Denial of Evolution VII (2015)

billvon said:
EVERYTHING - from the color of our skins to our religions to our flags to our heritage to our sexual mores to where we were born to our accent to our clothing - gives us reason to attack and exploit other members of our species. Money is hardly unique in that regard.
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No, but it gives us a remote interest in taking from others. I can be a thousand, five thousand miles from another man and if I can use my money to get what I want from him, I might. And then add in the biases and interests of a thousand around me, and the people they answer to and speak for. The newspapers - who sell us truth, the best selling kind. Industry, that struggles to keep afloat as our system converts and perverts itself to satisfy the needs of profit. And our officials, who redistribute - but not too fast. And they can be paid, too. A nation awash in enough resources to feed and clothe all and all of it dictated by money. All the things you mention we could do without it, I suspect. I understand what you're saying, bill: I just see it as a tool for the slow suffocation of the masses and I think we've all fooled ourselves as to what we can't accomplish.

Anyway, Happy Friday. If I'm still here next Friday I'll write you a longer screed.
 
GeoffP said:
No, but it gives us a remote interest in taking from others.
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No, greed gives us an interest in taking from others. That happens with or without money.
I can be a thousand, five thousand miles from another man and if I can use my money to get what I want from him, I might.
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Right. And similarly, you can be five thousand miles from a starving family and use your money to save their lives.
And then add in the biases and interests of a thousand around me, and the people they answer to and speak for.
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Sounds like that's an issue with biases, not money.
All the things you mention we could do without it, I suspect.
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We would replace it with something that was equivalent. You could call it anything you want; it would still, effectively, be money. All the systems that have tried to discard a medium of exchange have failed.
I understand what you're saying, bill: I just see it as a tool for the slow suffocation of the masses and I think we've all fooled ourselves as to what we can't accomplish.
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What can't we accomplish?
 
Please do not insult other members.
Walter L. Wagner said:
Our ancestors survived just fine all previous asteroid impacts. Ergo, we are here. That's not to say it wasn't problematic for other species and their ancestors. So the risk of "everything" being dead from an asteroid seems very miniscule. Fossil fuel burning is a bigger worry. or the LHC.
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Tell that to the dinosaurs. Foiled by a comet from the sky. The LHC belongs to your set of worries. Idiotwind.
 
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billvon said:
No, greed gives us an interest in taking from others. That happens with or without money.

Right. And similarly, you can be five thousand miles from a starving family and use your money to save their lives.

Sounds like that's an issue with biases, not money.

We would replace it with something that was equivalent. You could call it anything you want; it would still, effectively, be money. All the systems that have tried to discard a medium of exchange have failed.

What can't we accomplish?
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Finding the will to act like you think we are.
 
I'm sure to touch off another firestorm here: the above sounded a touch 'individual'. Let's veer away a little. Address the ideas, not the speaker. Only a suggestion.
 
GeoffP said:
I'm sure to touch off another firestorm here: the above sounded a touch 'individual'. Let's veer away a little. Address the ideas, not the speaker. Only a suggestion.
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There wasn't anything personal. Bilvon asked what can't we accomplish and I said finding the will to act like you think we are. The ...... like you think we are ....... refers to my opinion that Bilvons analysis of the state of humanity is more positive than my own.
 
brucep said:
Finding the will to act like you think we are.
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Right. We can do almost whatever we want to do. We just have to want to do it. That's not a problem with money, or with technology, or with politics; it is a much more basic issue with people.
 
That's not a problem with money, or with technology, or with politics; it is a much more basic issue with people.
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They seem to be significantly political, these problems - I'm not sure one can separate people from their politics so cleanly.
 
brucep said:
There wasn't anything personal. Bilvon asked what can't we accomplish and I said finding the will to act like you think we are. The ...... like you think we are ....... refers to my opinion that Bilvons analysis of the state of humanity is more positive than my own.
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Righty-o. I hate to see fights break out, so I jumped in a little unnecessarily. Sorry.
 
iceaura said:
They seem to be significantly political, these problems - I'm not sure one can separate people from their politics so cleanly.
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To do that cleanly you'd need to decapitate most of us. The intellectual dishonesty runs rampid in the human race. It's all about getting what we want regardless how it plays out. What's going on in the U.S. Congress, U.S. Politics, is an attempt to establish an oligarchy to replace democracy. Why we allow such nonsense is beyond my pay grade. I think the case can be made that we have seditionists in the U.S. Congress.
 
okay for a second let's think that evolution doesn't exist, but then on what is systematics based on, phylogeny is an inseparable part of systematics. Our DNA matches with that of monkey to a large extent. This is only possible when something has evolved. We have homologous organs. We're so similar only some changes came . This is evolution
 
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