome should be the same.
I care that you equate our soul with God in the same breath. The consequences of God having a separate will from ours is of overwhelming significance, and I want to be clear whether you believe that or not.