We never went to the moon.

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FatFreddy said:
The movement is perfectly consistent with its having been hit with a wall of air.
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The large movement after the astronaut has passed seems quite obviously to be from the astronaut brushing the bottom corner, hence the motion of the flag is most pronounced there rather than any noticeable rippling across the length of the flag that would have resulted from a "wall of air".

Further, the extended motion of the flag seems to be significant evidence of the action taking place in a vacuum, for which the largest ever built (i.e. the Space Power Facility in Ohio) seems rather small for the activities captured on film purporting to be of the moon landings.

Given the preponderance of evidence that the technology existed to send men to the moon, it seems to me that it would be far harder to fake the landings, requiring far more people to keep secret about it (including the Russians) than it would be to have actually put a man on the moon. And that is without the photographic evidence of men having actually been on the moon (e.g. the instruments, the base of the lunar module, the rover, the tracks they took etc). Or without any of the other evidence that others have mentioned.

Believing that men have not walked on the moon seems to me to be a childish fancy, having no place in serious discussion. It seems to me to be only those who have stepped beyond the realms of reasonable into unreasonable skepticism, or those who are looking to draw attention to themselves, that tread the path.
 
The large movement after the astronaut has passed seems quite obviously to be from the astronaut brushing the bottom corner, hence the motion of the flag is most pronounced there rather than any noticeable rippling across the length of the flag that would have resulted from a "wall of air".
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This video shows that the flag had already started moving before he got close enough to touch it.

Initial Apollo 15 Flag Movement


He wasnn't moving fast enough to cause rippling - just fast enough to make it move.


Further, the extended motion of the flag seems to be significant evidence of the action taking place in a vacuum, for which the largest ever built (i.e. the Space Power Facility in Ohio) seems rather small for the activities captured on film purporting to be of the moon landings.
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The angle of the movement is so slow that the dampening effect of the atmosphere is negligible.

This video shows that the flag movement is consistent with atmosphere.

windyz.wmv


Given the preponderance of evidence that the technology existed to send men to the moon, it seems to me that it would be far harder to fake the landings, requiring far more people to keep secret about it (including the Russians) than it would be to have actually put a man on the moon.
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You're not considering the space-radiation factor.
http://waronyou.com/forums/index.php?topic=26317.0


All we know about what was happening with the Russians is just official version stuff. What was happening behind the scenes might have been very different.

http://libcom.org/history/articles/cold-war-1940-1989?quicktabs_1=0
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On the domestic front, the Cold War helped the Soviet Union entrench its military-bureaucratic ruling class in power, and it gave the US a way to compel its population to subsidise high-tech industry. It isn't easy to sell all that to the domestic populations. The technique used was the old stand-by-fear of a great enemy.
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http://www.nardwuar.com/vs/bill_kaysing/index.html
(excerpt)
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Well, why did they keep faking the Apollo flights, I still don't understand. Did the Soviet Union know it was faked? Why did they keep shut up if they knew it was faked? 'Cause a lot of people would think they kept the moon race going to prove the U.S. was better than the Soviet Union. If the Soviet Union knew, why did they let the U.S. get away with this?
Well, I'll tell you - at the highest levels there is a coalition between governments. In other words, the Soviets said, if you won't tell on us - and they faked most of their space exploration flights - we won't tell on you. It's as simple as that. See, what Apollo is, is the beginning of the end of the ability of the government to hoodwink and bamboozle and manipulate the people. More and more people are becoming aware in the U.S. that the government is totally and completely public enemy number one.
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http://www.apfn.org/apfn/moon.htm
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The Soviets, with their own competing moon program and an intense economic and political and military rivalry with the USA, could be expected to have cried foul if the USA tried to fake a Moon landing. Theorist Ralph Rene responds that shortly after the alleged Moon landings, the USA silently started shipping hundreds of thousands of tons of grain as humanitarian aid to the allegedly starving USSR. He views this as evidence of a cover-up, the grain being the price of silence. (The Soviet Union in fact had its own Moon program).
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https://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=moonfaker+cold+war&aq=f

And that is without the photographic evidence of men having actually been on the moon (e.g. the instruments, the base of the lunar module, the rover, the tracks they took etc). Or without any of the other evidence that others have mentioned.
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It's all fakable and also full of anomalies.
 
FF is simply a conspiracy nut. There's no amount of logic or evidence which will convince him. Conspiracy nuts are simply sick, and are not amenable to reason. They believe what they believe and that's all there is to it.
 
