Black holes do not exist

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by Luchito, Mar 3, 2021.

  1. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Pure rubbish.

    Why do you just make stuff up like that?
     
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  3. river

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    And Gravity pulls everything to it , the black-hole is ultimate gravity puller , where not even light can escape .
     
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  5. river

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    • Please do not troll. If you cannot support a claim, you ought to retract it and apologise to your readers.


    Its a logical conclusion , based on what the black-hole should do , if actually at the centre of our and any Galaxy .

    I don't make it up , I think about it . Then come to a conclusion . Nobody has shown that my thinking is wrong , so far .
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  7. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Moderator note: river has been warned for trolling.

    There is a limit to the amount of useless rubbish dressed as science that we will tolerate on this forum.

    river is already excluded from posting to our Science sections. He is now repeating the same behaviour that earned him that exclusion in other subforums. This will not be tolerated. The policy point here is that sciforums is a forum that has respect for science and the scientific method. While we allow discussion of pseudoscientific ideas, for the purposes of education, that does not extend to providing a platform for knowingly and dishonestly disseminating misinformation.

    Due to accumulated warning points, river will be taking a break from sciforums.
     
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  8. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Scientists found another one

    Scientists Discover Enormous Black Hole Right Near Our Galaxy

    The newly discovered black hole, dubbed Leo I, is roughly the same size as the suspected black hole at the center of the Milky Way

    https://futurism-com.cdn.ampproject...3163009&csi=0&referrer=https://www.google.com

    Nearly didn't post because the words "suspected black hole at the center of the Milky Way" might give comfort to Luchito

    But what the hell

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  9. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    If gravity "pulls everything into it" why has our Sun not pulled all the planets in to itself?
     
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  10. Janus58 Valued Senior Member

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    I have shown you to be wrong, but as per usual, you just won't listen.
    Gravitational red/blue-shift is caused by a difference in gravitational potential between source and receiver. A light source higher in a gravity well will be be seen shifted toward the blue by someone lower.
    The only thing that makes a black hole special in this respect is that it has such a small radius that our observer can be placed so much lower in the gravity well and into a region where they would see an extreme blue-shift for light coming from further away.
    For distant observers, it makes no difference . As long as they are "outside" of the mass, it doesn't matter if the mass is compressed to a black hole, or fills the whole volume "under" their feet. An observer 7000 km from the center of the Earth would see the same blue-shift in light being "pulled" to the Earth whether or not the Earth maintain its present size, or had been compressed to the size of an black hole of equal mass, as their gravitational potential with respect to the universe will not have changed.

    Gravitational potential relies on just two things; The mass of the gravity source, and your distance from that source.
    For the solar system, the mass is the total of all the "stuff" closer to the center of the galaxy then we are, and the distance is our distance from the center of the galaxy. And, like the Earth example, it doesn't matter how that mass is compact at the center or spread out over the whole volume, it results in the same observed blue-shift seen at the solar system for light coming from the opposite direction to the center. And while the mass of the central black hole contributes to that, its mass of 4 million solar masses, makes up only a tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of it.

    In addition, the distance of the solar system from the center plays it's part. The Earth is far enough from the center that even with the immense mass of the galaxy contributing to it, the difference in its gravitational potential and that of extra-galactic space just isn't very big, any is too small to cause a noticeable blue-shift in light coming from outside the galaxy.

    As far as your just "thinking about it" goes. You never learn enough about the subject at hand for that to produce a valid conclusion. You skim the surface of the subject and then jump to wild and erroneous conclusions based on that shallow grasp.

    There is a term in computer science "GIGO", it stands for "garbage in, garbage out. It basically means that the answer a computer can produce can only be as accurate as the data it starts with. Feed it garbage data, and you'll get a garbage answer.

    The problem is that you never start with enough "good data" for your "thinking about it" to lead to a valid conclusion. On top of that, as far as I can tell, you aren't even good about the "thinking about it" part.
     
  11. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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  12. Luchito Registered Senior Member

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    First, before all, you are not explaining how the small compressed collapsed star was capable to form such a strong gravity to accumulate the 4 million solar masses size with the corresponded "pulling force".

