Nomophobia. Do you have it?

[wynn]

Indeed, much of an animal's regard for us comes from the fact that they associate us with food, shelter and security.

Do they really make that association?
Or is this our projection?

I teach animals, wynn, by the use of psychology, affection, special food rewards and positive reinforcement.

This is how you, and many others explain it - but this isn't necessarily what actually goes on.

From observing feral horses in a natural setting, it has been determined that they are a hierarchy species, and they continue to demonstrate this behavior despite all these generations of domestication.

Rather than ascribing a hierarchical nature to a species, we can also see it all in terms of beings establishing hierarchical relationships as such.

If a human would be sheepish enough, the horses would dominate the human. This readily happens to dog owners.

As long as the human is consistent and trustworthy, most horses are quite content to follow a leader.

I don't think this has much to do with horses as such, but rather with the nature of the relationship.

Humans are largely inconsistent and unpredictable and for this reason many people encounter behavior problems with their horses. Horses expect consistency and will question the conduct of humans who send mixed signals.

So do dogs. And other humans. And other animals.





Look, I don't doubt that in human terms, you are good with horses.
But I question the very basis of domesticating animals as such, and I question the way people usually talk about their relationships with animals and animal psychology.

I grew up on a farm, and have had animals my whole life. But the language that people usually use when they talk about the psychology of animals, is foreign to me.
I've always relied on intuition in this regard, and I can't remember a time when it was wrong.

 

[scheherazade]

Originally posted by wynn

Look, I don't doubt that in human terms, you are good with horses.
But I question the very basis of domesticating animals as such, and I question the way people usually talk about their relationships with animals and animal psychology.

I grew up on a farm, and have had animals my whole life. But the language that people usually use when they talk about the psychology of animals, is foreign to me.
I've always relied on intuition in this regard, and I can't remember a time when it was wrong.

There is no point in debating you in regard to my relationships to my animals as the topic is subjective and you are not witness to them even to form an accurate perception, wynn.

I get the impression that:

1) You question the basis of domesticating animals. (So do others.)

David Suzuki raised an interesting question. Did we domesticate animals or did they select to align with us for the protection we offer? We have been the destruction of many species. Those who have been domesticated have benefited in some regards.

2) You question the way that people talk about their animals.

People have a wide range of experience with animals and the language they use is likewise very broad. I find most of it quite interesting except those who use 'baby talk' when speaking to or about an animal. I can't stand the 'mommie's little poopsie-woopsie' chatter. uke:

3) The language of the psychology of animals is foreign to you.

This is the most interesting part to me and I look for evidence of intelligence and reasoning in the species I work with and observe that not all is conditioned response. At least some horses and dogs seem to be capable of evaluating and integrating many aspects of their experience and then introducing novel behaviors which seem to have purpose.

4) You trust your intuition and can't remember when it was wrong.

Likewise, I trust my own intuition, so either we are both 'right' or one of us is 'wrong', yet as such labels are merely subjective perspectives, we can eliminate the evaluation as being unrelated to the topic.

 

[scheherazade]

Actually, we have wandered a fair ways from the topic, but it is my thread and I was the one who introduced the comparison of the herd bound mentality comparison between cell phone addicts and equine separation anxiety.

That we even have to introduce unenforceable laws against the use of these devices while driving should be a wake-up call and evidence that these devices and their use are creating serious ripples in our society.

People are getting killed by these harmless looking little devices.

It wouldn't bother me a whit if it was the device user. Their choice to live and die by the sword.

It rather aggravates me that at best, they leave other people to pick up the slack in their workload and at worst, they get innocent people injured or killed. :bugeye:

 

[gmilam]

I've always relied on intuition in this regard, and I can't remember a time when it was wrong.

Must be tough being enlightened.

 

[wynn]

There is no point in debating you in regard to my relationships to my animals as the topic is subjective and you are not witness to them even to form an accurate perception, wynn.

Do you notice that in the way you talk about animals (and humans), the locus of control is placed into you? How typically humanly self-serving.


Now, to bring this on topic, the locus of control is an interesting concept that can quickly help explain how "nomophobia" comes to be: when people are placing the locus of control outside of themselves, on other people, events, things or places, that makes those people depend on them, to the point of becoming anxiously attached to them. The mobile phone and the way such people use it is a more physical expression of this attachment.

 

[wynn]

Must be tough being enlightened.

Not if one actually is enlightened.

 

[scheherazade]

Do you notice that in the way you talk about animals (and humans), the locus of control is placed into you? How typically humanly self-serving.

From my perspective, almost everything people do is self serving. Even when they appear to working in the service of others, it is because there is also some personal benefit.

Those who balance the give and take are working in accord with nature, IMO. Those who take more than they give upset the balance.

Now, to bring this on topic, the locus of control is an interesting concept that can quickly help explain how "nomophobia" comes to be: when people are placing the locus of control outside of themselves, on other people, events, things or places, that makes those people depend on them, to the point of becoming anxiously attached to them. The mobile phone and the way such people use it is a more physical expression of this attachment.

Those who seem anxious or compulsive where cell phone use is concerned have given over control of their life to others. It's rather sad to watch formerly competent people going off the deep end because of this technology. :bugeye:

Whatever....people will do as they will do and they best I can hope to accomplish is to stay out of the way when the tail rotor comes off. :shrug:

 

[wynn]

. It's rather sad to watch formerly competent people going off the deep end because of this technology.

My point all along has been that it is not the technology that is at fault, but psychological factors.
The technology, in this case mobile phones, just seems to make it easier to exploit those psychological factors.

 

[Stoniphi]

Not if one actually is enlightened.

Outside, looking in.

 

[wynn]

Outside, looking in.

Yeah, must be tough being enlightened!

 

[scheherazade]

My point all along has been that it is not the technology that is at fault, but psychological factors.
The technology, in this case mobile phones, just seems to make it easier to exploit those psychological factors.

I agree that the technology is not at fault, as it is a very useful tool.

My concern is that it is being marketed with an express eye to exploiting human nature. The pricing structures are very inviting, often even offering free phones, while binding people to lengthy contracts and then charging exorbitant fees when they exceed the amount of usage that is included with their plan.

As with credit cards, those who use them responsibly reap many benefits, while those who fall astray have serious consequences to contend with.

In this case, as the statistics of accidents are indicating, it is not only the users of these devices who may suffer those consequences.

 

[Stoniphi]

Yeah, must be tough being enlightened!

To the contrary, enlightenment makes one's life easier. It is the path to enlightenment that is difficult. Try it some time.