AlexG said:
FF is simply a conspiracy nut. There's no amount of logic or evidence which will convince him. Conspiracy nuts are simply sick, and are not amenable to reason. They believe what they believe and that's all there is to it.
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Why don't address some of the actual points made? Do you think the astronaut touched the flag and made it move?
 
There have been no points made, just the repetition of the same tired claims made and rebutted for 45 years.
 
AlexG said:
FF is simply a conspiracy nut. There's no amount of logic or evidence which will convince him. Conspiracy nuts are simply sick, and are not amenable to reason. They believe what they believe and that's all there is to it.
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Spot on!
All probably driven by their desire to be noticed and talked about. Being a nobody has its affects on some people in rather dramatic ways.
As is the case with the other conspiracy nuts and the anti mainstream science nuts, they have no other outlet to sprout their nonsense, except on forums such as this.
With these particular kind of weirdos, I often wonder if they will be continuing to preach their nonsense when we finally land on Mars.:rolleyes:
 
FF is a true conspiracy nutcase. The moon landings seem to be just the tip of his obsessions..
 
The movement that is claimed to be exposed in the video with the triumphal music looks like it could be due to movement of the camera to me. Alternatively, it could well be due to ground vibration as the astronaut approached the flag. Another possibility is that the flag was vibrating in a pattern of gradually increasing and decreasing oscillations along different parts of the flag (kind of like a "beat" between two waves).

FatFreddy said:
Are you saying it was ground vibration? If that had been the case, the pole and support rod would have moved and that would have caused the flag to move.
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Yep.

Movement of the pole and support rod obviously wasn't what made the flag move.
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Not obvious to me.
 
="James R, post: 3333751, member: 4402"]The movement that is claimed to be exposed in the video with the triumphal music looks like it could be due to movement of the camera to me. Alternatively, it could well be due to ground vibration as the astronaut approached the flag. Another possibility is that the flag was vibrating in a pattern of gradually increasing and decreasing oscillations along different parts of the flag (kind of like a "beat" between two waves).


Yep.


Not obvious to me.
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You're seeing what you want to see. If the pole had shaken side to side making the flag move, there would have been noticable movement of the flag where it connects to the pole and rod. There was none.


There's more on the flag.

This video shows that the flag movement is consistent with atmosphere.
(00:50 and 1:50 time marks)

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=MoonFaker:+The+Flags+Are+Alive
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=MoonFaker:+Flagging+The+Dead+Horses
 
FatFreddy said:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=MoonFaker: Flagging The Dead Horses
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Freddy my dear chap, you are nothing more than an obese fraud that is yearning for some attention like most conspiracy theorists.
You claiming continually we did not land on the Moon, will not change the undeniable proven fact that we did land on the Moon, and as most level headed folk accept. :shrug:
In essence you are no different from some of our fanatically religious nuts, preaching their evangelistic nonsense, in the hope of gaining some gullible, impressionable convert.
 
FatFreddy said:
You're seeing what you want to see. If the pole had shaken side to side making the flag move, there would have been noticable movement of the flag where it connects to the pole and rod. There was none.


There's more on the flag.

This video shows that the flag movement is consistent with atmosphere.
(00:50 and 1:50 time marks)

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=MoonFaker:+The+Flags+Are+Alive
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=MoonFaker:+Flagging+The+Dead+Horses
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You're seeng what you want to see.
 


http://debunking-a-moron.blogspot.co.uk/

Now, if the spam by numbers trolling is accurate, we get the ad hominem about the video and blog maker who is obviously "discredited" because of an equally moronic conspiracy theory about the Chinese spacewalk -

http://debunking-a-moron.blogspot.co.uk/2011/07/chinese-spacewalks-part-1.html

I wonder if he has posted his trotting by the cloth claim yet? If so, perhaps he can furnish us with an example online followed by an explanation for his "wall of air".

Apollo 15 flag debunked to death -

http://debunking-a-moron.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/apollo-15-flag.html

/THREAD
 
Now, if the spam by numbers trolling is accurate, we get the ad hominem about the video and blog maker who is obviously "discredited" because of an equally moronic conspiracy theory about the Chinese spacewalk -

http://debunking-a-moron.blogspot.co.uk/2011/07/chinese-spacewalks-part-1.html
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The proof that the Chinese spacewalk was faked is too clear to obfuscate.
http://www.politicalforum.com/showthread.php?t=362999&page=2&p=1064028979#post1064028979

There is a point at which things are so clear that sophistry becomes ineffective. No objective truth-seeker would maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real.
 
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