    You say that gravitational potential leans on the mass of the source and the distance of the other bodies.

    A solitary new collapsed star if way far away from stars and galaxies. The insignificant presence of that collpsed star won't accomplish such task of perturbing any solar system around, and disturbing an entire galaxy is less than probable. Distance will impede the collapsed star to even be noticeable.

    All the images created with computer simulation show huge black holes with powerful gravitational pulling, but in reality a collpased star has more chances of being pulled by another star and become part of it than the collapsed star pulling at least a meteor passing close to it.

    Distance is what was forgotten when the black holes story was invented.

    The situation is that you can't see it. I don't know why you follow a theory that never explains the basic.

    If you talk about numbers all the time, then I ask you, you have a star 50 times the size of the sun. What are the chances for that star to become a black hole one day if collapses in accord with the theory. Calculate the end of its size after the collapsing. With that tiny body in space, explain how is going to approach other bodies located trillions of trillions of trillions of trillions... of miles away, in order to start pulling them.

    It is not as "easy"as the propaganda says, but on the contrary, when you start to make your calculations you will end saying black holes is just pure story tale.
     
  13. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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  14. river

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  15. river

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    Where is the scientific data , photo ?

    And what Telescopic Observatory , of the night sky , took it ?
     
  16. origin Heading towards oblivion Valued Senior Member

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    Are you serious?

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    I think the picture was taken by aliens in their UFO and sent to their QANON friends.
     
  17. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    That is merely an artist's rendering. There's no photos of this phenom.

    It's all in the form of data anyalysis, in a paper.

    No photos. Modern astronomy is way beyond photos.
     
  18. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    And the aliens were resting at a coffee shop in NT Australia when they photographed the Jesus UFO in the UFO thread

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  19. river

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    Thanks for the honesty . But as I thought . Being paying more attention to the kind of image lately .
     
  20. river

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    Hubble takes them all the time . One segment at a time until it builds a full image . So where is the Hubble Image , or as said the Observatory Image , based on the Scientific data ?
     
  21. Janus58 Valued Senior Member

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    The Hubble has a resolution of 1/20 of an arc-sec. At the distance of these black holes, the largest of them has a angular size of ~ 1/4,500,000 of a arc-sec, 1/225000 the size of what the Hubble could resolve as a single object. Why don't you learn to spend just a little bit of time looking things up to see if it is even remotely reasonable before blurting out such things?
     
  22. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    By being in the center of a galaxy with millions of other stars all around it. Here out in our spiral arm, the closest star is 4 light years away. In the center of the galaxy, stars are 100 times closer. Over time (billions of years) stars collide, merge and become more and more massive. Eventually they burn out and collapse - and become black holes. Then THEY merge since there's not much radial velocity keeping them apart, which we have out here.

    We observed one such merger on May 21, 2019. The advanced LIGO detector detected a merger of two massive black holes. One was ~60 times the mass of the sun, the other was ~80 times. So we know it happens.
    Exactly. But a black hole in the center of the galaxy will have a much stronger influence on stars very close to it.
    Very high. Stars with more than three times the mass of our Sun have a high likelihood of becoming a black hole.
    It pulls on everything. Us, nearby stars, far away stars. It pulls much more strongly on nearer stars.

    Again, in the center of the galaxy, stars aren't trillions of miles apart. They are mere billions. Even so, it takes billions of years for such black holes to significantly influence them.
    By all means post your calculations.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2021
  23. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    Here is the problem with your request. Can you have a calculation for something you claim does not exist

    https://plus.maths.org/content/maths-minute-black-holes

    Extract

    Suppose you are sitting on the surface of an extremely dense spherical body with a very large mass

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    and a very small radius

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    . The gravitational force holding you to the body’s surface, according to Newton, has magnitude

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    where

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    is your own mass. Now since

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    is very large and

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    is very small,

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    in turn is very large. The body exerts a huge gravitational pull, and to escape its clutches you’d need to accelerate away from it very hard indeed

    Better to explain away the calculation formula of observed black holes, ie what other ??? sitting where ??? is sitting gives the above formula

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